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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Does everyone have a ‘Fuck Off Fund’?

194 replies

Bookaholic73 · 02/01/2021 15:55

I’m curious if most people have a Fuck Off Fund?

It’s an amount of money that you’ve saved that your spouse doesn’t know about, for you to use if/when you divorce/split up.

Or if you’re planning on eventually leaving your spouse but are waiting until you have a big enough FOF to do it.

Someone recently told that this was always worth having, just in case, and I’m seriously tempted.

OP posts:
MsAwesomeDragon · 03/01/2021 10:02

I have my own savings. Dh has his own savings. Either of us could leave and be able to manage until the financial side of the divorce was sorted. He's got more in his savings than I have in mine, because he's the lower earner and would probably be the one who moves out tbh. I would buy him out of this house and hope he had enough to get something for himself.

VodselForDinner · 03/01/2021 10:40

Very happily married here and always make sure I have access to private funds to get me through any situation where I need them. DH also has his own savings account. Neither of us have them specifically for the purposes of leaving the other, but I like having a safety net.

I drive a very lovely newish BMW with full roadside assistance cover, and insurance. I make sure I always have €50 stashed in the glove compartment so that, if something happens, I have enough money to get me off a dark road and into a taxi.

I expect neither my marriage nor my car to breakdown, but knowing that €50 is there puts my mind at ease.

Levirandal · 03/01/2021 10:49

I plan to. I’m due to come into an inheritance and intend to hold some of it back. I work PT in a term time only role as we have kids with special needs I’ve not been able to work as dh and me felt one parent needed to be at home. He has a good pension, I don’t. I’ve already used some inheritance for our house but I know if I chose to leave he would be incredibly difficult and I want to have something I can access. I don’t plan on going anywhere but you never know what life will throw at you.

ThisTooShallBe · 03/01/2021 10:56

@Levirandal I would seriously consider using some of your inheritance to top up your pension and NI contributions too, the tax relief (assuming you’re UK) makes it a no-brainer

Bluntness100 · 03/01/2021 10:58

I genuinely don’t understand why anyone would not strive to do the same. Same reason people get judgy about pre nups- they think its not romantic or that you dont really love the person which is such a load of rubbish

I think it’s deeper than that, there is a constant stream of threads on here from women who give up work to look after their child, becayse that’s what they want to do, and they don’t wish to go back to work either.

Not the ones who have to, but the ones who want to, the whole “I didn’t have kids to have someone else raise them” brigade. And will have their partner financially support them. Then when it goes horribly wrong they need to cling on because they have no money and no way to support themselves. They often don’t even have their names on the house deeds. Have no savings. Rely on money they get from the partner.

Nearly every single thread, somewhere buried in it, is “I’ve got no money”.

roseblossom2020 · 03/01/2021 11:57

Im very interested in this. How does a FoF work if you’re married? Dont you have to disclose it if you divorce and then you lose it?

MrsTerryPratchett what sort of financial literacy did you teach? And any advice? I desperately wish this was something we had in schools. We never got anything in the way of that and my parents never taught me much so I’ve had to learn and pick stuff up from mumsnet but it’s a bit frightening about how much you don’t know and how vulnerable you can be.

VodselForDinner · 03/01/2021 13:02

Im very interested in this. How does a FoF work if you’re married? Dont you have to disclose it if you divorce and then you lose it?

A divorce will take in to account assets such as money and property so yes, funds would be taken into account for a split.

However, there’s usually a significant period of time between a marriage ending and a divorce settlement. Having money gives a woman (or man) who needs to leave a marriage the ability to check into a hotel, call a taxi, but a plane/train ticket, put down a deposit on a rental property, pay for childcare, pay for training to re-enter the workforce etc.

A divorce settlement won’t take in to account money retrospectively spent on living costs.

ThisTooShallBe · 03/01/2021 13:25

In my experience the problem with financial literacy education initiatives is that they get outsourced (hijacked) by high street banks so in the end they are just opportunities to get young people to sign up for bank accounts.

Really recommend browsing Martin Lewis’ Money Saving Expert site. Each week there are headline ‘best buys’ etc but behind that are some stonking analyses of how to manage your money and make big decisions.

SpongeBobJudgeyPants · 03/01/2021 13:26

@VodselForDinner

Im very interested in this. How does a FoF work if you’re married? Dont you have to disclose it if you divorce and then you lose it?

A divorce will take in to account assets such as money and property so yes, funds would be taken into account for a split.

However, there’s usually a significant period of time between a marriage ending and a divorce settlement. Having money gives a woman (or man) who needs to leave a marriage the ability to check into a hotel, call a taxi, but a plane/train ticket, put down a deposit on a rental property, pay for childcare, pay for training to re-enter the workforce etc.

A divorce settlement won’t take in to account money retrospectively spent on living costs.

