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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Not as attractive as

155 replies

SillySallySingsASong · 01/08/2020 13:23

I feel really stupid typing this but I'm going to anyway because I need people to (kindly) tell me to get a grip.

I'm mid 40s. I've been seeing a man (early 50s) since November.

I met several of his friends and their partners before lockdown and a couple since. Everyone was really welcoming and friendly and they all seem like nice people.

It bothers me that all of his friends have partners who are slim and very attractive. I'm not. I'm a stone heavier than I'd like but, even if I lost it, I still wouldn't be slim and I still wouldn't be anymore attractive.

I'm pretty average looking and I know his exes have all been slim and attractive too.

Firstly, it makes me feel inadequate and I'm very conscious that everyone in the room knows I'm less attractive than them/their partners. It makes me feel awkward for him and I hold back from being affectionate etc because I don't want to embarrass him Sad. Secondly, he was single for 5 years or thereabouts before meeting me and I'm conscious that he might just be 'settling' because I know that although he was content being single and had forged a nice life out for himself, he really does want a 'life partner'. I'm confident that I'm not the woman he would have wanted or imagined himself to he with.

I was also single for a few years. I have no problem with being single or fears of relationships ending. My only real fear is being with someone who has a little pang of 'sadness' at not having been able to attract the sort of woman they want/used to he able to attract or with someone who is settling for me because they want a partner and I'm willing so better than nothing.

I know all the stuff about it being more than looks etc but I can't help how I feel.

OP posts:
Toilenstripes · 01/08/2020 13:28

I’m not sure anyone could be as unkind to you as you are being to yourself. I felt so sad reading your op. Why do you think of yourself so meanly? Don’t you realise that there is a sad soul within you that deserves to be loved and accepted without judgement?

Sugartitties · 01/08/2020 13:37

well they might be thinking that but it only matters that he finds you attractive.

namechange12a · 01/08/2020 13:42

OP he's hardly settling if he's been single for five years. It just goes to show how low your self esteem is, that you see it as him settling rather than having found the right one.

Your insecurity and low self esteem is having a detrimental effect on your life. It has nothing to do with anyone else and no one is making you feel anything. You are responsible for your feelings.

You can help how you feel. Take responsibility for yourself and your own happiness.

PinkyBrain · 01/08/2020 13:49

Agree op it’s all objective isn’t it and we can’t see you to be able to tell you you are actually stunning or indeed truly hideous (Grin) but I bet you’re nowhere near as unfortunate looking as you are painting yourself here, we are all our own worst critic.

You probably have some wonderful qualities about you that some of the other slimmer partners envy, an easy, friendly personality, good friendships, a lovely smile. You’re focusing on the superficial stuff as you assume he will be but if he’s with you then he obviously sees something attractive about you so believe him.

sofato5miles · 01/08/2020 13:57

I have just started dating someone. He is 8 years ypunger than me, for context in the attraction stakes. He is attractive and financially comfortable.

We were talking about attractiveness and what women and men over edtimate and fear as physical deal breakers.

I am a size 14/16 as have put on a stone over covid. My stomach is a car crash.

He fears going bald. I fear being too fat. He laughed and said all girls do but the 'something to grab' really does it for him. Many men feel the same, though of course i know not all do.

Your boyfriend will be the same, i am sure. Othwrwise why would he be dating you, he certainly doesn't have to

Sunshineonrainydays · 01/08/2020 14:07

Hi OP,

A lot of what you have written resonates with me hugely. I'm around the same age as you and I'm overweight (about 1.5 stones, I've recently lost 4 stone) and I am very plain at best. I feel just like you feel. Even if I lost more weight I'd still be stuck with my plain face!
I am fully aware though that if I could find a way to boost my confidence and self esteem it would make my life so much better. I have been considering counselling for some time (for this and other reasons). Have you thought about counselling?

Have you been put down by people in the past? I know I have and these comments stay with you forever and often at the expense of any nice comments you have ever received.

