Does love come back/what do I do

[helplesshopeless]

Nc for this.

Advice needed please, I've created a huge mess and can't see a way out/what is for the best. This may be long.

I am married with a 3yo. DH has always had a nasty temper, I've suggested anger management counselling numerous times but to no avail. The last few years since having my child have been really difficult. He's generally spoken to me with contempt and disdain a lot of the time, with occasional temper flashes, arguments are always toxic, things could get very nasty (never physical). On a day to day basis we would be civil enough to eachother, but nasty looks and snappiness from him were definitely daily as well, with bigger flare ups fairly regularly. We have had happy family times too and we both dote on our child.

All of this treatment from my DH culminated in my withdrawing from him and ultimately having an affair the last few months, with someone who made me feel loved and cared for. It was mainly an emotional affair but there was a small amount of physical contact (we did not have sex). This is someone that I work with, so although we're wfh at the moment, he is in team zoom meetings etc.

My DH found everything out last week. He is angry but also devastated. I have never seen him so upset and it has shocked me that he cares that much about me. He has completely woken up to how he's been treating me and is committed to having anger management therapy and working on things with me. I obviously am ashamed of what I have done and there is no excuse for my behaviour, but he does recognise that his treatment of me took me to a place where I was open to someone else. I still can't believe I had an affair because it is so against my morals and I fully deserve to be judged for it.

We are working on things and will get relationship counselling. There's a lot of self esteem issues that my husband struggles with, especially since we had our child as he's felt like he's been stuck on the outside looking in, and he thinks this is why he's been treating me how he has. I do understand this and it makes sense, but it doesn't change how he's treated me in the past and how damaging I have found it.

My husband wants me to leave my work so there's no interaction with the other man. I totally understand his point but am reluctant to do this as I'd then feel trapped.

I want to get back to a happy place with my husband. I don't want to feel trapped with him. I don't know if I can find my way back to loving him, whether all of this is coming too late after years of awful treatment. I accept I have behaved in a disgusting way and deserve all of this fall out, and am so worried about the impact on our child and how I'd manage if we separate. I am also concerned about the impact on my husband if things don't work as he has been explaining how it will crush him and he'd never be able to trust anyone again if we don't manage to work through this.

I just don't know if my heart is in this anymore, I want to be able to be happy with him and love him and our family deserves for me to work on this and fully commit to getting back on track, but I have no idea if I'll ever get back to where I need to be.

I am ashamed to admit I still have feelings for the other guy. I could obviously never be with him anyway so that is irrelevant, but it's clouding my judgement. I need to hear from people who have learnt to love their husbands again. Is that a thing? Will we ever get there?

I still can't believe any of this is happening.

Going back to the counselling- he did not respect the boundary you had put in place, basically.

In terms of focusing on someone else’s welfare above one’s own and putting someone else’s needs first, as a longer term single parent now, and I have been pretty much the sole carer as I was previously, I have been putting other people’s needs and welfare above my own for almost two decades now. Oldest DC is about to leave home. Younger DC still at primary so still needs every day care and attention. So 🤷🏻‍♀️ as a single parent, my needs are pretty much bottom of the pile! Unlike you, possibly as I grew up in a dysfunctional family, and possibly because I already had been walked out on by older DC’s father when she was a baby, I don’t regard it as a need to have two parents living in the same house, but more important to have a lack of abuse, manipulation and control, and to have a peaceful surrounding, mutual respect, consent and choice, as an environment which children can grow up in.

As for ex, he can look after his own needs as a grown man, he had no need to try to impose them on me and indeed on older DC. Can you imagine if someone allows you into their DC’s life and their family life, not treating that with respect but seeking to control and change it all to suit you? To me, that was a no. It took too long to be a no, for all the reasons already articulated on this thread about the untangling of what is going on and coming to grips with the disparity of what was being presented and what was and all the trying to fix, but it was a no.

Anyway, last point, surely a book about what to do when your wife does not love you should be very short. Leave her alone. Make plans for separate lives. Seek counselling to get over your hurt and upset. And then be full of inspirational stories about how men in this position had got on with their lives, done great shared parenting and conquered Mount Everest, or something.

I think the one key thing left for me is that he does not respect my boundaries, as you've said @katysun. Not in a particularly malicious way, but the point about an additional conversation after counselling illustrates that. He does this time and time again when I say I'm done with a conversation or that I need some quiet. It comes back to him not being able to sit in any discomfort with his emotions and having to tackle and deal with whatever he's feeling in the moment.

I feel like I've gone full circle back to my original post - he's changing for the better, but it isn't enough for me anymore and I don't think I can love him

@fantasticbuttocks, you didn't say anything wrong at all! You're right that hopefully any changes he makes will benefit any separation process, and also our relationship going forwards either way. I actually think it's going to help him become a better parent too as he's learning so much about the importance of emotional development.

