No Contact Support thread - anyone interested?

[52andblue]

Anyone want to join me?
(I'm currently on Day 6)

I won't go into huge details but I am trying to maintain NC with a narcissist (diagnosed, amongst other dx...) who has been in my life on and off for 30 years and mirrors a Narc relationship with my Mother. I've all the 'intellectual understanding' of it, but find NC hard.

@Ruminating2020
I did 25 years ago yes.
I've chatted to my old therapist about it again over the last 2/3 years.
She said that 'for you, he is absolute poison but you need to learn that for yourself & you will, in time you will value yourself enough'.
I've made a lot of progress over the last 18m.
I am happy to take it in small manageable steps.
He's something that's been in my life since I was 19 ('something' in that he represents most acutely all my difficulties with boundaries and self esteem) so it's going to take time but I am moving forward :)

@Breakingupbadly72
I am sorry to hear that this particular job application didn't work out for you. It really helps I think to have other things in your life to feel you are literally 'moving on' but.... you will find another suitable job that you will feel excited about. Hold on in there and sending much love xxx

I agree @Breakingupbadly72 - keep moving forwards and the right job will come along. I remember you had your interview on a particularly difficult day and you were very stressed. Even the smallest act of kindness and care towards yourself will be healing.

@52andblue yes I have a history of entangling myself with messed up men who are ambivalent towards me and it can be all-consuming. I hope you can find the strength to block him soon because until you do I'd agree with @Ruminating2020 that you're still in the push/pull dance.

I'm feeling a bit weird about the 'blocking' thing.
But I've just scrolled back and realised I said: 'I've blocked him' on my post of 31st March. I didn't mean 'blocked' on SM (as we don't use it) I guess I meant in my own head, iyswim.
I didn't think about blocking his calls or emails ( I've never blocked anyone's calls but it can't be hard, but how do you block email?)
Not trying to be disingenuous, I am fairly old and not at all tecchy (and don't want to ask my kids...)
It's true that I responded to his (awful sex text) but apart from that I've ignored for a week. This is progress for me !!

@52andblue To block him in email,
I think it depends what email you use. On my desktop Yahoo account, there is an option that will block sender. Not sure about others but even if you can't block him on email you could create a folder where everything from him gets redirected to ana then empty it as soon as anything comes from him.

Your therapist is right, poison was also the word I used to describe the toxic person in my life to my counsellor and dh. You have to expunge him or the traces of poison will remain in your life and you will never find peace.

Have you made a list of all the horrible things he's said and done that might help you resist contact with him in future? Is there anything positive about this man?

It is true that even though we know they are unhealthy for us, even during nc we want them to message. It’s been a while since I’ve spoken to mine. He is selfish and breaks promises all of the time. And even though I won’t message him because he is awful I want a message from him. Why is that?

@Carryonsleeping Validation? Lack of self worth or low self esteem? Trauma bonded? Knowing that you've "won"? Closure - which you won't ever get.

There is another interesting thread in Relationships about being 'the prize' where a poster has said that it is about trusting yourself to cut ties when someone else breaks your trust.
Perhaps it's about low self confidence to do that?
Lack of confidence in 'letting go' of something even when you know it isn't 'good for you'? Habits can become ingrained quickly and it is maybe easier to stick with a dynamic you know than face head on the hole where your trust in yourself should be? (i've not put that very well and am not sure that you are supposed to quote other threads?)

Hi everyone, hope you’re all doing ok. I’m now at 8/9 weeks ish! I posted last week and felt really great. Since then I’ve had some up and down moments but I don’t beat myself up about it. Just ride it out, distract yourself or even have a good cry but you’ll get through it.

I honestly never thought I’d get this far. Previously he’s always sucked me back in or I’ve contacted him but this time it’s different. I know he didn’t make me happy. I was always in a state of confusion with him even though I’d pretend I was fine and cool I wasn’t inside. I wanted answers and more and he was never going to give me what I wanted from him. Now it’s not because I think I deserve better. We had an affair so I don’t deserve anything but it’s because I know he was never going to make me happy. Do I want to be in contact with someone who makes me insecure? In general I’m not an insecure person at all but he really got to me. One day I was everything to him and then the next it was like we barely knew each other.

