Husband’s confession of ‘minor’ dalliances

[Whatdirection]

My head is all over the place and l do not know what to do or think.

About four months ago my husband confessed to three ‘minor’ dalliances about 25-27 years ago. They involved him going out, getting very drunk and kissing three different women. The first time was when our oldest son was 3 months old. The other two occasions he cannot place but the last one could possibly have been close to when we got married. His memory is hazy and when pressed for details, he is unable to give much information. Therefore l know l cannot totally trust his version of events and there might be more to these stories.

For some context, l got pregnant very quickly into our relationship and we had only known each other a year when our son was born. We loved each other very much though and were totally committed to each other.

The first two occasions involved him going out with a group of men (one - a stag do) Although l feel sick about it, due to the intense pressure we were under and his relatively young age (he was 25/26) l do feel l can see how it might have happened.

However the third occasion involved him going out with just one other friend, meeting two other women and going back to their flat. He admits going into the woman’s bedroom but insists no more than a kiss happened. I cannot get past this - he has always been a very moral guy so l am staggered that he didn’t learn from the past two mistakes and repeated the same behaviour again.

My husband has said he has felt terrible about these events for years. He has apologised and expressed remorse. However he has also continually minimised his behaviour by blaming it on drink and saying it was not like he had an affair and he never planned any of it and has repeatedly said ‘ l am not like that’

He said these events have always haunted him and he felt they were a stain on our marriage. He said he didn’t want to die without telling me. He said he hoped as we had a happy marriage l would be able to forgive him. He feels he has been a good husband over the years. It almost feels like he thinks he now has enough ‘credit’ in the bank of our marriage to weather this behaviour.

I do not share such a rosy view of our marriage. He does have good qualities and he can be lovely. But he also can be grumpy, over sensitive , needy, demanding and there have been crunch times where it has felt his needs have triumphed over mine.

I feel l am questioning everything about him and our marriage. I feel so angry and am deeply disappointed in him. His ‘funny little ways’ that l guess we all have now seem intolerable. We have not been physically intimate since and the thought of being so makes me feel sick.

We have started having some marriage counselling. The counsellor thinks he was a bit young and a bit stupid but the drink affected him and he hasn’t done it since. She even used the term ‘mitigating circumstances ‘ to describe the context.

Please help me make some sense of all this. Am l over- reacting, should l cut him more slack? Or should l pay attention to my spidery senses that tell me that something is very wrong here.

@AnyFucker

Why not try a mew thing together?

Like what ?

Exactly. It's not op's job to tie herself in knots to fathom this out and 'fix' it. The fabric of her marriage has already been destroyed. Catching him out in some kind of 'gotcha' is a waste of emotional energy that will achieve nothing.

I just wondered if you were, prior to this, doing quite well for yourself - had you had a promotion/not appeared to have been affected by covid/handling it all etc. There was a bitof me wondering whether he was resentful of this - seeing you doing well while he was struggling perhaps, maybe not focussing on him as much as he thought you should, and this was designed to knock the blocks off your foundations and bring you back to heel.
I dont know. Just a little feeling from reading through

A couple of things to maybe consider in your time away:

Go through your marriage and document / list all previous incidents of these familiar behaviours (minus this last one).

Consider how this made you feel and reflect on a future with more of the same.

Be patient with the recent dripping revelations.....there is something behind that either MH or something else - don’t waste your energy digging there - it will drive you distracted - whatever it is will come out in time.

Another possibility for the “Why now?” Q could be that someone else (DS? friend or family member?) has found something out and has demanded he tell you himself - hence the drip, drip, drip.

Either way - protect yourself emotionally. Research your practical and financial options. It doesn’t have to be like your Mum and Dad. You can choose to behave better. Maybe knowing less will help with this.

Don’t feel guilty for moving on - you may well have reached this conclusion without these revelations.

I would also look at personal therapy for yourself. I am not surprised that you had to swallow / repress the emotions and tension of your own parents toxic marriage. Know that you are trained by default to tolerate and absorb too much.

