Just told DH we don't have to have sex anymore. For his sake.

[Xmasdaymam]

We just had a big weepy chat by the kitchen sink whilst the kids were playing with their new toys.

We'd been a bit quiet for the past couple of days since I lightly asked if we could have sex sometime this week (it's been 2 months) and he went "Welllllll...." and I was like "wow, shot down!" and he tried to explain but I said "no need, let's just enjoy our night". And we did have a nice night but he was very quiet and preoccupied. There was no need to explain because I knew it was just that he didn't want to.

Because it has been 16 years of me raising the subject every couple of months. And yes we do usually have sex every couple of months. And we both enjoy it SOOO much. And say "we must do that more often". But then it disappears in him for another couple of months and tbh if I had no sex drive we would be completely sexless and he would be fine.

So this morning he asked if I was cross with him and I said I was more cross with myself because I should have said nothing. Because I KNEW. The definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different answer. And I was sorry for raising it at all, and I needed to accept him the way he was.

And then he got very upset and was like what kind of man am I? I'm supposed to do this. He said "it's never been in me. Not even when I was 19. The other lads would be mad for it and I couldn't understand it because I never needed it at all". And there were tears and us both apologising to each other, him for being the way he is and me for being the way I am.

I told him we could just be pals. Because we are such great pals. He said he didn't want that, that we could find a compromise but I pointed out that the past 16 years have been a compromise and I don't want pity shags every 6 months to keep me happy. I have a vibrator, I will keep my mouth shut and manage. He hates the thought of me unhappy. But I told him I have to learn to be happy with a different kind of relationship and I will keep my needs behind closed doors with my vibrator.

So then I went to have a shower but I am just in the bedroom crying. I wish I was different. I should be different. There are so many women on here who are happy if they never have sex again. I know I can't chop off my groin. But sometimes I wish I could and we would be content, we would be pals forever.

He has never masterbated, he has zero interest in porn. He's definitely not gay. He's just possibly asexual, or at least on that spectrum. I remember when we first moved in together getting a shock that we weren't all over each other now that we had our own place.

We only had sex twice on honeymoon and tbh I initiated both times and the second time was only because he sensed I was getting upset.

I am devastated. I am only 45. I am such a sexual person. I always have been. I want to be wanted so bad. I want to be fancied. But I have realised that if I was a man coming on here and he was the woman, I would get my arse handed to me for not accepting her the way she is.

Please guide me in how to have a sexless relationship that is still close and sweet. Because we love each other so much and I don't want to feel myself pulling away from all affection. But I fear I will do it unconsciously and it will actually affect our marriage going forward.

I don't know how I know he's not gay, I just..... know? I mean yuo can't prove a negative. He's very much a boobs guy. He fancies Nigella quite openly and has a definite thing for Miriam O'Callaghan (Irish people will get that, we're Irish btw).

We have family members who are gay and they have brought us to gay bars on birthdays etc. He is always comfortable but never particularly interested in the surroundings. He hasn't shown the slightest red (or rainbow?) flag.

But as someone said, we don't say this about low libido women.

He doesn't come from a religious family at all. He's an atheist.

I think it's just the way he's made.

I would bet good money when he was younger most of his sexual experiences were when he was pleasantly drunk at a house party. He would never have aggressively pursued someone. His exes all really liked him as a human being. None lasted long enough for them to notice probably, and all were casual anyway.

It took me 16 years to get to this point after all.

This has been my marriage for the last 20 years. In the last 6 months I decided to do the same as you and stop initiating any kind of sex as I couldnt stand the rejection any more.
It has made things worse if anything I am now effectively living with a house mate. There is no intimacy at all not even hug for Christmas.
I'm 50 and now regretting the years I have wasted.
Thinking about how I will be changing things for the future.

I think you definitely need to unpick your own thoughts towards libido and what is normal etc and what other people think.

I think you have reached the point where you have to face this on both sides.

Reading through t seems you wanted an answer that he couldnt give you - and I think actually you are right that isnt abnormal. If DH had asked me last night the same question in between everything going on for Christmas I may well have been equally non commital because it is forcing me into answering something I dont want.

You do I think have a point actually that if your DH wrote it from the perspective of a woman he would actually get support as well because I do think from your other answers some of this is on you.

Please look at counselling for both of you and proper open communication. Weirdly I think you may well be right - taking sex out of the picture whilst doing this is often a helpful move

Yes I remember threads where men basically say "she's never been that up for it if I'm honest" and they just get hammered.

I think I just have to leave him alone.

No OP you dont - you need to communicate with him and not be scared of it.

and get some counselling as well for both of you.

This is fixable but it needs work and acceptance on both sides that there is a need for compromise

I don't have much advice. DH interest fell of a cliff he got ill and now we have a houseful of teens and neither of us feel comfortable trying to restart things.

We were most days for the first 12 years.

Seriously starting going through the peri menopause has helped. Was frustrated in early to mid 40s now late 40s rarely think about it.

