An APfree 2021

[Affor]

Hi all. Thread two for the leaving AP support.

No hate or trolling please. We know how you feel about it, we've heard it all. We're trying to figure out our feelings and make better decisions to be happier.

[quote Eleganz]@daddyshark1976

As a Christian, I find you using that part of Paul's letter where he is describing God's love and charity to describe your affair very distasteful. That is absolutely NOT what Paul was writing about in those verses. Justify your affair how you like, but don't claim that it is in anyway godly.[/quote]
I don't believe I justified having an affair?

My advice would be don't have an affair if possible.

Also it's interesting to me that the assumption is I caused my marriage to break down by having an affair. That is a stereotype. I wasn't looking for an affair. I also didn't cause my marriage to break down as that happened earlier. I imagine this forum mostly as a lot of bitter women with their pitchforks out.

@daddyshark1976

You used it to describe your relationship with your AP. Implying somehow that this was a wholesome love like that which Paul was writing about. Complete misuse of that verse to put a positive spin on what you are doing.

[quote Eleganz]@daddyshark1976

You used it to describe your relationship with your AP. Implying somehow that this was a wholesome love like that which Paul was writing about. Complete misuse of that verse to put a positive spin on what you are doing.[/quote]
Said the woman with the pitchfork in her hand

@daddyshark1976 - why are you still married - what do you have an AP if they are free? I don't really get it?

@daddyshark1976

So it's okay for you to judge others as "bitter women with their pitchforks out", but not for anyone to make comment on you? Your hypocrisy is so blatant it's actually humourous. Keep it up. Let's talk more about your amazing journey of fatherhood while shagging someone other than their mother and lying about it. Personally I couldn't hear enough about it.

PS heaven and hell will be the only religious references i make on this thread.

@daddyshark1976

You do take the biscuit. What did you DO to try to fix the relationship whilst it was 'breaking down'?

Justifying your weak behaviour is not going to make it right.

People who have affairs are very weak individuals who lack any moral compass and not brave enough to finish their exciting relationship honourably before moving on to the next.

50% of marriages end in divorce. Difficult but clean. Affair is for the weak.

@daddyshark1976

Your interpretation of that passage is woeful.

1 Corinthians 13:7 (NLT) is about love for sure, but not love built on deceit, lies and emotional abuse.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.

Affairs are by nature self seeking and rely on the continued emotional abuse of the spouse, which is pretty evil. It is by no means related to the truth but relies on the manipulation and gaslighting of another party, which can have long term mental health implications. Have a look at Post Infidelity Stress Disorder and it's clinical basis.

If you're going to start quoting bible scripture then you might want to look at commandments.

Affairs happen, no point in pretending they don't. The right thing to do is to tell your partner and give them back agency and choice over their own life and sexual health. It is not to carry on a long term con on the person you are supposed to respect and love, using the self serving justification that its better for the other person not to know because you are scared of the consequences. You have robbed them of their dignity, autonomy and agency.

I am not a bitter ex wife with an axe to grind. I feel that this level of hypocrisy needs to be called out rather than applauded.

@daddyshark1976

Sadly a typical response from someone who thinks that using Paul's words about faith and the love of God to describe their feely weelies about their schoompie poo AP is totally cool.

Sorry that you can't handle being called out on it without resorting to insults.

Love is patient, love is kind.

An affair is inherently unkind.

It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking

An affair is inherently self seeking and self serving.

it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.

Easy for the wrong doer to say. And implies the wronged party should forget how they were wronged.

Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.

An affair is inherently dishonest until found out.

Using that Bible verse to express your feelings about your affair is a very strange choice.

And I'm not religious so not offended as such, just surprised at the lack of self awareness of telling people challenging your opinion to look up that verse.

@youvegottenminuteslynn - I have to agree - its perverse to use that text to describe infidelity- I'm not in the least religious but neither am I so crass or vein.
Maybe find some truth in your life @daddyshark1976 ? - you can't hide from your children for ever - they will know in the end.

@Seadad

I don't think there is any thought of families and children at home when affairs begin.

My take ...most affairs are fantasy relationships in this regard, more akin to eay teenage relationships, fleeting and snatched moments without responsibilities to consider or share. But the emotions can be just as moving as in adolescence - and many 'feel' that way again initially.
When reality creeps in, the prospect of broken homes, divorce, blended families, relationship with exes and extended family, work and money - they are shut out. Like dumping all that adulthood on a 15 year old - it doesn't bear thinking about. So better to keep everything secret and pretend in the safe bubble of just the two.
Protecting that bubble from reality increasingly takes cognitive dissonance, lies, deception, learned little tricks.
And eventually one or other wants more than the shallow stolen moments that leave acres of time apart. Being 'together' becomes something to contemplate. But it lets in the cold air of reality - and in the fog of those feelings - it's impossible to think clearly- much easier to 'future fake' to calm the desire for togetherness.
Then arguments start - tiffs, spats, misunderstandings - about being a priority, about shared feelings, about plans and values and needs. But there is no-one but your own counsel i this secret pain.
And as the thrill becomes less intense and the reality becomes harder to shut out - scales begin to lift. What are we doing? What have we done? What is the happy resolution? What do we really want?

But in life you can't always get what you want - and the fantasy of happy blended families sharing parents, forgiving exes and financial security seems far removed. Some decide they want to go back to what they had before, some see the changes they need to make - rarely are the feelings mutual between to APs. But you've got so used to lying you say what AP wants to hear now, you don't want things to blow up while you hovver in this uncertainty. But it's all more lain than pleasure now. Like any addiction - it gives you a taste of heaven and then slowly drags you into hell.