@loveyourself2020 you're right about not being able to 'unsee' things. Now I've had my eyes opened to his past behaviour and what was going on, I actually feel like I have zero tolerance for any of his normal human aspects of personality that are the slightest bit unpalatable. I have certain standards that I want in a partner that he won't ever be able to meet. It's a bit like going from being starved of food to expecting a Michelin star dining experience So my bar is so so high now that probably no one will meet expectations!

I hope you are doing another thread helpless?

@KatySun

Going back to the counselling- he did not respect the boundary you had put in place, basically.

In terms of focusing on someone else’s welfare above one’s own and putting someone else’s needs first, as a longer term single parent now, and I have been pretty much the sole carer as I was previously, I have been putting other people’s needs and welfare above my own for almost two decades now. Oldest DC is about to leave home. Younger DC still at primary so still needs every day care and attention. So 🤷🏻‍♀️ as a single parent, my needs are pretty much bottom of the pile! Unlike you, possibly as I grew up in a dysfunctional family, and possibly because I already had been walked out on by older DC’s father when she was a baby, I don’t regard it as a need to have two parents living in the same house, but more important to have a lack of abuse, manipulation and control, and to have a peaceful surrounding, mutual respect, consent and choice, as an environment which children can grow up in.

As for ex, he can look after his own needs as a grown man, he had no need to try to impose them on me and indeed on older DC. Can you imagine if someone allows you into their DC’s life and their family life, not treating that with respect but seeking to control and change it all to suit you? To me, that was a no. It took too long to be a no, for all the reasons already articulated on this thread about the untangling of what is going on and coming to grips with the disparity of what was being presented and what was and all the trying to fix, but it was a no.

Anyway, last point, surely a book about what to do when your wife does not love you should be very short. Leave her alone. Make plans for separate lives. Seek counselling to get over your hurt and upset. And then be full of inspirational stories about how men in this position had got on with their lives, done great shared parenting and conquered Mount Everest, or something.

Great post.

I have absolutely no doubt that a single parent can rear happy well rounded individuals.

I think a happy single parented home is ALWAYS preferably to an angst ridden house with two deeply unhappy people or an abusive dynamic. Any day.

Two of my children have close friends where there is a single parent due to the death of a mother and father in each case.

Both the remaining parents have done an incredible job, at huge cost to them I have no doubt, to ensure their children have thrived despite terrible tragedy, as both parents died very suddenly, within a matter of weeks of being diagnosed.

Successful parenting does not require two parents, however desirable.

Just one parent providing a supportive, nurturing environment can do the job very successfully in my experience.

helplesshopeless he's changing for the better, but it isn't enough for me anymore and I don't think I can love him

This is the crux of the matter isn't it ,and of course for "love" we mean all of those other issues like trust ,respect ,tolerating human failures because we appreciate the whole person ,knowing that our love is reciprocated .

And maybe ,if we weren't taking all the responsibilty for a the breakdown of a relation ship we wouldn't be using phrases like "it isn't enough for me" .We'd be saying that we can't resurrect the love we once had ,it's died .

Looking at just one of the rights on the list" respecting of boundaries"
He pushes all the time.
He refused to leave & give you space.
He pushes for sex
He refused to stop convo after therapy
He wants this sorted now
He pushes you to go away on w/e
He pushes you to look pleasant when you are feeling ill
He pushes for you to change your job
He hassles you when you go out
He muzzles you over who you discuss this with
He is rushing your decision as to whether you "love" him again.
I am certain you can add many more.

I'm pretty sure that anyone that's knows you both would assume that it was an exit affair.

It's incredibly common for women to only pluck up the courage to leave by dipping their toe in the water.

And honestly people go almost no fucks what happens to other peoples marriages. I cannot imagine any of your friends or family imagine that your relationship is a good one.

So if you are staying because of what others think, you are barking up the wrong tree.

So if you are staying because of what others think, you are barking up the wrong tree

It seems that you've not read much of this thread .There's no suggestion that the OP is staying because of what others think,she's agonising over putting her needs over placating what sounds like a very damaged and selfish husband .

Yes @peridito I've read it all. And I disagree that the OP doesn't care what others think. It comes up again and again. People will think it's all her fault because of the affair. Too ashamed to tell her family. His family and friends will blame her because of the affair. It's not the only thing keeping her there but it is certainly playing a part.

"This thread has 984 messages" (at this time of writing) and I hesitate to use up one of the precious remaining few when I can add so little to the wisdom of the fabulous PPs. I just wanted to send you heartfelt empathy, OP. It's a horribly painful position to be in. Your current mental landscape reminds me of those bits in films where the hero/ine has been chased to the edge of a precipice.

