Feel awful saying this but...

[Ginkpin]

Name changed for this post as I feel ashamed of how I feel, but I do need to clear my head about it.

I've been with DH for 25 years, married for 16. We met when we were both young (19/20). Our marriage has always been 'up and down' but recently, I have caught myself thinking 'you're so stupid' and I hate myself for it.

When we met, we were both very similar in outlook/views/goals etc. Neither of us is university educated - I knew what I wanted to do and very quickly got a job in my chosen field (broadcasting) and worked my way up. DH came from a family that struggled financially and university was not an option - he had to work to contribute to the household as soon as he'd finished his A-Levels. He worked bloody hard and has ended up as the Director of a small, but reasonably successful, company.

In the years since we met, I have continued to pursue my interests: art/reading/film/writing/music and always have a couple of books on the go and make an effort to see new and different films (although I enjoy big box office films as much as the next person), go to exhibitions (even if I'm not always sure I know much about the subject), ditto live music - and I write and get paid for my creative writing. As a caveat to all of this worthiness, I also enjoy shite tv, scrolling mindlessly through instagram and sport.

DH on the other hand has, over the years, stopped taking an interest in anything cultural. He hasn't read a book for years, can't seem to concentrate on a film or a tv show without falling asleep/forgetting what's happened/missing the point, has no interest in going to the cinema/theatre/exhibitions/concerts - anything really. He watches sport, spends hours looking at social media, works hard, pulls his weight, is not unkind, but not specifically thoughtful, and I've realised that we have nothing to talk about. If i suggest watching something/reading something, he can't be arsed and I honestly feel like he has wasted his brain through lack of exercise. I don't think I"m better or cleverer than him, but I do think I've kept my mind far more active and have far more interests and I am not sure what to do about how I feel.

I have to do all my hobbies with friends because he isn't interested and whilst he has no objection - he's very happy for me to go out and do stuff - I'm sad that I can't share any of it with my partner.

Forgive the long post, but this suddenly feels like a deal-breaker and I don't know if that is massively unfair (I am peri meno and this is suddenly bothering me so much more than it ever has).

I feel angry and sad and just don't know what to do.

Menopause has nothing to do with it. Don’t let that stop you from addressing what is clearly an issue for you.

Agree with @TonMoulin — I don’t like to see women dissuading other women of the importance of things because of ‘hormones’.

I suspect the reason the OP feels the longtime situation is now unbearable is because she recognises this is it for the rest of her life if she doesn’t act, and is looking at a marriage with nothing to sustain it for decades to come.

@maigue I studied history of art and history before converting over to study for my profession. My husband has no self driven interest in art and no knowledge. When we go to art galleries with dc I will talk to both dc and my husband about anything significant about the paintings and about their historical context, and my husband will engage and talk and ask questions not because he has a self driven interest but because he finds what I am saying interesting. Because it is interesting and I can make it sound interesting. There is nothing infantalising about this.

If I read something interesting I can say “hey listen to this” and read it out loud to get his interest. There is nothing infantalising about this. Often when you hear authors read their own work you get a different insight into what they have written because of the timing and emphasis the author gives to their own work. There is nothing infantalising about this.

You have engaged your 8 year old, you say, and so you don't need to drag him kicking and screaming anywhere. But what if you met someone who had a different interest from you, who was keen to share it – would you go and encourage your 8 year to listen?

I used the phrase “kicking and screaming” in humour. I hope that the above gives a better insight into what I meant. It is not infantalising.

I understand the OP is lonely and that her husband is not engaged. One suggestion is to get him engaged in her interests by making it interesting for him – I don't think you should mock the idea. I suspect the problems are more deep seated between them but I don't know that for sure, but saying “he is brainless, dump him” isn't helpful.

@Ginkpin I am really sorry, I somehow missed you had replied to me. DH references his lack of University education sometimes as though this makes him somehow 'less' I think that this is slightly confusing because on the one hand he regrets not having gone to uni and he feels embarrassed about conversation and on the other he has no interest in new things. But thinking outside the box here, would he be interested in doing a open uni course,and if so what subject would he be interested in? Something related to his business? Would him doing this help the relationship?

Some people’s apathy can suck the life force from the people who are with them. It’s depressing.

If “hormones” mean that the OP is worried about spending the rest of her life with someone who watches sport and scrolls social media then hormones are a blessing.
It is probably that hormonal changes occur at age when women are more assertive and less likely to put others’ needs before their own.

It would be a deal-breaker for me. He doesn’t sound like a bad man but he does sound desperately boring.

Very tricky when a marriage gets to this stage, would you consider couples counselling to save your marriage? You are setting out your agenda but do you know what your husband wants? If you read the threads on this board you will see the themes that men have affairs when they feel neglected and unappreciated and you will also see that women starting over in mid life don’t find it easy to find decent new partners. Is that the future you want? I had a DP for a while, his XW was a very well connected artist and philanthropist, he supported her and provided for the family but he was entirely neglected. In the end he could see all her good qualities but all he wanted was someone who had time for him, who wanted to cuddle up to him at night. He really wanted to be able to stay but the bitterness about their lack of intimate relationship drove him away. I guess she is still impressing her acquaintances and colleagues and that was what was more important to her.