I feel that your partner is with you because he wants to be. He finds you attractive inside and out otherwise why is he with you?
You mention his ex's are slim and attractive but they are ex's for a reason.
I know that in my DH's case his ex's were all better looking than me but they all cheated on him and moved onto someone they thought was better than him. He is with me because he loves me but also because he didn't want a carbon copy of his past partners. He wanted someone he could be happy with and I feel that is what this man has found with you.

Why not talk to him about how you feel? I think communication is the key here.
Does he make you feel wanted, does he compliment you, does he show he is attracted to you, are you compatible? These are all questions you need to ask yourself. Be careful not to let your insecurities push him away if he is someone you want to be with and he wants to be with you.

You talk about him 'settling' for you but I think you are projecting your anxieties onto him here. Has he ever said anything to you or acted in a way that makes you feel this could be true?

When you met there must have been an initial attraction for both of you. As others have said we are our own worst critic and we often look in the mirror and see only flaws. I have been told that people find my smile and laugh attractive and I think if your personality shines through the looks side of things really don't matter. I bet you have lots of lovely features both looks wise and in your personality.

I think you need to try and relax and see where the relationship goes.

I wish you luck OP. Flowers

SillySallySingsASong · 01/08/2020 16:52

Thank you for the replies. I feel a little reassured just reading them.

Why do you think of yourself so meanly? I feel like I'm just being honest with myself and pragmatic.

Sugartitties yes, you're right. I know that in my head but its the feelings of shame and guilt that I struggle with most.

You can help how you feel. Take responsibility for yourself and your own happiness I knew that when I typed it really. I feel ok about myself in general life it's just in relationships where I feel like this.

PinkyBrain Grin well I'm neither stunning nor truly hideous. Just a bit 'meh' but when his friends partners are all so beautiful or attractive or cute... I mean, there's one who is a mutual friend. She's nearly 20 years older than me but she's pretty and petite and she's just so 'cute' and so lovely. I fail to see how anyone wouldn't fall in love with her! I don't have any of those things.

sofato5miles he has similar fears, which is why I worry he might be 'settling'. A bit of a, "look at her, she's beautiful. What would she see in a bald, slightly paunchy 50something..? Sad" vs what he sees when he looks at me.

Sunshineonrainydays I have had counselling. I'm ok in every day life it's the issue of relationships that floors me a bit.

We met up with a couple of his friends yesterday. She is beautiful. Real fresh faced, model looks. She's tall, slim, long blonde hair, tanned, perfect skin, big green eyes, perfect bone structure... literally on every marker she is objectively more attractive then me. (And really sweet and lovely to boot!) I'm the opposite in every respect! My bf and she are really good friends and have a close bond, which I really like to see. He's got a lot of friends who clearly love him dearly. I'm not jealous and I don't feel threatened - I don't really work like that. I just feel a bit inadequate. And guilty.

I know he likes me - he spends a fair amount of time with me, so I'm assuming he does! But I don't think he finds me particularly attractive. He doesn't tell me I am but then, I don't really need him to and it isnt really true anyway... I know what I look like. But he is very attentive to my needs and idiosyncracies and i feel very cared about. He puts me and my needs above his own all the time and he's very respectful.

I just feel he deserves so much more than me.

OP posts:
backseatcookers · 01/08/2020 17:10

I just feel he deserves so much more than me.

This made me want to cry. When I've been in an unhealthy relationship OR not been in the right headspace for a healthy relationship, this is how I've felt.

You can't be (IMO) in a healthy relationship when you feel this way, because you feel either that you're super lucky they want you or that they are lying to you when they say you're what the want. That leads to sabotage even though they most likely DO want you, how you are, and feel just as lucky as you.

I personally believe that being in the headspace you're in at the moment leads to unhealthy relationships and further hurt. And that you should focus on rebuilding your confidence and self worth outside of a relationship before entering another one.