He really wants to see your reaction, doesn't he? The half remembered event didn't provoke you enough so now he decides that he can definitely remember it, and pushes that at you to see what you'll do or say. Like an overgrown toddler pushing the boundaries.

I feel like someone or something has happened that he is scared you will be made aware of his unfaithfulness, & I don't think he's telling you anything near the truth. & also as above, actually is attention seeking.
Employ your time away from him to decide if you are prepared to be his prop forever.

He sounds both tedious and dull.

You sound like a lovely woman who must have had the patience of a saint to have put up with all his nonsense.

Very good idea to put your important paperwork somewhere safe whilst you take time to think.

What's his end game is what I'd be thinking.

Sorry for you op, it looks like a puzzle thats going to keep unravelling.

Very strange..... religious reasons, atonement, self preservation or selfishness ?

Time will tell, either way a least you know he is a liar.

Thank you Sssloou, I have so valued your posts - I will reread them when I am away and write down the things you suggest.

NettleTea - that is an interesting point. There is nothing specific that happened around that time HOWEVER as a person he has heightened sensitivity of fairness/unfairness. He really struggles if he perceives some-one has got a better deal than him eg work and will often compare his lot unfavourably with others.

He is an only child of a single mother and growing up there were no other adults involved in his upbringing. His Mum never had any partners or family support (they were miles away) She did everything for him. So I think this could have really impacted on his empathy levels - he never had to share anything or his Mum with anyone. She also never demanded anything from him and although she must have really struggled he only has happy memories of his childhood - I have always found this odd.

I am at work and have just been reading though some notes I made back in November when I decided to keep a record of every time he did something that I thought was a bit off. I stopped doing it after a while as it seemed so negative ( and I was writing page after page) Re-reading these notes I am appalled. He is coming across as a paranoid, delusional, twisted piece of work.

Counting down the days til I go away (3 to go) I don't know why but I feel scared to do anything before then.

I suffer from OCD and it has spiked during the lockdowns. Part of it involves obsessing over past mistakes I made, and feeling like they are 10 times worse than what they actually were at the time.

It's a horrible feeling. I'm not saying you have to forgive him, but it's perfectly possible that he has decided to confess due his OCD, not due to a hidden love child.

If your marriage is otherwise happy and you love each other I'd try to give it a go.

*HOWEVER as a person he has heightened sensitivity of fairness/unfairness. He really struggles if he perceives some-one has got a better deal than him eg work and will often compare his lot unfavourably with others.

He is an only child of a single mother and growing up there were no other adults involved in his upbringing. His Mum never had any partners or family support (they were miles away) She did everything for him. So I think this could have really impacted on his empathy levels - he never had to share anything or his Mum with anyone. She also never demanded anything from him and although she must have really struggled he only has happy memories of his childhood - I have always found this odd.*

He sounds emotionally inadequate and immature with his negativity and distorted view on life. It seems like he hasn’t moved on from the egotistical whining toddler stage emotionally enabled by his mother but has just replaced her with you. You are expected to soothe and absorb but this is draining and exhausting when there is no emotional progress.

Do a quick review of him - but don’t get stuck in the analysis / paralysis of trying to understand him, his motivations etc - this is misguided and futile.

Invest your time, money, headspace to reflect on your own unmet emotional needs as a child with your parents and (it seems) in this marriage. Give yourself some attention. Sit still and listen v carefully to YOUR feelings - identify the emotions - and attend to them.

I am not surprised that you are shocked re reading your notes from Nov - you have survived by keeping moving and blinkered - once you start to look at the totality of behaviours / relationship then you can take stock and make strategic decisions.

Put your feelings and needs front and centre for the first time in your life. It’s lovely on this side of the fence.

Also if he has unevolved toddler ego traits he will v likely have felt entitled enough to cheat - as it seems from his upbringing he was always pandered to. He may also be deluded enough to always lie - this is what really young children do as well - they are in full denial - “It wasn’t me, I didn’t steal the chocolate” ...... which they continue to say with chocolate all around their mouth.

Keep cool calm and collected and focused back on your own internal space not the entitled, deluded, distorted, egotistical nonsense world he inhabits.

