Think I may need to choose between ds and dh....

[Dickorydockwhatthe]

I've put many threads on mumsnet about their relationship. Dh and massively ds clash and this has worsened as ds has got older. It has led to some awful rows with me in the middle and even telling dh he's pushing his son away and I may have to choose. Dh is very authoritarian as a parent and doesn't know when to choose his battles which has resulted in ds 16 rebellion, lashing out, having no respect for dh and now wanting to go into Foster care. I've spoken to dh many a times and he's tried but it goes back to how it was. Now ds is 16 and rebelling his authoritarian approach is having no effect because he's so accustomed to dh shouting or getting annoyed nothing works. I feel like I've failed ds massively as he's so anti dh right now and I think I've let him down😔. Dh is a good man in many ways and a good husband. But for some reason he thinks kids should do as they are told and be respectful and ds isn't like that. Ds 2 on the hand is completely different. School are now involved and we are planning to have a family conference for meditation. Ds has expressed he wants to leave. I've looked into leaving dh not because I don't love him but because of the toxic relationship between him and ds. But coming from a broken home myself I felt we could try and work on it as we are a family and ultimately we love each other very much. But I've let ds down and now I may lose him. If I leave dh we have no where to live, I can't afford the mortgage on my own as only work part time and my pay isn't great. I'm financially dependent on dh and have no idea where I stand with raising two children alone. I just feel like this is going to break out family apart and have no idea what to do 🙁

I really wasn’t going to comment again as I don’t want to give your views the time really, but your comments are abhorrent, outdated and if you do work is SS, actually quite dangerous.

I hope the OP has the sense to disregard them and see them as the absolute bull that they are

^^@Cokie3

Whilst I don't agree that anyone is born evil

I dont always think there is a reason why some kids misbehave. Sometimes it is just because they are being naughty.

Separate. Get back together when kids have grown.

You have to end it. There’s no fixing this.

I wonder how much of your ds issues are from your husband choosing his job over his own son for 7 years, so much so that you say he was absent for 7 whole years. That's shitty parenting right there. Then comes in and starts bullying a 7 year old child, while being a terrible husband and father and his mother them just stands by the man who is bullying him.

Your son has nobody in his corner. Have you ever stood up for your son? Or are you scared of your husband too?

@poppyzbrite4 Come back to me when you've worked in the system. You truly have no idea.

@Yellowswan

I really wasn’t going to comment again as I don’t want to give your views the time really, but your comments are abhorrent, outdated and if you do work is SS, actually quite dangerous.

I hope the OP has the sense to disregard them and see them as the absolute bull that they are

I will disregard your viewed as they come from a lack of experience and are thus abhorrent in themselves and in their naivety, the later of which is truly outdated, ignorant and dangerous.

This certainly shows those who have experience with kids and those who have nil experience but a naive, dangerous, outdated idealising notion.

@poppyzbrite4 What are you views on Venables and Thompson, and why? If you have any idea who I am referring to.

[quote Cokie3]@poppyzbrite4 What are you views on Venables and Thompson, and why? If you have any idea who I am referring to.[/quote]
I think you have outdated and dangerous views about very complex situations and it's a good thing that you are no longer working in that area. If you approach a child who is acting out with the idea that they are simply 'born evil' and there are no other factors involved such as neglect, environmental factors or abuse, then it's a joke to call others naive. Some children have special educational needs and yes, some children are difficult to manage. But to say that a child is 'born evil' like a two bit Channel Five presenter, is simply dreadful.

Nothing happens in a vacuum and if you look closely at a situation you'll often find various factors that combine to produce a perfect storm. Do I think the Bulger murderers were 'born evil'? No, I don't.

Thompson's mother was an alcoholic, left alone with seven children after their house burned down. The children were left mostly by themselves in a dysfunctional and chaotic household where there was sibling on sibling abuse including the use of weapons. Is that an excuse for what he did? NO. Plenty of children grown up in chaotic, dysfunctional homes and don't murder toddlers. Did it contribute towards what he did? Yes. He wasn't 'born evil', he was a product of his environment.