I don’t really know the point of this post! It’s just to say keep going and you’ll get there... x

Well done @Alwaystheotherwoman on your progress.

Confusion is the correct word when you are describing a toxic relationship. You know that you are not happy and you feel unsafe a lot of the time, but on the other hand, you can't quite let go so you go along to get along. You will recover once the fog clears.

Good morning all. I am so pleased I found this thread as so much resonates.
Waiting for NC to message even though you know they aren't good for you. Ruminating, checking, feeling 'stuck'. They cant/couldn't offer us what we need and we owe it to ourselves to move forward.
I haven't slept very well, I have time off work and it is allowing me to think/ruminate. For me, its the thought that he has already moved on, he is chatting to someone else. I'm not indifferent yet, but I equally know I can't go back
Why am I wasting time? its over, yet still taking up headspace. I guess maybe I have to accept that this is part of healing/learning. Anyone know of an exercises/questions based on CBT to help get over a relationship?

@Breakingupbadly I’m a fan of CBT. This might help?

dateranalysisblog.wordpress.com/2017/05/12/how-to-cbt-yourself-out-of-love/

@Breakingupbadly72 I’m the world’s worst ruminator. I can ruminate whilst doing more or less anything, even while talking to people I can continue a negative conversation in my head with myself, I’m a bloody expert. 🙄
Its only when I’ve made myself feel really crap that I notice how much I’m doing it.
It’s a mammoth task to shift focus and reframe thoughts.
Maybe if you can identify the most painful thoughts and note them down. When you have time, see if you can find out why that particular thought is so painful. What do you think that thought says about you? Is that accurate? Have you fallen into negative thinking traps like ‘all or nothing’ or ‘black or white’ statements? Challenge it and write a new statement. Which of your belief systems has this thought triggered? Does it make a ‘value’ statement about you? Challenge it! When we are in a downward spiral we paint our thoughts with dark colours and they will have gone through a negative filter with negative bias. CBT helps you detect the bias and find a more accurate, far less painful statement which is more accurate and truth-based.
Note how often your thoughts stray off the present moment to rumination. Maybe try having an elastic band on your wrist and give it a ping every time you catch yourself doing it. You’ll soon get sick of pinging yourself! It’s staggering how often we do it. And ruminating harms us. It can remind you to re-focus on the present moment. This is hard MH work but so beneficial. XX

@Breakingupbadly72 the things that have helped me to stop ruminating when I was feeling bleak were to
a) keep listening to or reading books about recovering from break ups and
b) every morning as soon as I woke up I'd go and write/add things to my two lists - first list was a list of all the things that were 'wrong' with the relationship and why it wasn't right (and I mean ALL the things). Second list was a list of things to be grateful for. If I still needed to I would get everything off my chest that was bothering me that morning too, and I would refer back to these lists at any point I needed to (all kept conveniently on OneNote )

I have stopped feeling the need to look at my lists at the moment, so perhaps that means I'm getting a bit better, I don't know. I have been thinking about him too much today - as we approach the end of lockdown etc. We had planned to do loads of things once things opened up and I know he'll be very excited about it. I'm also very tired though and feeling a bit like I'm rattling around at home.

Did you start the Catherine Gray book? I found that one particularly helpful and positive.

I think CBT can be useful but has it's limitations (great for distracting the surface stuff, not so helpful if you are looking at what is really going on underneath to help stop you repeating the pattern).
I find journaling helpful. I keep a notepad (or 3!) by my bed.
I've also written far more extensively about it (50,000 words so far and made it into a novel - therapeutic for me anyway!)
It's a great idea to swap tips for what we find helpful x

The other thing I am trying to do and am mostly succeeding now is that when I catch myself focusing on it/him/feeling 'woe is me' or fantasising about scenarios, I just say out loud "shut up brain - this is pointless" or something similar and try to actually force myself to go and do an activity or do something specific like book something, tidy something, etc. Also if there is a phrase that is particularly appropriate in your case, something like "it's clear to absolutely everyone that I deserve better than this and this is the RIGHT outcome for me" make a note of it somewhere or write it on your hand or whatever, and force yourself to say it out loud if you catch yourself dwelling again.

