Not as attractive as

[SillySallySingsASong]

I feel really stupid typing this but I'm going to anyway because I need people to (kindly) tell me to get a grip.

I'm mid 40s. I've been seeing a man (early 50s) since November.

I met several of his friends and their partners before lockdown and a couple since. Everyone was really welcoming and friendly and they all seem like nice people.

It bothers me that all of his friends have partners who are slim and very attractive. I'm not. I'm a stone heavier than I'd like but, even if I lost it, I still wouldn't be slim and I still wouldn't be anymore attractive.

I'm pretty average looking and I know his exes have all been slim and attractive too.

Firstly, it makes me feel inadequate and I'm very conscious that everyone in the room knows I'm less attractive than them/their partners. It makes me feel awkward for him and I hold back from being affectionate etc because I don't want to embarrass him . Secondly, he was single for 5 years or thereabouts before meeting me and I'm conscious that he might just be 'settling' because I know that although he was content being single and had forged a nice life out for himself, he really does want a 'life partner'. I'm confident that I'm not the woman he would have wanted or imagined himself to he with.

I was also single for a few years. I have no problem with being single or fears of relationships ending. My only real fear is being with someone who has a little pang of 'sadness' at not having been able to attract the sort of woman they want/used to he able to attract or with someone who is settling for me because they want a partner and I'm willing so better than nothing.

I know all the stuff about it being more than looks etc but I can't help how I feel.

No. he's not.

Thank you.

Sounds like you've reached the point where you're realising that he's not actually meeting your needs?

sanmiguel

Just another one on the no pile.

In 25 years of dating, I've never even come close to having a proper relationship let alone being loved. That's it now.

I'm done.

Look, OP, if you're ok with the relationship ending - you've said you are - there's nothing to lose in talking to him about this, is there? How could he make you feel worse than you do yourself?

Talk to him and say you feel uneasy because you're not sure sometimes he actually likes you. You'd like to know how he feels. See what he says.

@ButteryPuffin

Look, OP, if you're ok with the relationship ending - you've said you are - there's nothing to lose in talking to him about this, is there? How could he make you feel worse than you do yourself?

Talk to him and say you feel uneasy because you're not sure sometimes he actually likes you. You'd like to know how he feels. See what he says.

I also think this is a conversation worth having. At the moment you are not really sure what is going on. I think you need to find out. His response or non-response and how he approaches this will tell you what you need to know. And perhaps you can let him know during this conversation that the amount of affection shown in this relationship isn't meeting your needs.

Ok. I've had time to process all of this now.

I am going to speak to him about it.

I feel it's a bit of a 'shit or get of off the pot' point. I'm not content to bob along in a 'relationship' that isn't going anywhere and I can't be upset that he isn't meeting my needs if I haven't stated them. I want a relationship where I'm loved and if he knows he's never going to feel like that but is happy enough for it to continue as it is, then I need to know.

Hopefully, if I just address it matter of factly, then I'll get a straight response.

Thanks for the input. Its given me food for thought and i don't really have anyone I'd discuss this with in real life. It's been helpful.

Good luck! Whatever the outcome, you’re doing the right thing.

Hope your okay op xxx

OP you have said that you posted like this a couple of years ago, but that this is a different man. I don't want to be "outing" or "identifying" so I won't link all the threads but as you have said yourself, the problems haven't gone away and what you are saying sounds very similar to what you were saying back then, and you have left out a lot of the other details about your personality and your thoughts about other people.

I am going to say this as nicely as possible because I do genuinely want to help. I don't think that these problems are to do with your attractiveness or how this man is acting, I think they are to do with your own behaviour, and putting everything together it is possible that you have an attachment or other disorder rooting back to your early childhood and if you spoke to a good, kind psychiatrist and you were honest about your conflicting thoughts and feelings about yourself, other people, this man, and all your confusion, then I really do think they would be able you to unravel everything once and for all and help you totally break free from all this, and start a new life, with more fulfilling relationships.

But if it is this, an attachment disorder, you would benefit from proper help, not just just counselling or letting it ride.

I do also think that you are obsessing about this man as well as about other things and if so please remember that he is a person and it is stressful to have someone obsess over you.

A book which might help, too, if you can get hold of it, is "I Am OK, You Are OK".

i really hope you don't mind me saying this and you understand that it comes from a place of wanting to help and that I have tried to put it nicely. I have some personal experience relating to this which is why it has rung bells for me.

Thank you.

And thank you tantrum for all of that. I think you may have a point about the attachment stuff. I don't mind you saying it and I appreciate the time you have taken responding.

I do also think that you are obsessing about this man as well as about other things and if so please remember that he is a person and it is stressful to have someone obsess over you.

Tbh, he doesn't have a clue how I feel. We've not talked about it, I'm not 'needy' or 'clingy' and I don't get jealous - it's not really in my nature. I doubt it's even occured to him.

In reality, it's not about him. It's about how I feel about myself and my capacity for relationships. I know that.

I am going to speak with him though. My default position is to 'run away'. So I'm going to try something different and see what happens.

Not to worry and NB I was referring to attachment "styles" here, but to attachment disorders.

I was not referring to attachment "styles", I meant!

No, I know. I have wondered before if I have an attachment disorder. It's becoming increasingly apparent that I do and it's not something I'm able to either correct myself nor some something that is just going to go away.

Tbh, I think I might be better off going back to my original plan of just leaving relationships alone and not bothering with them. Seems an awful lot easier and more straight forward (and cheaper!) that psychiatrists! 🙄

Like I say, there are no issues when I'm single.

If you are happy and actually enjoy being single, then why not? I think a lot of people force themselves to struggle through difficult relationships rather than be single, and would be better off without.
Would you actually prefer to be alone?