@Seadad this is actually quite spot on, it does describe quite well how affairs start (at least for me), I do not think when they start people think about families and children and it prob starts due to the desire for attention, sex, or whatever reason. However I do think that feelings can develop.

It is true we can’t have all we want, I also agree when you say that rarely the feelings are mutual between APs but when they are that makes things even more complicated as the contemplation of leaving the safety and commodity of home does could mean happiness with the person they love. So yes it does slowly drags into hell as whichever decision is be made will be painful.

[quote Seadad]@youvegottenminuteslynn - I have to agree - its perverse to use that text to describe infidelity- I'm not in the least religious but neither am I so crass or vein.
Maybe find some truth in your life @daddyshark1976 ? - you can't hide from your children for ever - they will know in the end.[/quote]
And it's just a bit cringe isn't it? Embarrassingly deluded and the cocky tone to say 'look it up'. It's a shame because it seemed that @daddyshark1976 had some good insights that made sense initially. But defaulted to speaking down to people when challenged. Pontificating and thinking commanding people to 'look it up' was profound. As I say, cringe.

@Seadad

I don't think there is any thought of families and children at home when affairs begin.

My take ...most affairs are fantasy relationships in this regard, more akin to eay teenage relationships, fleeting and snatched moments without responsibilities to consider or share. But the emotions can be just as moving as in adolescence - and many 'feel' that way again initially.
When reality creeps in, the prospect of broken homes, divorce, blended families, relationship with exes and extended family, work and money - they are shut out. Like dumping all that adulthood on a 15 year old - it doesn't bear thinking about. So better to keep everything secret and pretend in the safe bubble of just the two.
Protecting that bubble from reality increasingly takes cognitive dissonance, lies, deception, learned little tricks.
And eventually one or other wants more than the shallow stolen moments that leave acres of time apart. Being 'together' becomes something to contemplate. But it lets in the cold air of reality - and in the fog of those feelings - it's impossible to think clearly- much easier to 'future fake' to calm the desire for togetherness.
Then arguments start - tiffs, spats, misunderstandings - about being a priority, about shared feelings, about plans and values and needs. But there is no-one but your own counsel i this secret pain.
And as the thrill becomes less intense and the reality becomes harder to shut out - scales begin to lift. What are we doing? What have we done? What is the happy resolution? What do we really want?

But in life you can't always get what you want - and the fantasy of happy blended families sharing parents, forgiving exes and financial security seems far removed. Some decide they want to go back to what they had before, some see the changes they need to make - rarely are the feelings mutual between to APs. But you've got so used to lying you say what AP wants to hear now, you don't want things to blow up while you hovver in this uncertainty. But it's all more lain than pleasure now. Like any addiction - it gives you a taste of heaven and then slowly drags you into hell.

I really recognise this and think @Seadad is spot on. It's a much more nuanced and intelligent interpretation of affairs than 'he is a manipulative liar who just wanted a shag'.

Doesn't make affairs any better or acceptable but is much closer to the truth, at least in my experience.

And the end of something like like does leave you questioning a lot and a bit stuck. Because there's no dramatic breakup for unrequited feelings, just an acknowledgement of the chaos and pain that would be caused by the truth, or even just be leaving without the truth, and an unwillingness to do that.

Then you get stuck. Do you want him to put you first, or do you want him to stick by his kids? In an ideal world you wouldn't have to choose between the two, which is why affairs are so unhealthy for all involved. You end up in corners with no options and no way to undo the bad choices you have made.

@Seadad everyone on here would benefit from reading your posts. I applaud your ability to communicate understanding and to not shy away from the hard truths about this painful subject. Your last post was nothing short of outstanding. As a betrayed spouse it made tough reading but I identified with every line. Thank you.

By the way I’m not in here to judge anyone. Only to find an understanding of what happened to me. I like to see all sides of a situation. I’m not here to judge.

@Seadad

I too think seadads post was outstanding and beneficial to all.

@Thewookiemustgo - thank you - that's very kind. I'm so sorry you were hurt and I understand how painful such betrayal can be. I just try to help by revealing the truth as I see it. I don't go out to help people to hurt- but nor do I want to prevent them from healing- and seeing through ones own self deception is an import step.

@Seadad this is exactly my situation. Abd why I would never do it again.
You learn a lot about yourself though. What you are prepared to do to get what you want. You learn that you are flawed abd selfish and weak.
Hard lesson.
In my case I have to further hurt my partner by breaking our family. But it will save him in the long run. From me. And I’ll have to rebuild relationships with my children.

I really felt like I’d lost everything. It’s a very very high price to pay. Hurt everywhere on all sides.

07daddyshark1976

Eleganz

@daddyshark1976

My advice would be don't have an affair if possible.

Lol

@Livinglearning

You sound as if you have made a courageous decision and I admire you for admitting that you have to save your husband from further pain by separating. It's a tough call but it has to be done.

So many people try to make excuses for having an affair whereas I don't think there is any excuse. People enjoy the excitement and feeling attractive and sexy and it can be like a drug to them.

This thread was started with well meaning intentions and then a couple of dementors have piled in and own it and now Christians have joined in too. Daddy was a good contributor. Leave him be. Sea and Lynn back offfrom owning the board in a negative way imo

@ThatsAllFolks
Totally agree with you. I’ve tried to ask for genuine advice and it just gets lost in the ridiculous posts.

I’ve given up on this thread...

ThatsAllFolks, I completely agree with you too.

The original poster of the thread quoted @Seadad and seems to think that @Seadad is “spot on”. If Seadad is one of the “dementors” then I don’t understand. If the person who started the thread thinks that this is good advice, then the thread is clearly working for them. Apologies if I’ve got the wrong end of the stick.