How to avoid extended contact with sil

[Annoyedmom]

I have one child and one on the way. Sil is single, 2 months pregnant through ivf with a sperm donor.

Sil is entitled. Before we had kids she got upset dh and I got a dog without her because she had visions of choosing from the same litter and going on nightly walks together.

I don’t let sil babysit. I don’t allow alone time and no sleepovers. She has never changed my kids diaper (and has told dh she’s upset with that)

We simply don’t mesh. Whether it was her demanding her own bridesmaid dress for my wedding because she didn’t like the one we chose (she was there when it was chosen), telling me I was ruining her family’s traditions (she is still a part of her original nuclear family. And always will be), to telling me at my baby shower that my baby was part hers and she would be playing a large role (hasn’t happened) I just can’t stand her crybaby attitude and entitlement. She even bought us a photo package and demanded we all wear the same style outfit! She doesn’t know her place.

So now that that’s out of the way. We live close. Maybe 10 mins apart. My main concern is she will expect my husband to play a fatherly role to this child she is bringing into the world and that she will want the cousins to be very close (spending tons of time together, visiting grandparents together, enrolling in same extra curriculars) she is heavily enmeshed with her mother and with our babies being so close in age (3 months apart) I fear this will only get worse.

Questions:

How do I go about addressing my issues with my husband? We separated once over his inability to say no to his family and for allowing them to ruin my PP time with my son

Should we move away? I’ve lived in our city my whole life. I am open to moving if it creates distance. We know the next house we want will have a pool so now I’m worried she will want to come over all the time

How do I create appropriate distance? I’m open to visits twice per month. Nothing more. But sil will push for more and need help as a single mom. I am unwilling to help. She can ask her parents if help is needed. How do I keep to two visits if the kids want to see one another?

My mental health is more important than the relationship between the kids. If contact is consistent and prolonged and they encroach on our family time and act entitled, it will very likely result in a separation for my husband and I. I won’t be put through the same crap we dealt with for two years after the birth of my first.

[quote Annoyedmom]@sssloou

It’s so nice of you to call panic attacks theatrics.

Does your toddler witness you being a doormat for your in-laws? I feel sorry for them being raised by a mother who can’t stand up and protect her nuclear family’s boundaries.

I’ve never had one until we discussed the in-laws. And thank you for strengthening my resolved to distance us even further to get away from them.[/quote]
I feel more sorry for a toddler being raised by a nasty, controlling, emotionally-manipulative mother.

So you are prepared to deprive your DCs of your and your DH by an additional 2hrs and 1hr each and everyday respectively on top of your current commute and working day by moving just because you are unable to calmly and assertively hold your boundaries?

Why would you inflict this on your v young DCs?

You are cutting off your nose to spite your face. What was the emotional regulation like in your home growing up - did you have calm and peaceful parents who modelled gentle constructive assertive behaviours?

@Sssloou

So you are prepared to deprive your DCs of your and your DH by an additional 2hrs and 1hr each and everyday respectively on top of your current commute and working day by moving just because you are unable to calmly and assertively hold your boundaries?

Why would you inflict this on your v young DCs?

You are cutting off your nose to spite your face. What was the emotional regulation like in your home growing up - did you have calm and peaceful parents who modelled gentle constructive assertive behaviours?

What do you think. She can't even emotionally regulate now!

I think someone enjoyed being the bestower of grandchildren and the status and power this gave her in the family ‘better be nice to uptight mctwistyknickers or we won’t get time with the grandkids’ and now the sil is pg her nose is a bit out of joint. Lots of digs in op’s posts at the sil being single, lots of bitterness at how much help her mil will be giving her. And all of this ‘she will want sleepovers’ etc is just an imagined scenario. Op claims the sil is always saying ‘let’s get the kids together this weekend’ but i find it hard to believe given that two of the kids plural are currently unborn foetuses. Could it be, op, that you resent sil for stealing your thunder, and are trying to reject them before they reject you?

For mumsnet admin

Dh and I have made our decision. Thanks for allowing the conversation to unfold - the original question was about putting distance between sil and my family - not a discussion of my overbearing mil and fil. Thanks for deleting my thread and thanks to all who can empathize with wanting privacy as a family.