There is a long running thread, I will look and see if I can find it, of a poster who left and is now divorcing someone who was doagnosed (after proper losing the plot when she left) with paranoid personality disorder.
Might make some interesting reading for you. Is not exactly the same, but something about it reminded me of your husband.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3448545-Confronting-DH-about-his-sulking

this is her first thread. she is near the end of thread 5 now

This is the new one www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/4125147-Divorcing-sulking-DH-it-WILL-happen-in-2021?watched=1

Thank you Nettle - l have had a brief look and will read through properly when have the headspace.

It does make me think l will need to plan and prepare very carefully for any major decision l make. Despite being desperate for him to leave, l have bided my time as l don’t want any ‘knee jerk’ reaction to backfire on me.

Thankfully the boys are adults now although l reckon DS2 will come back home from uni after last nights announcement.

I am hoping desperately l can still go away. The trip ticked the Tier 4 criteria for staying away (key worker /training) and l am keeping my fingers crossed that the AirBnB host will not cancel. I will be completely alone for the whole time just completing work and doing online training. Fingers crossed.

Two different counsellors phoning me today as well.

It does make me think l will need to plan and prepare very carefully for any major decision l make. Despite being desperate for him to leave, l have bided my time as l don’t want any ‘knee jerk’ reaction to backfire on me.

I expect that your skills in this area are well honed. Just take it slow and thorough. These things take time to evaluate emotionally and practically. You can get a lot done and be well prepared whether you choose to press the button or not, when and how, if at all is a decision to be made in the future. But you are astute to keep your powder dry for now. Glad to hear that you are seeking professional emotional support for yourself.

Well yesterday things imploded somewhat. So much for keeping my powder dry and biding my time.

A counsellor phoned me in the morning. DH was in the house and l took the call in a room well away from him but near the front door. I talked for longer than expected - she was lovely and l am going to use her.

Towards the end of the call, DH came into the room with his coat on saying he was going for a walk. He has a funny look on his face and l had a horrible feeling he had been listening in.

When he came back he admitted he had heard one or two things and proceeded to question me about it. He had heard me say ‘ l think there’s more’. So l had to say to him that l could not fully believe his stories and l have to consider there might be more. I don’t think l had ever said this so directly and he clearly found it difficult that he wasn’t believed.

We ended up having a prolonged difficult conversation where l got emotional and cross and told him exactly what l thought of his behaviour from start to finish including what a selfish husband he had been over the years.

I reminded him how l had trusted him implicitly and it was because of his actions that l couldn’t believe him. He has destroyed the trust. This was a bit of a light bulb moment for me because actually l was starting to feel bad that l didn’t believe his story.

I also said if he had any shred of decency he would have buggered of to his mother weeks ago to give me space.

He admitted he had completely messed up in every direction and said he couldn’t understand his behaviour. Interesting though, he hasn’t done anything about getting a counsellor for himself. I reminded him that this was the single most important thing he should do.

So he packed a bag and without a fuss has gone to his Mums. The plan is he stays there until l go away for my trip.

I am not sure what is going to happen when l get back.

I spent the afternoon feeling numb and traumatised but perked up in the evening and slept pretty well considering.

I think this is what l have needed for a long time.

That's positive @Whatdirection but it does rather feel like you're about to step off a cliff, which can feel very scary. I'm glad you said what you said. It was needed and you need the space

God I would have been annoyed at him listening in!! Talk about breech of privacy!

I also agree this is good you said what you said. I suspect he needed to be told how his behaviour is unacceptable and that it’s not just about his ‘rediscovery’ of stuff that might or might not have happened.

FWIW I think the fact he hasn’t looked for another counsellor says a lot about how he feels about the whole thing. That basically he is all white and doesn’t need to change anything. He is a great guy because he told you. A great buy because he never did anything really serious. After all if he had been that traumatised by the whole thing, he should have been very quick at finding someone, the same way that you have.