I wouldn't prefer to be alone, no. I want to be in a relationship like I see other people have (I know some are shit). I just want to experience love and being in a partnership. Or at least to know I'm capable of it.

Finally choosing to stay single would be heartbreaking however inevitable it also feels.

I feel more confident within and more content and at ease with myself when I'm single but that's not the same as being content and happy to be single. It feels like I'd be making the best of a bad situation. I carry a heavy ache around in my heart all the time.

I've spent years being the single (again) friend who gets invited out with couples and absorbed into other people's families. Where jokes are made about building an extension over the garage for me (like The Fonz) and where people I barely know extend Christmas dinner invitations out of pity.

I'm not desperate and I don't come across that way. I have a fair few married friends (m and f) who have told me they admire my independence and the fact I don't need a man in my life and that they love the way I've rejected all the things that most people seem to aspire to. Apparently, I dance to the beat of my own drum...

It's just a very sad and lonely drum.

I am not sure you can be alone though because there is something pulling you to connect with this man/others. People will be picking up on things, moving away from you emotionally, you get hurt and that affects your behaviour. You could investigate what is available and the cost and to what extent it would be covered by healthcare. But it would require you to be honest - maybe even show all your threads. I am no more than an armchair psychologist myself, but know enough to recognise that there is conflict within your threads which I am not sure you are aware of.

OP,
I think Tantrum has offered some excellent advice and I admire you for taking this on-board along with much of the other advice you have received.
Please think about further therapy and start writing down your thoughts so you can remember how you were feeling at certain times. Take them with you to therapy and why not print out the thread or at least your posts and discuss them with the therapist?

I'm think I'm aware of some of the conflict tantrumtraining you may pick up on more... (and thank you for being so kind about the fact I've posted before - I know people often get slated on here for that). How I am is not really who I am. If that makes sense? I think thats where some of the conflict comes from. Maybe?

You're right, there is something pulling me to connect with others. Only, when I do, I'm just unable to manage or sustain it.

People will be picking up on things, moving away from you emotionally, you get hurt and that affects your behaviour

Yes, I think you're right. I'm also aware of this but I don't know what it is that I'm doing. Like I say, I'm not clingy or needy. I don't get jealous. I have my own life, friends, hobbies - I don't expect to see someone more than once or twice a week or have endless text conversations. In every other aspect of my life, things are ok. I think I'm very sensitive to the moods and behaviours of others. Who i am isn't very constant at times. I pick up on other people's moods and behaviours and respond to those. They affect my emotional state.

I've had counselling, and therapy and group therapy (which I found the most useful of all) so many times over the years. I'm not sure i could face it again at the moment.

Please think about further therapy and start writing down your thoughts so you can remember how you were feeling at certain times

That's a good idea. I'll do that. It might help me to notice patterns etc too. Thank you.

Also OP, I think it would be helpful to talk through how you are feeling with your partner, you have indicated you would like to do this. Like you said earlier he doesn't know how you are feeling. He might be very upset at the thought of losing you. He seems to have his own difficulties with communicating and maybe he has his own insecurities. Whilst he might not be the right one for you long term I don't think you would lose anything by putting all your thoughts out there and seeing what he says. Then if you do decide to end the relationship you won't have any regrets and you also get his perspective which could be helpful for the future. At the moment you are unhappy with the situation as it stands so something has to change.

You gotta work on your confidence really. The most attractive thing about a person is their confidence. Not arrogance mind but confidence.

FingersCrossedForAllOfUs

Yes, all very good points. Thank you.

you also get his perspective which could be helpful for the future

This is very important, I think. I usually just walk away at the first sign of things not being 'right'. I dont normally talk things through. So yes, it will be very useful.

The most attractive thing about a person is their confidence

Sadly, that's not been my experience dating wise. I've found that men have been affronted by my failure to apologise for myself and not be crippled by self doubt and insecurity.

Anyway, I'm speaking to him later...

I’ve just seen your update OP, I do hope your chat with him has gone okay. I think the fact you are trying to make some changes and doing things differently this time by talking to him about how you feel is a really positive step.

Ok. I spoke to him and have spent a couple of days processing it all.

We spoke for a couple of hours.

I don't really know what to make of it all but I think I was right about him settling. I don't know.

I told him that I was feeling a bit uncertain and confused. I said that we hadn't really ever talked about us or what we wanted/didnt want from a relationship and I didnt have a clue what he thought about me or how he felt about any of it.

I told him that I wanted a 'real' relationship - one where there was ultimately love and respect and a partnership.

He said that our lifestyles were incompatible to a degree for various reasons (it's true) but those things can be worked around but they mean that living together or progressing a relationship on that level is 4 years away minimum.

He apologised for a lack of 'affection' and said he'd make more of an effort because it's not something he particulalrly feels the need for. We have spent the weekend together and he has done.

As I said before, he's kind and attentive physically (eg always checks I'm ok, comfortable, he cooks for me, never criticises or insults me or my physical appearance, he's respectful of my boundaries). However, he doesn't 'love' me and I doubt he ever will. He didn't say as much but I mentioned that I didn't know how he felt, or what he thought about me and all I got back was, "i enjoy spending time with you" and "you're tolerant of my idiosyncracies."

He mentioned a few things about me that had given him cause for similar concern. I won't bore with details but, essentially, I'm rigidly protective about my life and my need to be safe to the extent that I keep people out. I don't really realise im doing it at the time but it's been noted before. So he was right to have picked up on them and he said it made him feel "kept away" from me - like I was avoiding letting him in or get too close. I completely understand that. That's something I need to work on regardless of him.

But, essentially, I think it boils down to it being a relationship of 'companionship'. It's never going to be loving which, not having had a loving relationship before, is nothing new.

I think my quandary

...is, is that enough?