OP you clearly love your children 💐 I read all of your posts, not all of the replies. My father is similar to your DH in many ways. He also has an additional abusive streak, physically, financially, verbally. On the outside he's well liked, well situated, achieved a lot etc. A respected person. But he's made our family life hell of which no one knew much about as we were mostly too ashamed to speak out.

I am now in my 30s and expecting a baby of my own. I am NC with my father and I doubt this will ever change as I wish to protect my children from him being unpleasant, harsh and at times abusive.

I will tell you what it did to my relationship with my DM. My mum loves me a lot and I love her too. Sometimes we argued, sometimes we disagreed, but I never doubted the above. I prayed for years that she left this man and she didn't. Now I'm an adult and this is something I'll never forget or forgive, really. She's disappointed me. I told her as a teenager that I'd rather be poor but far away from him. I would have chosen that in a heartbeat then and now. My father has caused untold damage to me, my mum, my nan. To our emotional wellbeing, self-esteem, ability to form and conduct healthy relationships. Your DH is showing awful behavioural patterns to your children and this will stay with them forever. Don't forget that. And they will blame both of you for this, your DH for being the way he is and you for enabling this. There's no easy answer but to say that you need to do the right thing for your children 💐

Kids can be more conniving, scheming and manipulative than some on here think.

A genuinely shocking sentence to read on here.

I don't think any parent will be shocked that children, from toddlerhood up, can be manipulative little shits. That's not the point. The point is that they are still children, they are not fully developed mentally, and it's the parents' job to deal with manipulative behaviours and try to raise a well-balanced functioning member of society. To demonise children for that as beyond redemption, which you seem to be suggesting - especially with your vile, ignorant reference to the Bulger case - is simply awful.

I say this as someone with deep personal knowledge of the social care system. I was in and out of care for several years when younger and believe me, I thought I was being clever and cunning at times when I wanted to get my own way. Looking back it was a symptom of growing up in a deeply unhealthy environment and thankfully I had enough of the right kind of support to end up OK in the end.

And thank fuck I didn't have social workers like you!

@poppyzbrite4 @gannett I find your 'it's ALWAYS something to do with the parents' attitude to be outdated, naive, and quite frankly, very dangerous in it's ignorance. Your type of thinking does far more harm than good. Maybe you shouldn't talk on a topic you clearly know nothing about and stop attacking my truth and my experiences as a worker in the system. It's obvious you don't understand what you are talking about.

[quote Cokie3]**@poppyzbrite4* @gannett* I find your 'it's ALWAYS something to do with the parents' attitude to be outdated, naive, and quite frankly, very dangerous in it's ignorance. Your type of thinking does far more harm than good. Maybe you shouldn't talk on a topic you clearly know nothing about and stop attacking my truth and my experiences as a worker in the system. It's obvious you don't understand what you are talking about.[/quote]
That's called projection sweetie.

Lol so you're gaslighting now? You're the one doing the projecting.....

@Cokie3

Thank God Nurse Ratchet has retired.

@poppyzbrite4 Thank God you never were hired as one.

@Cokie3 I don’t think anymore needs to be said, you’ve proven yourself to be exactly as I first expected, thanks

@PurplePansy05

My father is similar to your DH in many ways. He also has an additional abusive streak, physically, financially, verbally

Ok, so not particularly like this f see ther where there is zero evidence of physical or financial abusie, and the verbal stuff is on the fence as some shouting is 'abuse' and some isn't going to be.

So how you view your abusive father now is totally different from this situation..

It's like saying that you should LTB for glancing at a woman because your husband had an affair. Totally different situations.

My DF was precisely that: authoritarian. He still is. He thinks his children should listen to him at all times, he thinks everything should be done his way, he barks orders at people, never asks questions, listens or accommodates others needs, certainly not before his own. He never saw anything wrong with it and still doesn't. He was also absent throughout the first 10 years of my life.

That in itself was enough for me to hate him. Other stuff followed. So please don't make assumptions as actually what the OP described sounds very similar and it was a beginning of much worse times ahead. Her husband's behaviour may well become even more controlling and aggressive and I do not wish this on her children.

[quote Yellowswan]@Cokie3 I don’t think anymore needs to be said, you’ve proven yourself to be exactly as I first expected, thanks[/quote]
Likewise.