Be careful with 'normal' testosterone levels. The guidelines have changed a lot in the last few years. I had a test some years ago which was dismissed as 'normal' when, by today's standards, it should have been investigated.

OP, this has brought tears to my eyes. You both seem like such lovely people who obviously live and respect each other very much - what a lucky position you’re both in.

I have absolutely NO advice, but I do want you to know that I’m rooting for you both and genuinely hope that you can both find a way forward and some peace, however this works out.

@Xmasdaymam

Yes I remember threads where men basically say "she's never been that up for it if I'm honest" and they just get hammered.

I think I just have to leave him alone.

I've been here a while and have never seen that. The advice is the same, you don't have to give up your sex life on the whim of your OH. It's unfair and termination of the relationship is fine because of it.

Thank you so much, that's so kind.

If people knew how much of the mental load he carries, how much of the kids stuff, how much of the housework and the groceries and birthday and Christmas presents he gets involved in. He's a real life partner, a real buddy.

Ive had bad PND in the past and had huge caring responsibilities in the past also and been on anti-ds both times. He has been so supportive and always boosted me. I had a total career change and he was my biggest cheerleader. He isn't snappy, doesn't get personal, doesn't drink that much.

It's literally this one thing. I wish I could just ignore it completely.

So if you can’t ignore it completely, what are you going to do?

It’s a matter of

• counselling
• agreeing to a regular schedule
• separating

The last option is to accept it and enjoy your toys.

Why do you frame it as a 'pity fuck'? He loves you and wants to do what makes you happy - how is it any different to, say, going with you to an exhibition of Victorian plumbing and showing interest (which is what my utterly uninterested DH did with me because he knows I love domestic history)? Dh facilitates things that give me pleasure, even if he cannot comprehend the attraction. So your dh gives you sexual pleasure, even if your need for it is incomprehensible to him.

Maybe you could approach it differently. Not "you don't show me you love me" (he probably does, but in a different language) but "this is how I need to express my love for you".

Apart from sex, do you give and receive enough physical affection, gestures etc?

I agree that it isn't a "pity fuck" it happens less frequently than you would like but he is into you and enjoys it!

He is very huggy.

No problems with hugs. Loves a platonic cuddle, he does. He's very affectionate with the children too.

Kisses are pecks though.

He gives very thoughtful gifts. My gift today was silver jewellery from a shop I literally gasped in the window of two years ago on a trip and he still remembered.

He really does love me. Just last week he told me I was his constant North Star.

And he would say he does fancy me. He said that this morning to me. But then he said "it just doesn’t translate to wanting to do anything".

I don't think our definitions of fancying someone are the same.

But as someone said, we don't say this about low libido women

Of course we do, any woman who has never shown any level of physical sexual attraction to a man, the first question is is she gay. This isn’t he used to have a normal sex drive towards women, this is he’s never really had one. With any woman. Ever.

So it could be he’s asexual but it did beg the question is it not he’s gay and so deep in thr closet, no one, even uou would suspect.

Things like he says he fancies nigella or likes boobs, isn’t really a sign he isn’t. That’s school boy stuff.

It’s more, things like when he has sex, how long does he spend going down on uou and how much does he enjoy that, looking, touching, tasting, playing, or does that close proximity to female genitalia never occur. Ps I really don’t want to know. Just those are clear indicators when coupled sith not wishing sex.

The reason I ask is because asexual means he has little to no sexual attraction to anyone, male or female. But that’s not what you’re saying is happening, you’re saying he does, just when it comes to it, he never really wishes to have sex with you or any other woman and in his own words, never really has..

That he views it as a problem and seems to enjoy when it happens to me suggests he would be open to looking into potential medical or other causes if you want to discuss it. It's obviously causing problems and it won't improve without a lot of discussion and probably some trial and error to figure things out.

Sex hormones aren't the only thing that can cause low sex drive. I had mine tested and they came in normal, but I had issues elsewhere with nutritional deficiences and wonky other hormones which meant my body wasn't using what I was making properly (or at least that's how it was explained to me - one hormone off can throw off so many other systems even if the gonads are producing as normal). Once that was figured out and I got a handle on that, my sex drive did improve a lot but it took time and patience to do much with it as all that time with it low meant I had a lot of nerves and feelings of brokenness which also can stop sex drive. Esther Perel has a lot of writing on this that might help.

Finding out that was a big part of the issue took years (I was misdiagnosed based on my symptoms for 5 years, it took someone going back through all my blood tests and redoing them to figure out my sex hormones weren't ever the problem). In that time, there were tears and feelings of something wrong on both sides. Trying to just accept this because everything else was great did not work. We didn't become resentful, but those feelings of our bodies and wants being wrong festered - the corrosiveness sounds familiar (as does the we should do this more often and then it falling away, very guilty of that).

What helped us was for a time taking sex off the table, but only so we could focus on other types of intimacy. Because I didn't know if I would get aroused, I'd withdrawn other affection I associated with sex unintentionally and I had to recognize that I had to overcome my nerves and natural inertia to stick in with work or whatever rather than try sex. So we had time where we focused on cuddling in bed, showering together, walks while holding hands - little things up to making out or one or both of us masturbating with us both in the same space.