@MysololifeI would consider anything, but DH doesn't see a particular problem so would not be particularly open to couples counselling. Yes, I'm pretty sure his self-esteem is low. Yes he has historical emotional baggage. Yes he has insecurities but as far as he is concerned, all of this can be dealt with by avoidance and by staying within his comfort zone. He doesn't see a problem because he has - by opting out of everything - managed to eliminate any situations that might put him under pressure or cause him to feel shit about himself.

The price of that is that I now have a marriage to someone who chooses an 'easy life' within the realms of what is comfortable for him, above all else. And what is comfortable for him, is dull as fuck for me and becoming mind-numbingly soul destroying.

He IS good person and has many redeeming features. He has the ability to make me really laugh (on the rare occasion he is 'switched on') , he is affectionate, he is generous and means well. I am grateful for the hard work and effort he has put into giving me and the DC a life that is much more secure than anything he ever had and I am not in the midst of some fantasy where I leave him and find the man that ticks all the boxes. I love him.

I just don't know if that's enough any more.

I guess the question is, in what way would your life be better if you split up? What would you do that you can't currently?

If you were suddenly travelling for work somewhere exciting a couple of times a month, would that scratch the itch?

How would you feel about not seeing your kids part of the week when he has them. Or if they want to spend Christmas with him and a new stepmum and siblings? It doesn't take much imagination when you read all the other posts on here.

Finally, if you are looking to go down that route, I would always suggest renting a one bed flat, and you and your husband rotating half the week there and half at the house. You both get freedom (and a taste of single reality) but the kids get stability. I think a lot of marriages could be saved with a bit of space.

Also everyone is extra dull and boring at the moment and you're talking in big sweeping statements at the moment. My daughter who always loved adventure got agoraphobic in lockdown and had to be gently coaxed out. I'm normally a voracious reader but with everything going on my attention span is shot. And you're obviously feeling trapped like most of us. Just go easy on yourself and him x

@Username642243 brilliant advice !

OP if you separate you will exchange one set of problems (known ) for another set ( unknown)

You are describing my marriage so accurately it's spooky. Me and DH have almost nothing in common.

But do you know what? It doesn't matter. I do all my stuff alone or with friends. He doesn't hold me back in the slightest.

He is hard working , funny and kind and we love each other and he ALWAYS has my back

Is your general frustration at the whole of life (Covid) making you feel worse? Surely, in normal times, you can visit theatres, art galleries, meet up with friends etc etc. No one person can satisfy everyone's needs and I don't think you should expect your DH to fulfill you all the time.

Life is very dull and boring for most of us at the moment (I am totally bored with my own company) and I am sure many couples feel like you do without the 'outside' stimulation most of us get from activities, friends, just going to different places etc etc.

Think very carefully before leaving your marriage, really imagine what it would be like living alone .... you may decide that's what you want but I don't think now is the time to rush into a major decision.

His emotional baggage and avoidant behaviours will not be giving him peace and they are now draining you. He can put all of that to bed with counselling - but if he is not prepared to budge for your happiness then you need to know that and he needs to know that his actions and intransigence have consequences.

There’s lots of good advice on here which should help. Those of us lucky enough to still be in work despite covid are still having a tough time, being hemmed in, stuck at home. Add in the peri menopause and the fact your children are growing up and having independent lives and this is all adding to your issue. Your marriage can be rescued if that it what you want, you must tell him how ‘Mr Ginkpin, I am feeling very unhappy about our life and I want you to take this seriously and come with me to counselling. If you don’t we may not be able to resolve this and could end up getting divorced’ then stand your ground. You have to be prepared that he will tell you he is also unhappy and why. There is no real fairytale ending to this, as another poster said it’s swapping one set of problems for another. I escaped a very unhappy (not just tedious) marriage several years ago and have been mainly single by choice but never been happier than I am now. It’s not been that easy at times but was right decision. Thinking about the previous DP’s XW I think had she met me she would have considered me very much inferior because she completely failed to understand what he wanted and needed. In the end if you cannot reconcile to a future with him work out an amicable split and let him find someone new who is happy with him.

Surely, in normal times, you can visit theatres, art galleries, meet up with friends etc etc. No one person can satisfy everyone's needs and I don't think you should expect your DH to fulfill you all the time.

Of course that would be true if it was one minor or specific aspect of her life her DH wasn't fulfilling -- that's why we all have a constellation of different people in our lives. DH doesn't care for opera, so I go with one of a couple of friends who love it and are knowledgeable about it, and we have very different tastes in the visual arts, and though that can be really interesting, in that we stretch one another (I don't think I'd have considered going to a Dan Flavin exhibition without him, and I loved it), I know DH found going on holiday with me to Florence kind of exhausting, because I would happy spend all my time looking at paintings, and he got a bit tired of virgins, annunciations and Medicis.