Or, XDH went and got rid of his 'Fuck off fund' or whatever it was by buying a totally unecessary brand new car before the financials were sorted Hmm
Ardnassa · 03/01/2021 13:36

I have my own savings account, which DH knows about, but he doesn't know how much is in there. It may be used one day, but not the intention thus far. It's good to have a safety net - whether your partner knows that it exists or not.

DH thinks it's very sensible, but then he knows how pragmatic I am and that I always prepare for the worst (I was also the driving force behind our pre-nup, have a will even though am in mid-30s etc. etc.)

Sadnessallaround · 03/01/2021 14:00

@Bookaholic73

Interesting that most of you have one. I do all the finances in my marriage, so it’s be easy to squirrel a little bit away every month without DH knowing. That’s it, I’m opening a new account and setting up a standing order now.

For those of who whose DP’s know, what do they think about you having it?

Hi @Bookaholic73 thanks for starting this thread

Did you manage to open your new account ?

Murinae · 03/01/2021 14:56

I have a maxed out premium bonds account and an Isa in my name only as does DH. Not actually a fof but could be used to leave at any time I wanted too. DH knows about them but doesn’t have any access to them. I now prefer he knows about them in case I die he knows they are there and can then gain access to the money.

AlexisCarringtonColbyDexter · 03/01/2021 15:05

I think it’s deeper than that, there is a constant stream of threads on here from women who give up work to look after their child, becayse that’s what they want to do, and they don’t wish to go back to work either

Yeah. I also see a lot of smug posts though saying "my husband adores me, we love each other and he'd never do that!"

I mean, sure, maybe not now. But who knows what will happen in 5-10 years time. I know of women who thought their husbands adored them too and were utterly blindsided by an affair during his "mid life crisis".
I wish it never happened but it sometimes does and if you dont have any finances behind you, you are literally screwed.

MrsTerryPratchett · 03/01/2021 15:10

@roseblossom2020

Im very interested in this. How does a FoF work if you’re married? Dont you have to disclose it if you divorce and then you lose it?

MrsTerryPratchett what sort of financial literacy did you teach? And any advice? I desperately wish this was something we had in schools. We never got anything in the way of that and my parents never taught me much so I’ve had to learn and pick stuff up from mumsnet but it’s a bit frightening about how much you don’t know and how vulnerable you can be.

I was asked to do it because I facilitated housing education so I thought I'd be good.

I taught young people in schools but also as part of programs through youth organisations. Non-profit because as PP says, the banks do a piss poor job. They are boring and 'sell' debt. It was a time limited program but I learned a lot.

Advice I'd give young people (random and in no particular order):

Don't leave home until you having savings and a budget (I used to tell them if they are working and not paying rent they are the richest they will ever be Grin)

Have a FOF saved before you leave home and add to it but never touch it unless you need to FO.

Assertiveness conversations (and education if needed) on how to talk about money with partners, flatmates and family.

Fraud, scams, passwords, identity theft and protecting yourself.

Budgeting. The first question I'd ask is how much their parents' rent or mortgage was and how much they earned. Blank faces (except the children of lower income single mothers - those kids knew their shit). I'd say, "these people taught you to read, write, ride a bike and eat with a knife and fork, how much time have they spent taking about money? OK almost none so you have to learn yourselves".

Education cost:benefit. When choosing further education options, the least cost for the most income. If you have to spend years studying for a minimum wage job (often jobs women do) think carefully. Anything with 'engineer' in the job title will pay well Smile

For parents, I'd advise something I know many many people on here don't like. Unconditional pocket money. No chores linked to it, as early as you can. My DD was three I think (as soon as she wouldn't eat it). And let them make mistakes. As long as they aren't actively dangerous. They want to spend their money on roblox and sweets, let them. They learn from it. Slight nudging is OK "I thought you were saving for x but if you want to buy y it's your money". And the lesson is discussing it after. They want a big item you talk about saving, how long it will take etc. NEVER sub them. EVER. They want it, they save. It's helped my impulse challenged DD with ADHD to plan, save and even earn money to add to it.

Educate about different types of debt and interest rates. Bank fees and how things like overdrafts keep you poor.

The psychology of money. Particularly advertising, how debt makes you sad, fear and guilt, envy and comparisons. How small 'treats' add up but don't add to your happiness.

And because I worked with a lot of children leaving care, I talk about social and financial capital. You either need a FOF or a network of people to help. If you don't have money you need a few sofas you know you can sleep on. Don't burn relationship bridges before you have financial means. I would always give them my card, just in case.

Bloody hell that was an essay! I was very proud of the program. I used to hear from youth workers that kids as they left the room would be saying, "FFS I spend a grand a year at Starbucks" and similar. So proud!

MrsTerryPratchett · 03/01/2021 15:11

Meant to @roseblossom2020 sorry!

