Men are not born to believe they are superior so what is going wrong to create so many abusers?

[Fightingback16]

Bit of a large assumption but even if you look on here there are so many women being abused.

In my example it was my ex husbands fathers doing as he was abusive.

Why are so many men narcissistic what is going so wildly wrong out there. How are mothers (And the rest of the family) raising sons to be so damaged?

@annabel85 Well, there's that and the fact that a woman can be beaten to a pulp and the police won't put the case forward because she 'consented to rough sex'.

@namechange12a

“your claims of behavioural difference being shown in the brain”

A claim I made absolutely no where, nor would I. Nice try.

The role women play is important. If we're in a misogynistic society, lots of women not only accept but also support it. With both rape and DV, very often both men and women are very quick and happy to believe it when the victim is portrayed as 'mental'. They're 'deranged' or 'unstable' or 'antagonistic'. Victims have to conform to stereotypes and if they don't they're less likely to be believed or supported.

I've found women sometimes worse than men with this.

The reality now is different to a few years ago?
The reality is different in different countries around the world? Which have different levels of prosecution and conviction?

No the reality is that as mentioned earlier, society has trouble holding men to account for abuse. Because, patriarchy.

It was legal to rape your wife in the UK until the early 90s. DV was seen as a matter for the couple and not for outside interference. In conversations and reporting, the spotlight is on the woman so often, what was she wearing, why did she date him, why did she marry him, is she a liar. And away from the man.

This stuff is all a function of society, not done universal truth, or 'reality' as you would have it.

I think men have less empathy. Ime men don't give as much of their time or effort to their children as women do, although I admit that is a generalisation.
They are subject to years of testosterone.

@NiceGerbil no, im talking about percentages. The rate is lower as there are more complaints and less prosecutions.

We arent in the 90s. Modern men in the UK grew up in a world of equality where women are powerful, and rightly so. Why? The majority come from single mum households. We saw the struggles of hard working women.

Stop judging us with the same brush as our crap fathers.

A lot of the #metoo allegations were against mature men from the 90s. Yet the allegations that go no further are normally against men under 30.

Society is punishing the sons of the fathers who abused their mothers, and that will continue with that attitude.

Women in the UK are powerful?

The majority of men in the 90s grew up in single parent households?

My father wasn't crap, thanks :/ and 'stop judging us', who is us?

'Society is punishing the sons of the fathers who abused their mothers, and that will continue with that attitude.'
What punishment are you talking about?

On brains: London cabbies, famously, have measurable brain differences to the non-cabbie population. Does this mean some people are born to be cabbies? Of course not. It means your brain changes during your life depending on what you do with it. Similarly, given that men and women are still socialised differently, the fact that adult men and adult women have measurable brain differences doesn’t mean those differences were baked in at birth.

On abusive men: I think a lot of abuse comes from men’s inability to deal with their failure. Society tells them they should be respected and powerful, able to lead, and that women will want to be with them. But for almost all of them it doesn’t turn out that way. So they have this unmet expectation that “lesser” humans will defer to them and service their demands. Most come to terms with it and realise it was always a lie, but some feel ongoing anger and shame at not being what they think they should. They can’t express it in public, but at home, they feel on some level justified in punishing their family for not meeting their expectation of being obeyed, serviced and respected (by which they mean put first).

I think financial disparity can make a man assume the alpha-male role of "provider" - it damages his ego if he cannot support his partner and children on his salary alone. She doesn't "need" to work. This creates a power imbalance and leaves the woman very vulnerable. This is true, however I have been both the main provider and SAHM. My problem is that mothering is not valued. Many of us, myself included, thought the way to rebalance things was to get a career. Many of us, me included, then ended up doubly shafted, I was bringing home the bacon and doing the lion share of child rearing!

@heartache590 I still see much misogyny now with younger men. And I do think women too buy into it without thinking. That is not to say that every man is awful or an abuser. Of course not. However I do think we need to value decent qualities in men and women more, and not reward entitlement, dominance, misogyny.