It's an amazing feeling going from feeling worthless to feeling like... do you know what? I'm nice, I'm fun, I'm attractive, I'm kind... I AM a catch! I never thought I would feel that way. I didn't realise people genuinely did feel that way!

That's why I'm 33 and probably in my first healthy relationship. It's so worth the heartache of self exploration, therapy (in my case), getting sober (in my case) and all the other hard work that got me here.

SillySallySingsASong · 01/08/2020 17:14

I think what's brought it home today is that we're going to meet up with a couple of my friends later. She is also really pretty, incredibly 'cute', lovely, sweet, socially adept... again all things i don't feel that I am.

I just feel that I compare unfavourably to all the women he and I know. I just feel like he's being short changed.

I wouldn't share these thoughts with him. It's not fair to put it onto him, it's not his problem to 'fix', I don't want to push him away and I wouldn't want him to misinterpret it and think I'm jealous. Because I'm really not. He's got a very longstanding female friend who he meets up with regularly. She is also pretty and petite and also looks much younger than her years 🙄 I've not met her but I'm not bothered about it the slightest. But I do feel that she is just one more woman i compare unfavourably to.

OP posts:
SillySallySingsASong · 01/08/2020 17:23

It's an amazing feeling going from feeling worthless to feeling like... do you know what? I'm nice, I'm fun, I'm attractive, I'm kind... I AM a catch! I never thought I would feel that way. I didn't realise people genuinely did feel that way!

That's exactly how I feel when I'm single though. Exactly that. When I'm single, I feel confident, sexy, hoistically attractive. I also think I'm a catch... I've been single for a 2 or 3 years and I thought I might be ready for a relationship. It just saddens me to think that I'm not.

I've had all the counselling. Last time I went, I was discharged because I was ok. And I really felt ok. But within weeks of starting seeing him, it all came flooding back. Being in a relationship seems to magnify all of my flaws to me and holds a mirror up to them too.

OP posts:
T00FarT0Travel · 01/08/2020 22:00

My philosophy is that we all have equal worth ( why wouldn't we be equal ?)

It doesn't matter what you look like

The nicest people are the; kindest, funniest, want to spend time with you, talk with you, listen, help you, any age, race, gender

Love yourself

Put your energy & thoughts into a more worth while cause

Charley50 · 01/08/2020 22:19

I really get where you are coming from OP, but it's so destructive. Someone isn't better company or a better catch than you, just because you perceive them to be prettier, slimmer or more fashionable. We all have qualities that make us good company, fun, sexy, great to talk to, nice to spend time with etc. It's really not all about how we look, although I do feel that social media and media in general would have us believe that.

Craftycorvid · 01/08/2020 22:53

What’s your relationship history? Notice any patterns? What messages did you get about yourself growing up?

Wherearemymarbles · 01/08/2020 23:00

Looks arnt every thing - in my 20’s I ended a relationship with an extremely successful model, who was properly stunning, 5.10, 36-24-36 figure because ultimately the sex was crap, I found her boring and never saw her - unimaginably beautiful but I just never felt it. Maybe I felt unworthy, who know’s.

Also i’ve never really trusted another woman’s view of beauty - ‘you need to meet so and so, she’ stunning ’ so you meet so and so and she perfectly ok but far less beautiful that the person who introduced you who thinks she is a bit if a heffer.

End of the day, he might be settling or he might not go for slim women or blond hair or green eyes. You cant really second guess him I’m afraid.

Cam2020 · 01/08/2020 23:13

Attraction is more than just how someone looks though. Have you ever seen someone and thought they were very attractive, only to meet them and not actually be attracted to them at all?

You're doing yourself a huge disservice! I know for a fact what I find attractive now in my late 30s is different to what I thought was attractive in my 20s. This man wants someone to share his life with, not a shallow trophy to show off.