It sounds weird, feels really weird typing it out, but we also didn't have the honeymoon all over each other phase so it was kinda like starting our physical relationship again from scratch, testing and trying things (one common recommendation I found was making lists of things to try or using games like ForeplayinaRow [like Connect 4 only with foreplay suggestions] to take thinking out of the issue).

It was a balancing act of accepting my body as it is even with treatment isn't going to fit the ideal I'd built up in my head that I keep feeling down about not meeting and also accepting that I habitually was putting everything else first because of my own feelings and it wasn't going to get better if I didn't learn to put those things aside and make pleasure a priority.

Some men don’t want to have sex. Quite a big proportion probably struggle with the reality it it compared to how people expect men to be, with a voracious sexual appetite and always wanting it. That’s a myth of hyper-masculinity. Even very sexually motivated men generally slow down somewhat over the years.

There is nothing wrong with him not wanting sex. He’s not automatically in the wrong, gay, abusive, withholding affection, etc. Some men just don’t want it, ever. They can still be loving, affectionate, respectful, hard-working, kind, decent men who treat their wives/partners well and engaged fathers who carry their share of the load.

Quite a few men have come here asking for advice on this. Barring nasty, selfish, entitled misogynistic men who should be told straight out that they’re being arseholes, every man has been treated gently, been helped to talk through it intelligently and compassionately by many of us here, and assured that they are not in the wrong for missing sex/affection/intimacy/etc.

They are always told that if their wife or partner isn’t interested in ever having sex, then they are entitled to never have it again, that it should be respected and that it is wrong to pressure them or try to coerce them into it. They are also given assurances that they are not obligated to stay in a sexless marriage, and that we understand how soul-destroying it can be. They are always advised to think carefully about whether they think they can be happy without having sex again ever with the person they love, whether there is enough substance in the rest of the partnership to make it worth staying, or whether it would be kinder to both parties to have an amicable split and maintain a parenting partnership.

They are advised to talk about it honestly with their partner, and to try to navigate it carefully and with respect for each perspective.

Finally they are always advised that life really is short. That happiness is important.

(And the same holds true when it is a woman who is higher sexed and the man who doesn’t want it, which is a scenario which comes up more often than you might think)

It seems like a very strange problem. I think you need to see a psychologist, a good one.

@chaosisaladder

So if you can’t ignore it completely, what are you going to do?

It’s a matter of

• counselling
• agreeing to a regular schedule
• separating

The last option is to accept it and enjoy your toys.

I was going to suggest schedule but I didn’t because I didn’t want to be flamed.... I know it sounds formal a schedule but OP is in a bit of a desperate situation I reckon it can work. As there’s no issue with the actual performance or anything.

@Littleyell I think it’s a very real option for the OP. Especially if framed in the way of “this is how I express my affection and what I need to be fulfilled”. There has to be some give and take ( and a schedule (I’m not talking exact days but an agreement of X times a month) is appropriate. I think it would be cruel to deny these very basic needs that you have.

Op, I could have written this post almost word for word.

I don't think my husband is asexual as such but he has a low sex drive and over the years is gotten worse. We probably have sex 6 times a year tops.

I feel the same as you, when I bring it up I hate myself as mostly it makes me feel worse or I get my pity shag.

I'm not sure what the answer is. I don't want to leave him. We have a good marriage and a happy family. But I do feel sad that I don't have the sex life I want or envisioned. Like you op, when I see on here or real life women complaining about there husbands not leaving them alone I feel sad. I would love to feel so wanted and desirable.

Also - can he be considered asexual if when you do have sex, he enjoys himself? I think that is something key to explore because it is at the basis of our human nature - we like to do things again and again that give us pleasure

So a couple of things for you to check out:

1. Google "responsive desire". Does this sound like him? No active interest, but if you leap down the bed and lick him like a lolly with an attitude of 'I'll just see what happens, if he's not up for a shag after five minutes I'll go get my vibrator and he can hold my hand while I have some fun myself" does it end up with him going, "that was fun, must do it more often'? Or with him falling asleep and you crawling out from under the duvet going FFS!
2. other PPs have covered getting a check from the GP and this is just sensible, just to rule out anything that can be fixed quite simply

He sounds mainly lovely!
My OH is not the world's most frequent initiator, but I had a surge in libido about 8 years ago and would just drag him off to bed with the promise that we would just give it a go and if it turned out that his body just wanted to nap, we would just have a cuddle instead. Most of the time he would end up getting into it - I threatened to have "I like sex" tattooed on his blooming knuckles because it was SO OFTEN that he was "oh I don't know..." and ended up in a sweaty satisfied lump conked out cold!

I would say it's a bit different from when a woman doesn't want sex because for us IT HURTS if you're not into it AND IT STOPS US SLEEPING. Neither of these factors apply to your DH ?