I know that DV rates have gone up with the pandemic. However I am hopeful that this unique time may have rerooted many men and women, families to appreciate better values. Values of equality, helping each other in the house, sharing childcare truly, sharing respect. Heroes are those in the caring and domestic world now, the nurses, doctors, cleaners, bus drivers, shop workers.

Women in the UK are powerful?

A lot more university students are women than men. That certainly wasn't the case in the 80s or before. in 2020 women can be whatever they want to be, which is a great thing.

There's a long way to go and men still dominate at the top with the Boomer generation but the whole downtrodden woman thing you read on here can be very self pitying and first world problems.

However I do think we need to value decent qualities in men and women more, and not reward entitlement, dominance, misogyny.

It's cultural and ingrained. Men are conditioned from puberty to believe that the bad boys get the girls and this belief also contributes for them to treat women badly.

Why would she do that, letting her son take a beating for her?

She assumed he was a strong 18 year old boy, he was not!

My mums mum was emotionally cold, my mum is emotionally cold. I was scared stiff as a child and got abused as an adult.

Women most definitely have a lot to answer for.

@Fightingback16 In addition to your opening post do you realise you repeatedly blame women?

Well the buck stops with me as a women as a wife as a mum. Who else is going to change things for myself and my daughter.

Why did she let her husband beat her son again and again. And why does she stand and watch him humiliate me in front of her then do nothing? She needed to have taken responsibility and done something to show him better, she could have done after she divorced. Why didn’t she help him?

I also have to take responsibility for handing all my power over to my husband because I believed staying at home and looking after the house and children was just my job. If I had a son he would have been looking at me and getting his attitude ready for having a women like me. I should not have had that attitude.

I don't think you can be conditioned if you have parents that do a good job raising you. Not buying the external influences argument

I’m only talking as a mum and a women and it’s my job to teach my daughter as her father is non-existent. I obviously think the blame is always with the abuser.

@Fightingback16 This is interesting. I'm in the situation where my boys care was split 50/50 by the courts between myself and my ex-husband. At the time they were just 3 and 6.
The two homes my boys live in are very, very different. Ex is wealthy and has a gf 17 years his junior. She doesn't have children and says she doesn't ever want them. She stopped working in her role as an admin assistant the day she moved in with him. They live in the former marital exec home.
We live in a small rented. I have a fiancé and a new baby (his first). We both work ft on lowish wages. We share housework, looking after baby etc equally.
Sadly my boys have a very disappointing view of women. They think it's appalling my fiancé changes nappies and cooks. My eldest (13) says he is a "slave for doing woman's work"). I am accused of being a "lazy parent" for asking the boys - 10 and 13 - to do anything at all. They say getting their breakfast, for example, is my job as "I am the woman."
My eldest says my fiancé is a fool for working in a job that doesn't earn loads of money (he works in social care) and that it's hilarious I HAVE to work.
As an aside, ex is once again applying for more custody so I would have boys just EOW.

It is role models.

We grow up now in a world where men are having to rethink how to approach women, indicate interest and rework how they handle relationships. It is the first generation doing that... yes some will screw it up and make mistakes.

When do we ever see society hold up an example of the right way? Romcoms?

I am saying "less stick, more carrot"

My husband said his father always drilled in to him about making sure you aim high and earn money. In a way I do believe he thought he was doing the right thing by supporting us financially, it just meant that he was never happy with anything, he always wanted more and more. Unless it was about making money and getting comfortable and retiring early he didn’t want to know. He missed the emotional connection to everything, everyone and everything was disposable, including me because I stopped being interested in his dream. I wanted a partner, emotional connection. When my father died he couldn’t understand grief, he was angry I wasn’t focused on money.

I tried to explain to him that you can’t shout and threaten someone into being a partner. Money and dreams are made when you are emotionally connected and invested and safe. It’s sad really how distorted his views and values were.

He wanted nice cars and things because that’s what society says makes you successful and accomplished. It means nothing.

@Fightingback16 Were you married to my ex?!

@Nicknamegoeshere it just goes to show that they are all the same but then we all live in the same world.

How are mothers (And the rest of the family) raising sons to be so damaged?

By doing things like attributing male abuser's behaviour to the females in their life by default, shit like that.