Mum4Fergus · 03/01/2021 15:17

Never really thought of it as a FOF, but I am financially independent from DH and it's protected should the worst happen, so yes.

Jobsharenightmare · 03/01/2021 16:59

@MrsTerryPratchett

This is brilliant advice thank you for spelling it out like this. I often talk about money with family and close friends trying to learn from them about tips, pitfalls and issues etc but this is a brilliant guide I wish I had had. I was raised to have running away money, never delude myself that credit is the same as being able to afford something and spending less than I bring in, no excuses to myself about things I "needed" and all of that really helped. But, I'm sure your program of advice should be mandatory in schools!

Pagan101 · 03/01/2021 17:26

No

MixMatch · 03/01/2021 17:27

@TJ17

I have my own savings but it's not a FOF fund. Having savings is sensible but I think if you have them with possible divorce specifically in mind then you deffo already have marriage issues.
Agree with this.

I would definitely keep access to all my funds if I was unmarried (no way I would even be sharing a joint account).

I would have a joint account of some kind during marriage since we're legally and more deeply committed, but I think it's still sensible for each person in a married couple to have a bit of savings in case of emergency/something happens to the other money. However squirrelling money away secretly to pay for a possible divorce (and your spouse isn't abusive), definitely means there's marriage issues, or the person themselves has their own issues, which is sad. I can guarantee if it was a man who was discovered doing this, it would be construed by most people on here as he's got something to hide/probable affair/dishonest/ untrustworthy etc.

MsTSwift · 03/01/2021 17:28

Sorry but it seems very odd to me. Why be married to someone you don’t trust? That ship has sailed its all on the table in a divorce.

I hope we never divorce but if we did I know dh would be decent. I followed Nora Ephrons excellent advice “never marry a man you wouldn’t want to be divorced from” 😁

Ratched · 03/01/2021 17:47

@MsTSwift

Sorry but it seems very odd to me. Why be married to someone you don’t trust? That ship has sailed its all on the table in a divorce.

I hope we never divorce but if we did I know dh would be decent. I followed Nora Ephrons excellent advice “never marry a man you wouldn’t want to be divorced from” 😁

For me, it is a weird psychological thing...... I have money stashed, which will be passed on to up and coming female family members (DiL and in turn, GD). It was a mind set thing. Always knowing I could go, at any time, because I had the resources, gave me voice. I am 60 now, so times change I guess, but whenever we had a row, or there was discord, I never felt I had to fall in line, I always had the attitude of 'fuck you mate' in any argument. Its a feeling of security, of being able to look at your partner and think 'yeah, you're not the be all and end all'. And mean it. I have been married for 42 years. Mainly, very happy. But the security of knowing I could walk at any moment without his support has been enabling.

I am old enough now not to need it, so it will be passed to my DiL (shock horror)!

I doubt she will ever need it, but it is there if she does. If not, my grand daughter will benefit from it. None of my female line will ever be held in thrall to a man, will ever be tied to a man through financial need, will ever suffer the indignity of staying with a partner, make or female, because of lack of resources.
So yes. I do support a running away fund 😁

MrsTerryPratchett · 03/01/2021 17:47

Why be married to someone you don’t trust?

Why not protect yourself anyway? I'm a great driver, I still have fully comp insurance and wear a seatbelt. I'm good at walking downstairs, I still hold the handrail. I feel very safe at work, I still make sure someone knows where I am lone working. I love my job and trust my employer, I'm still a member of a union.

I've been divorced before and exH was actually a much better ex than he was a husband. But you simply never know. People develop MH issues, acquire brain injuries, get parasitic worms in their brains and change personality. Google Phineas Gage. People also more frequently get their head turned. You never know.

Like condoms, better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

MrsTerryPratchett · 03/01/2021 17:48

None of my female line will ever be held in thrall to a man, will ever be tied to a man through financial need, will ever suffer the indignity of staying with a partner, make or female, because of lack of resources.

👏🏻

choli · 03/01/2021 17:52

No. I have a number of accounts and investments that I accrued through my own work. I feel no need to keep them secret or call them a running away fund. The likelihood of needing to "run away " is in inverse proportion to the maintenance of your financial independence .

SpongeBobJudgeyPants · 03/01/2021 17:56

@MsTSwift

Sorry but it seems very odd to me. Why be married to someone you don’t trust? That ship has sailed its all on the table in a divorce.

I hope we never divorce but if we did I know dh would be decent. I followed Nora Ephrons excellent advice “never marry a man you wouldn’t want to be divorced from” 😁

Because sometimes you find you can't trust him after you have been married to him for a long time. Women don't generally marry men they don't trust Hmm. I thought my XH would be decent . I would have said I knew, like you. I didn't. And I hope you are right, and not just naive as hell, but don't patronise women who have found they have married men who turned into arseholes. Hmm