CrazyToast · 01/08/2020 23:17

Why is conventional attractiveness something someone 'deserves', though? Many people are more attracted to the person, the personality, the je ne sais quois. You are putting these views upon him, he most likely doesnt feel like that at all. An attractive person isnt actually more valuable than an unattractive person.

However I do understand how you feel, for sure. I also have deep deep issues about my appearance and self-wroth, despite knowing that how I feel is based on nothing real.

I don't know the answer but it is good you have identified your thoughts as something not good that you need to address. Good luck.

MarkRuffaloCrumble · 01/08/2020 23:19

I know exactly how you’re feeling. My DP’s ex is what every man is looking for looks-wise - tall, slim, long blonde hair, big fake boobs etc and I’m the absolute opposite. Older than him, short, fat, brunette and objectively just not the sort of woman you would choose as arm candy.

However, both he and I know that I am awesome! I’m loving and giving, I make him feel like a king, he loves how much I adore him, and I think (somewhat sadly!) that’s the source of many men’s attraction. When you look at who they choose to have affairs with, it isn’t always someone younger, blonder, more attractive, it’s often the ordinary looking, sometimes older woman, who treats him like he’s fascinating and irresistible!

I know that, with the best will in the world, I’m never going to compete on looks with someone young and toned who spends time on hair and make up etc, so I don’t bother.

I’m presentable and I draw on some eyeliner and lippy for a special occasion, but what I bring to the table is more than that. I look at him with true love and desire, tell him he’s the most handsome man I’ve ever known (true!) and tickle his back and keep him happy in bed every day. When he says he fancies scones and jam, I pop out to the kitchen and twenty minutes later they are there on a plate for him.

When he sees something on TV and says it’s cool, I remember it and get it for him as a gift. He appreciates how thoughtful and kind I am, not just to him but to everyone. He knows he’s lucky to have me, and tells everyone he knows what an amazing person I am. He treats me like I’m beautiful and sexy, can’t keep his hands off my (ample) body, and - except for a couple of thoughtless comments in the early days about me not being “his type of woman” but how he loved me anyway Angry - he hasn’t ever made me feel anything but wonderful.

It’s a little concerning that your DP doesn’t tell you that he finds you sexy and beautiful. It isn’t just “a fact” that you’re unattractive - looks are totally subjective and he should find you gorgeous even if you wouldn’t make it onto the front cover of Vogue! But I guess if he makes you feel loved and appreciated maybe you can push him for a little reassurance on the other stuff? But know that whatever you have to offer, it will be more enduring than youthful good looks!

SillySallySingsASong · 02/08/2020 11:37

T00FarT0Travel and Charley50 I know this in my head but it's hard to hold onto it emotionally.

I tried online dating a few years ago and my real life experience was amplified on there. I met a few men who didn't think I was slim enough (and I was a stone lighter then) or compared me unfavourably to their exes or said I wasn't what they were looking for looks wise, even when we had a great connection and got on well. It kind of reinforced everything I suppose.

What’s your relationship history? Notice any patterns? What messages did you get about yourself growing up? not great tbh. My relationship history is littered with short term flings. Nothing really real. Certainly not loving or respectful. This is guy is the polar opposite in many ways. Good and bad. What I mean by that is that he doesn't shower me with insincere compliments or, for example, but he does treat me with respect. I was always told growing up that I wasn't pretty and didn't have a good enough figure for a man to fall in love with me or adore me and that I needed to work on my flawed personality instead. I just accepted that, hence only ever having short term flings and not real relationships.

After a whole load of counselling and therapy, I know that's wrong but my feelings about myself haven't caught up with it because I still see the evidence out there.

Also i’ve never really trusted another woman’s view of beauty - ‘you need to meet so and so, she’ stunning ’ so you meet so and so and she perfectly ok but far less beautiful that the person who introduced you who thinks she is a bit if a heffer. ha, it's a nice idea! Don't get me wrong, I don't think I'm 'ugly', just quite plain. I can scrub up ok but it requires effort! I went out with someone in my 20s who would walk 6 feet in front of me when we were out. He explained that he was taller than me so had a longer stride and that explained it. But it was always a constant 6 feet in front. I later discovered that it was because he was a bit embarrassed to be seen with me because of my looks. Stuff like that is hard to get past and just added weight to my belief and existing 'evidence'.