😂😂😂

@Annoyedmom

For mumsnet admin

Dh and I have made our decision. Thanks for allowing the conversation to unfold - the original question was about putting distance between sil and my family - not a discussion of my overbearing mil and fil. Thanks for deleting my thread and thanks to all who can empathize with wanting privacy as a family.

Yep. Unhinged. Bye 👋🏼 Annoyed mom

What do you think. She can't even emotionally regulate now!

I agree but I don’t need to chastise the OP about this. I have asked the same Q repeatedly of the OP and got no answers. So I have to assume that it is a v uncomfortable answer and that her own upbringing was volatile / neglectful ? She then does not have the emotional development and tools to know how to self regulate so needs therapy to support her achieve these skills. Otherwise she is just going to inadvertently recreate similar tensions in her own home with her own young DCs which they are already experiencing. OP you don’t have to live like this. It doesn’t have to be so torturous and exhausting. You are nearly on the verge of divorce - you have already separated once over this. Get yourself fixed so that you can calmly and assertively manage his family and respectfully collaborate with your DH for all your sakes.

@Sssloou

What do you think. She can't even emotionally regulate now!

I agree but I don’t need to chastise the OP about this. I have asked the same Q repeatedly of the OP and got no answers. So I have to assume that it is a v uncomfortable answer and that her own upbringing was volatile / neglectful ? She then does not have the emotional development and tools to know how to self regulate so needs therapy to support her achieve these skills. Otherwise she is just going to inadvertently recreate similar tensions in her own home with her own young DCs which they are already experiencing. OP you don’t have to live like this. It doesn’t have to be so torturous and exhausting. You are nearly on the verge of divorce - you have already separated once over this. Get yourself fixed so that you can calmly and assertively manage his family and respectfully collaborate with your DH for all your sakes.

Just because she behaves like this doesn't mean she had a neglectful upbringing. There are plenty of people like OP would have had normal upbringing who act like her. Maybe she is use to getting her own way. You can teach yourself at any point how to emotionally regulate. You don't need a perfect upbringing for that.

What have I just read??
Thats 20 mins of my life I will never get back!

@Icanflyhigh

Agreed. The OP hasn't engaged at all, she's just kept repeating herself and mocking anyone who has dared to give an alternative view as being 'doormats'.

Gift boundary? Wth! OP, get a grip, you’re coming across like a crazy control freak

Just remember OP.

You will be a grandmother one day

and

Children are not objects; you do not own them.

Jeez Louise what the fudge did I just read?🤯

Hey OP,
It sounds like there are maybe a lot of details you haven’t got into that have made you feel this way towards your ILs. My MIL would take my very young baby out of the room for ages or shoot off miles ahead with her in the buggy. She would pull the buggy physically out of my hands then zoom off with her. When we met people she knew she wouldn’t introduce me to them as DDs mum. Kept asking me when I was going to stop BFing. If she cried, wouldn’t pass her back to me (which is natural) but would hold on to her for ages then pass her to her husband. It felt like I wasn’t allowed to hold my baby around them (in fact that happened a lot with them passing DD back and forth, not ever giving her back to me when she was still really young and it made me uncomfortable). I just wanted that natural ebb and flow of holding her then passing back to me for a bit. Lots of blocking body language. Just lots of not right stuff that made me very uncomfortable.

I had very bad PNA/PND and I found this incredibly stressful. At the same time I felt like I ‘should’ do this that or the other in terms of visits etc. It was a horrible time and I really struggled to cope. This was off the back of her being rude and critical towards me, my mum, my way of life, other people in the family she didn’t approve of etc. She was really quite unpleasant and cold to me before I got pregnant. There’s too much stuff for me to trust her or feel comfortable with her and so I need to have boundaries in place.

I had counselling/therapy which helped me realise that her behaviour wasn't appropriate and that my feelings and comfort are/is important.