I was tempted to message my nc this morning. It’s been almost 2 months and it’s definitely got better. But sometimes I just seem to get an overwhelming urge that comes from nowhere, although there must be something that triggers me. I even wrote the text to send, but sat on it for an hour and the urge stopped slightly. Not completely, but enough that I didn’t press send. Sometimes you just have to let it pass, which is not easy. Will that ever get better. Sometimes I think what’s the point as I’ll inevitably message him at some point. But then I feel strong again.

@Carryonsleeping I agree, it definitely 'ebbs and flows' for me.
I find some CBT type stuff for when it's intense and some journaling / reflection for when I feel stronger and more able to 'look at the causes of it' helps (by that I mean focussed on me and how to avoid similar traps in future, not on NC person)

I’m not even sure what I’d get out of messaging him. He’s not very nice. Won’t commit to anything. He has grown up children so not tied down with commitments.
He throws breadcrumbs to keep me interested. And when he’s in my life, I don’t even feel happy. He is forever making promises that aren’t followed up and gets annoyed with me if I question this.
I’ve left some things at his. I’m torn between letting him keep them or getting them back. But then I’ll have to message him!

Hi all, not been on for a while. Nearly 3 months NC for me now, I am here to say it does get better. I don't check messenger all the time now in case he has messaged. Haven't cried myself to sleep for a few weeks either.

Still haven't seen him at work yet, but as time goes on it becomes more likely, but I am in a better place as each week goes by so when it happens I should be able to cope.

To all others on this thread, I have read back and well done on keeping with the NC, I know how hard it is, I have read some of the books @ibelieveinmirrorballs recommended and they really helped.

@Thewookiemustgo I just want to say how in awe of you I am and how insightful your posts have been. Thank you for that.
Ditto @Ruminating2020 . Hearing your experience has been helpful.

@Ineedaslap thank you, that’s so kind. Saying you are in awe of me brought a bit of a tear if I’m honest as I’m pretty sure most people on MN think I’m a desperate deluded doormat for what I’m doing. I kind of ask for it I guess by going on other threads helping people who are brave enough to post about wanting an alternative to LTB.
Reading posts on here helps me too. Other people’s perspectives help me see all sides. X

@Ineedaslap bloody hell forgot to say what I wanted to say originally which is that three months is amazing! You can really hear the difference that’s made to you. X

@Thewookiemustgo seeing it from all sides is so important I think.

Unfortunately not many people do.
I've done something I am not proud of, I behaved appallingly. I am lucky that my DH is sticking with me, and the OM wife seems to be sticking with him (although if I am honest I don't know why knowing him and all he has done!)

I am not out of the woods yet by a long shot, and we'll see what happens when I see him. But hopefully I am getting there, and will be able to deal with it.
Having insightful posts from people such as yourself really helps. Thanks.

@Carryonsleeping Well done for being nc for 2 months. Are the things you have left at his replaceable? If so, I would just let it go. Just go back and look at your posts about him when you are tempted to message him. Even better, remove his number from your phone so that the temptation isn't there.

Thank you for your kind words @Ineedaslap. I only intend to use my experience to help others going through a similar situation.

@Thewookiemustgo You are far from a deluded, desperate doormat and it takes great courage to forgive and stay. Some stay, some leave and neither should be judged. I have said before that your posts are insightful and it is important to hear from those who have chosen the alternative to ltb.

@Ruminating2020 thank you. I can’t let you think I’m saintly enough to forgive though. I wish I could say I have forgiven and I know I’d be a better person if I could. I’ve got as far as acceptance. I’m prepared to accept why he did it and accept who he is going forward. The onus is on him now to prove he is the man he now says he is. Not who he was during the affair. He hates himself for it and at one point was suicidal. His AP is not a lovely memory for him, he shudders at the thought of what he did and any reminder of any of it crucifies him with shame.
I’m not sure I’ll ever forgive him, or his AP. I honestly want to. Full forgiveness and trust is what I’m still working on. Any pointers about how to forgive would be helpful! I know the hurt and anger from not forgiving is damaging me, even now. The pain from this is worse than the death of my parents. Wish I could forgive. But we’re none of us perfect. Thank God for Friday wine. Cheers, everyone! 🍷X