Cam2020 yes, I know. I hope you're right...

CrazyToast and MarkRuffaloCrumble I suppose I just don't want to feel that I constantly need to make up for the fact that I'm not attractive enough - give him reasons to stay with me in spite of that... it's not just a case of finding someone else who does find me attractive. It's not been immediately apparent but its transpired that pretty much everyone I've dated felt inadequate about themselves in some way and so thought they couldn't do any better.

I wouldn't want to seek reassurance from him. I dont want him to tell me I'm attractive because he feels he ought to, I want him to tell me because he think its true.

I've tried telling myself that he does and I should know I am so he doent need to tell me... but, in reality, i know that if he did think so, then he wouldn't be able to help but tell me because people do. I suppose I ought to be grateful that he isnt fake and doesnt lie!

I've also tried telling myself that he is with me for a reason but, as so many posts on MN show, there are a lot of men who will be in a relationship for the wrong reasons - convenience, easier than being alone, appearances, sex...

MarkRuffaloCrumble you sound awesome!

OP posts:
Brightyellow · 02/08/2020 11:44

You know an awful lot of ‘sweet, petite, cute, lovely women’ Confused.

I’m sure they’re just normal women and wouldn’t want to be categorised like that. Honestly can’t you just see them as a whole person.

Your way of thinking is really unhealthy and your guy obviously doesn’t see it the same way.

TwentyViginti · 02/08/2020 11:58

You're dating a balding, paunchy man in his 50s who never compliments you. Take him off that pedestal you've placed him on.

SillySallySingsASong · 02/08/2020 12:00

I do yes. And whilst they are obviously more than that, that is what attracts men to them. which is the perspective I was talking from.

I guess I just have no idea at all what, if anything, he is attracted to in me. And I don't want to ask because I'm not sure I'd want to hear the answer.

And I want to be with someone who is with me because of everything I am and not in spite of everything I'm not. But I haven't found that yet.

OP posts:
SillySallySingsASong · 02/08/2020 12:11

TwentyViginti there's obviously a lot more to him that! Those are just the things about himself that he feels have held him back in meeting someone in recent years.

He has no idea what my insecurities are. I don't reveal them. I'd imagine he thinks I'm confident and self assured because other than not particularly wanting my photo taken, I never say anything.

I don't want to be 'needy' and insecure so I feign contented self assuredness and quiet confidence. Besides, the most he could do would be to reassure me that those things don't bother him rather than tell me I'm wrong for thinking them. And I'm not sure I want to hear that either...

OP posts:
Sunshineonrainydays · 02/08/2020 12:33

Op, you’ve had extensive counselling but what about CBT? I feel you need to ‘reprogram’ yourself for want of a better term. You have experienced some very unpleasant comments and behaviours starting from childhood. These comments say much more about the person saying them than you. Have you thought of it from that perspective? Nasty hurtful comments wear you down and stay with you which I know only too well myself. But I know that I am a good person and have lots of good traits that are far more important to me than looks. I feel the same could be said for you. You come across as intelligent and articulate and I bet you also have lots of other positive aspects about you including your looks. But you are letting past hurt ruin any chance of future happiness.

The awful ex who walked 6ft in front of you is an awful person. You were too good for him. You need to realise that soulless people like that are not worthy of you, not the other way around.

Your partner now was single for several years before meeting you. Surely he would stay single rather than be with you just because you are there? Do you enjoy each other’s company? Does he make you happy? Does he show he is attracted to you intimately? Can you tell he desires you? These are all things you need to think about. But you also need to work on yourself and your self esteem. You mentioned that it is only when you are in relationships that you start thinking and feeling like this. That is why you need to find out what is causing this and why I suggested CBT as a way to try and change your thinking and your behaviour patterns in relationships.