Now my boundaries are a visit at ours once a fortnight, if DP wants to take DD round there the other week that’s fine (so they see DD once a week), I just don’t want to do weekly visits with them (MIL always says something offensive/does something overbearing in terms of my parenting and it causes too much stress). No holidays probably ever (it would be horribly stressful) and no overnights for now. They sometimes babysit. That seems like a reasonable balance to me. Families don’t have to be in each other’s pockets all the time. Great if people get on and it works for you, but that’s not the case for everyone.

I think getting some distance and having worked out reasonable boundaries you stick to is the best way forward. Good luck!

Frankly what your SIL said about it being part her baby I would have found alarming. It

You need to be comfortable and happy. Families don’t need to constantly be in each other’s pockets at the expense of your happiness, sanity or marriage.

@Bellendejour

That sounds frustrating and I'm sorry you went through that. It's not the same to what OP described though. You made a rationale decision to let your DH take your baby to see their grandparents.

Have you actually read all her posts?!

Is this real?

YOU. SOUND. INSANE.

Kind of wonderfully, terrifyingly insane. I'm reading your posts in like a gleeful disbelief. I cant believe you are real! I want to be your friend just so I can follow you around and watch you being terrible and outrageous to people 😂😂

Your SIL does sound like hard work and needy - but you sound very self-absorbed and selfish.
No mention of what your husband/kids would like to do, it's all about what you don't want to do. Lots of people, myself included, would be grateful to be in the position where you have multiple family members taking a keen interest in your child and willing to help with childcare etc. Don't take that for granted.

[quote Annoyedmom]@sssloou

It’s so nice of you to call panic attacks theatrics.

Does your toddler witness you being a doormat for your in-laws? I feel sorry for them being raised by a mother who can’t stand up and protect her nuclear family’s boundaries.

I’ve never had one until we discussed the in-laws. And thank you for strengthening my resolved to distance us even further to get away from them.[/quote]
I didn’t use the word theatrics - I used the word histrionic - which is a medical term for a behaviour trait and a cluster B personality disorder. Any young toddler does not need to see their mother either deflated as a doormat or hyper-aroused and volatile - both are horrifying and terrifying experiences for a baby.

You can learn to self regulate when triggered, you can learn to communicate assertively, calmly and effectively. You might need professional help to achieve this. If you continue like this you will damage the people you love. This is not a healthy or dignified way to live.

Whilst your sil sounds needy, a bit spoilt, a lot of the problems appear to stem from you - it's hardly unreasonable to want to spend time with your brother and his family, and he isn't adverse to this, you want him to make changes to suit your experience of family. If I lived near my sil or cousin I would have seen lots of them when the kids were little, to me that's normal, you seem threatened by their closeness. I would look carefully at your relationship first, honestly it seems she wants to be accepted by you and you are pushing away, she sounds lonely.

I dont think she would care that her SIL seems lonely. Not her problem and nor does she want it to be. There is 0 self reflection demonstrated in any posts.

Honestly, I am not sure that the problem is the OP, but she is not from the UK and has a different style of communicating than you do. I am hearing a lot of language used by the OP that speaks of someone who has spent a lot of time working with a therapist and/or reading up on family dynamics. This is a very American-style way of dealing with things. They are more direct in their approach to confrontation than people born and raised in the UK. The MIL and SIL are pushing boundaries in ways that I have read about on here that have had mumsnetters up in arms and the DH’s lack of a spine when it comes to defending his wife is indefensible. I think the OP has been bullied and abused unnecessarily on here, and most of the PP were far too quick to attack and made no attempt to try and understand what she was saying. You should be ashamed of yourselves. Women come on here for support when they’re down and need a new opinion. You’ve basically stressed her out further and given the typical “Super Snobby Brit” Cliche they have over there more legs to run with.

I must have read a different thread to everyone else because to me it sounds like the ILs are overbearing and manipulative and OP has finally reached her limit! Good luck OP, they sound bonkers.

@ContessaDiPulpo

I must have read a different thread to everyone else because to me it sounds like the ILs are overbearing and manipulative and OP has finally reached her limit! Good luck OP, they sound bonkers.

What a shame you choose to overlook the OP controlling her husband and kids.

If only the tables were reversed, eh.

If you've got unreasonable extended family bullying immediate family, and immediate family not pushing back, I feel like you're not unreasonable to push back for them