But the OP says she's married to a monosyllabic teenager whose mind has atrophied, who has no interest in anything, and can't even follow the plot of a TV programme without falling asleep. I think that's a way bigger issue than 'I wish my spouse liked X'.

My aunt once said "men grow slippers in their middle age, women grow wings".

I've read all your posts, but not all the replies.

I started a thread on here about my first husband about twelve years ago. It was in a similar vein but not as well articulated as you. I got my arse handed to me. It was horrible. I can still dig it out if you're interested.

There were other things but basically it came down to our lack of compatibility and growth I guess?

Anyway we did split. I have married someone who is emotionally and educationally more compatible. It just works. We never run out of conversation. We have differing hobbies but can converse about life, the universe and everything. Not high brow but just get on. And laugh loads.

@KatherineJaneway

I don't think I"m better or cleverer than him

That's how it comes across to me. His interests are now just different to yours but he has no objection to you pursuing hobbies, he just doesn't want to share them.

Personally I wouldn't want to ditch a partner of that length because they didn't like the same books or films as I do. I'd think long and hard about this as you may find the grass a great deal less greener.

I agree with this.

Sorry OP but it does sound like you are approaching this from a bit of a self-centred viewpoint. Your hobbies are no more mindful or meaningful than his. I suspect he works so hard at work that he wants to chill at home. Whereas you want to pursue your hobbies.

I would hazard a guess that most long term couples have quite different hobbies. After all, to be everything to someone isn't really possible.

He sounds like a lovely husband and personally I'd work on finding happiness in the moments together than trying to change him. If you end the marriage I suspect you'll find the person you meet who loves your hobbies has more serious downsides.

But this isn't about 'hobbies', it's a mindset. The OP is struggling with the fact that the man she loves and has committed to appears to have zero mental life, and no desire to have any horizons beyond social media, football, and she's trying to decide whether she wants to continue to be married to someone with literally nothing to say. That might suit a fellow couch-potato, but that clearly isn't the OP.

Yes, this really isn't about wanting shared hobbies, although that would be nice. Following the plot of a tv programme isn't a 'hobby' and doesn't require huge amounts of effort, but we now don't even do that. I save things that I think he will enjoy together, Breaking Bad type boxsets for example, and he watches half of one and then starts looking at his phone or says he's tired, or falls asleep or whatever. Equally, he can put a film on half way through and watch it even though he has missed half an hour. That to me is an indication of zero engagement.

I don't need him to traipse round National Trust Ruins with me - just share the odd book, show interest in something that interests me or even feign it convincingly be passionate about something that he is interested in, talk to be about something I don't know much about with life in his eyes, engage with the wider world, speculate, ponder, wonder, consider, just anything other than 'What do you fancy for dinner?'.

I hate myself for feeling like this, but I just want him to be more.

@cheesecrackersandcorona i am really pleased for you, you sound really happy. I would like to see the thread you mentioned, would you mind sending me a link by PM, or on here? Thank you

I've had a good look on the app but no luck. Will try again on the desktop version tomorrow.

I'm sure it was 'I seem to have married a big dependent baby' and it would have been in Relationships. Dates muddled up and would have been about 2010/11 I think?

No idea what my user name would have been. It still existed a few years ago so wouldn't have been in chat.

[quote ishouldnotbeonhere]@cheesecrackersandcorona i am really pleased for you, you sound really happy. I would like to see the thread you mentioned, would you mind sending me a link by PM, or on here? Thank you[/quote]
Oh and I should mention that XH is in a happy relationship too. Strangely she seems very clever and cultured so maybe it was just me with the problem? Either way we both moved on really quickly and are still with those people.

If he's overweight, drinking too much, tired & falling asleep, he might have obstructive sleep apnoea.

Or diabetes.

Or just be low in mood, bored & boring.

@cheesecrackersandcorona, sometimes I think that a new relationship shocks someone into bringing their A-game. Not even necessarily a romantic relationship — I made a work friend I bonded with over a shared love for French, which we both had degrees in. We lent one another books and discussed them, saw the occasional French film together, and he seemed like a thoroughly culturally-engaged person, but because we lived nowhere near one another, I only met his wife and saw him in his home environment much later. To my shock, he was completely different, and seemed to come home from work and zone out. He seemed to spend evenings and weekends on the sofa with one eye on Dave reruns and the other on Twitter.

i think you have to have the ability to talk, because if you can't, if sex drive wears off, once you both get a bit older, what else is there, especially if you are a curiously minded person (and not everyone is)? there's no replacement for a good chat, someone you can connect with mentally. Although I am no longer with my ex, we coparent our child so see a lot of each other and are never short of conversations, this is what keeps us friendly and working together as we parent our son. If you're in a relationship but with an an intellectual mismatch it's pretty much dead from that point as far as I am personally concerned. Of course, everyone has different wants / needs, so this may matter less to you. But having spent years in relationships whereby I was not on the same level as my exes, I can think of nothing worse. How can you find romance with someone who you can't really talk to?