The thing about the catholic religion, I was married to a catholic and was at school with nuns, is that you are trained to confess. It is an integral part of everyday life. I’m not saying this to excuse him in any way, but you have to mull over your sins constantly and then grade them and prepare them for the weekly confession after which all is forgiven and you start again with a fresh slate. Very little thought is given to how your sins and misdemeanours affect others, only on getting them out, promising not to do them again and then forgiveness. Some sins of course you never reveal because you can’t handle how awful they are and you carry them round like well wrapped lead weights.
Mix this up with his OCD and you have a very self absorbed person. I don’t have any advice for you, I only recognised his catholic behaviour and thought I’d mention it as he seems to be struggling with the concept that his confessions have fallout.
Counselling is a good route for you, it will help you get some perspective on how living with him all these years has affected you and wether you want to have your retirement years together. The thing with counsellors is if the shoes don’t fit you won’t walk far. Never be afraid or embarrassed to finish working with one counsellor and look for another.
You have immense reserves of strength and wisdom now is the time to focus it on your own well being. Don’t worry too much about your sons; they are loved and will come to terms and move on with their lives whatever you decide.

I'm sorry that you are going through this OP. FWIW, I think he wants to be honest with you about the extent of his behaviour but he can't bring himself to do it because he knows that it will probably signal the end of the marriage. I think he's testing the waters with his drip feeding. The only way he will tell you the truth is to get him to believe that you won't run away from him. This involves a deception on your behalf which is not particularly great but considering his deceit, it's a small act of dishonesty from you. It sounds like you don't completely know what you would do even if he tells you everything so there's an element of truth in this. However, I think you know that he's got more to tell you. I also think he knows that the image he has created of himself as a person with a strong moral compass is about to unravel. The risk to the marriage and his image and sense of self are two overwhelming reasons why he's finding it so hard to come clean.

His listening in is so telling. He really is in every single way a completely immoral person.

The decent man he's desperately trying to convince you he is, wouldn't have listened. Every single thing he does tells you what your gut does - you shouldn't believe him, he's not honest or decent.

Thank you guys. It helps so much to know l am not alone.

The listening in....interesting because he didn’t apologise but made lots of excuses;

I didn’t realise you were talking to the counsellor (this is true - l hadn’t told him)
You have a loud voice - l could hear you down the corridor
I was just putting my shoes on when l heard
I only heard a few things

However in our conversation he referenced at least three different specific things l had said. I actually feel violated. It makes me really think it’s not going to work living together while we try to sort this mess out.

I have just been on AirBnB looking at places for possibly the next two weeks. Unsurprising there is lots of availability.

Does anyone know the legalities of staying somewhere else in a lockdown when a relationship breaks down?

I quite fancy booking myself a little cottage in the country with a wood burner and walks on the doorsteps coming out of joint finances of course. I live in a city but in a rural county so l wouldn’t be traveling far. As long as the WiFi is good enough to do work.

Need to get organised today while l have the house to myself.

Can't say how pleased I am that he's giving you space by staying at his mother's; you really need this and I'm convinced it'll make a big difference for you

Totally agree that the sneaky listening in is hardly the mark of a moral man, but despite his pretence you know perfectly well that he's not - and on that subject I'd recommend that you avoid at all costs any temptation to cover up for him, whether with the family or anyone else

It's also true that his self-image is unravelling, but that's his problem

His listening in is a disgrace and totally disrespectful of you and your privacy as an autonomous adult. He has no respect for your personal and emotional space.

That’s bad enough but then demanding an explanation for HIS hurt feelings for listening in.....this man child / ego toddler is just v entitled and deluded.

I can see how you were exasperated with this behaviour and then triggered into a rage and interaction that you didn’t plan to have. It’s almost like you are a furious mother at the end of her tether with a truculent defiant toddler. Time and space will be good - it’s not emotionally healthy for you to be around him at this time.

Try not to get hung up on needing a confession from him to justify what actions you may or may not take in the future .... just allow yourself to feel and attend to your emotions right now. Do you feel emotionally supported, cared for, encouraged, respected etc by him? Or does he drain and burden you?

I am glad that the therapist sounded promising. Keep concentrating on you.