Aligning our outer world with our inner world can be excruciatingly difficult, and yet living without doing so is no life at all. Do you think you might actually bring yourself one day to say to him something like "I'm sorry, I really appreciate how hard you're trying, but even if you made twice the effort I have no faith in a future together?" (That's obviously not the way to put it, as losing faith is something a Very Wicked Christian would do and is all your fault and must be fixed by stronger belief system.) As @KatySun and @FantasticButtocks have shrewdly pointed out, that would be the acid test of his newfound respect for you as an autonomous human being and not just the maidservant of his moods.

That Psychology Today article is great, @QuentinBunbury. I wish I'd read it years ago! Mind you, old habits die hard. It is one thing to understand a technique and quite another to actually put it into practice without feeling as though you are violating a fundamental law of Nature...!

I agree, @Wallywobbles, and I think you make a really good point.

OP, I think talking to your parents and sister will help you to get some perspective on that side of things.

Sorry to use up another precious post space!!! At this rate, we're going to run out of space just as OP runs off happily into the arms of OM, and we miss out on wedding invites.

thanks everyone - I will reply properly at some point today (meant to be getting through lots of work!) but going to create a new thread now and attempt to post the link...

ok, I think I've done it... link to new thread here.

Apologies Wallywobbles ,you do have a point .

And I'm now reflecting on why I chose to highlight to myself only one of a number concerns expressed by the OP !

@peridito

Apologies Wallywobbles ,you do have a point .

And I'm now reflecting on why I chose to highlight to myself only one of a number concerns expressed by the OP !

Maybe we remember most vividly the one(s) we can most closely relate to? I'm still hoping we can nudge you gently into making some life changes 😁

Now I've had my eyes opened to his past behaviour and what was going on, I actually feel like I have zero tolerance for any of his normal human aspects of personality that are the slightest bit unpalatable. I have certain standards that I want in a partner that he won't ever be able to meet. It's a bit like going from being starved of food to expecting a Michelin star dining experience grin So my bar is so so high now that probably no one will meet expectations!
Might it be that now you have recognised some of his major issues, you find him offputting as a whole, including some less important niggles, simply as it is part of the same package? When you fall in love, you feel as if love everything about that person, including the silly tuft of hair on the top of their head. When you fall out of love, you want to chop that bloody tuft of hair off with the garden shears.

Someone who is considerate is not a Michelin-starred meal; it's your basic five a day.

"Maybe we remember most vividly the one(s) we can most closely relate to"

I know Alcemeg,oh I know .

@Wallywobbles

Yes *@peridito* I've read it all. And I disagree that the OP doesn't care what others think. It comes up again and again. People will think it's all her fault because of the affair. Too ashamed to tell her family. His family and friends will blame her because of the affair. It's not the only thing keeping her there but it is certainly playing a part.

I agree with you on this.

Fear of being the one who looks to be at fault if the marriage breaks up, fear that this is how he will present it to the world... because "affair" is a tangible crime. But what he's been doing for years is not! Because you'd have had to actually be in this marriage to understand the intricacies of the impact of that.

So a fear that the world will say ah their marriage is over, because she had an affair.

It takes a lot of work and courage to get to the stage of not giving a shit what anyone else might think.

@FantasticButtocks Exactly this. What the OP has done (and also what I have done) is a tangible crime, as you say, and this will be held against us forever. But everything our DHs have done over the course of years and years goes utterly unnoticed by everyone but us, and he's off the hook because of what we've done. My counsellor said to me, maybe you will reach the point where you realise it doesn't matter who's at fault, you just need to make it come to an end. But yes, it is hard to feel like you're letting people down and worrying that people have changed their good opinion of you.

@19Bears I'd agree with all of that bit except this:
But everything our DHs have done over the course of years and years goes utterly unnoticed by everyone but us

I bet it hasn't... 😉

You're right @Alcemeg All of my family and my friends can see it, and my boys. It's his family who don't see it, as they're so far away.

In the final throes of my marriage, I confided in a friend and what really shocked her was that I wanted to compare notes on things I thought I'd been imagining for years.

You can imagine her response -- along the lines of "Of course you weren't fucking IMAGINING any of that!" 😁

I think the "primary loyalty is to DH" thing keeps our lips sealed, but once you can move past that it's surprising what clarity you can achieve.

Of course we share with very few, if we share at all; and some people are reluctant to say what they think in case next week you're right back at his side, standing by your man. They're scared you'll then hate them if they have voiced their true opinion of him.

But if you think about any friends or acquaintances who have divorced, what is your reaction? It is water off a ducks back, & will probably be out of your mind before you've finished your cup of tea, Even if there was an affair, you just assume the "sinner" was not happy enough to remain faithful.
Actually nobody other than your family & close friends will miss a beat...
Not bothered. Not your business, Maybe surprised briefly, a passing shrug .... then forgotten

So true @Mix56 You build it up massively in your mind, but it's all forgotten in no time and everyone moves on. This is my wish. One day I'll get it.

And here endeth this thread. Ta daaaaaaaa!!! all round xx