Bbq1 · 02/08/2020 12:41

Op, who tells you are 'less attractive ' than his exes abd other women? Why are you confident that you wouldn't be his true choice of partner? Why, even if you lost weight (in your mind as weight is not a barometer for attractiveness btw)would you not be perceived as attractive?
Thr answer to all of the above us YOU, op. It's sad how down on yourself you are. Please have some confidence in yourself and stop beating yourself unmoved perceived issues. I'm sure you are attractive but being attractive is so much more than looks. Qualities such as kindness and sense of humour maje up a person, conventially 'attractive ' or not. I would say that do is fussy over his partner if he has been single for 5 years but surely then it's a compliment that you are his first relationship in that time?

SillySallySingsASong · 02/08/2020 13:57

Sunshineonrainydays I was screened for CBT but told it was appropriate for what I needed. I do use CBT strategies to manage my responses and expressed feelings etc but it hasn't really changed how I feel inside.

As for my bf now, I've told myself all of those things about him. That he has been single for a good few years and he is quite content to be single. He said it took quite a while for him to 'give up' part of his life for me and to factor me into his plans etc. Which I get. I've been single for a few years too and, when you have your life the way you want it - friends, hobbies, work, down time etc - all mapped out and it works for you, it requires a change in mindset to accommodate someone else.

So, whilst I think he was content to be single, he wasn't happy and what he really wants is someone to share his life with.

Again, yes, i know it says more about the people who said them. I understand all of that which is what i mean by i know it in my head but it hasn't changed how i 'feel'.

He spent a lot of time being the third wheel in friendships with other couple and I think its nice for him to feel that that isnt the case anymore - has someone to go to parties, events, gigs etc with. Things he always did, but wasn't truly comfortable doing alone.

As for the other questions, I understand they were rhetorical but they are things I've considered. He isn't often physically demonstrative. He can go for a whole evening and maybe only touch me once or twice, doesn'treally kiss me spontaneously very often or put his arm round me. But I know from reading on here that a lot of people aren't physically demonstrative and that doesnt bother me as such. He asks to see me, he doesn't cancel on me, I get invited to things with his friends, the relationship doesn't revolve around sex, he refers to me as his partner/girlfriend but generally indirectly.

I enjoy being with him. It's easy - we talk a lot and silences are comfortable and sometimes we'll just get on and do our own thing when we're together for a weekend. Which I'm comfortable with.

Bbq1 tbf, some of his friends have said so too. Not directly, but things like, "we're so glad he's with you. He deserves to he with someone lovely who'll treat him well. He's brought dates to things before but its obvious he's only with them because of their looks and they've not been right for him..." that type of thing.

Why are you confident that you wouldn't be his true choice of partner? Why, even if you lost weight (in your mind as weight is not a barometer for attractiveness btw)would you not be perceived as attractive? because, ideally, I think he probably saw himself with someone slim, with a good body and who is beautiful. Like most men, I guess. Someone who'll look good in a bikini on the beach. That sort of thing. Not someone who he has to justify being with to himself because I've got a 'nice personality' Sad

I am aware that my perspective on this is somewhat skewed. My parents put a huge amount of emphasis on looks. My dad left for someone who was, essentially, a younger version of my mum. The first time I met her, she was wearing almost the exact same outfit I'd left my mum in her house wearing! Similar hair cut, similar interests etc just younger.

I have had at least two 'relationships' end because the man wanted, or found, someone younger than me.

And I wouldn't disagree that he is quite fussy - I think he was probably looking in all the wrong places - women who were young, slim and beautiful... which is why I feel that he is 'setting' now, having realised he doesn't have the pulling power he might once have had Sad

I feel bad saying that now, like I'm doing him a huge disservice Sad he's actually a very nice man.

OP posts: