He needs to “win”. Is this gaslighting or just being a d*ck?

[Melandri]

Has anyone dealt with a really argumentative partner who doesn’t see themselves that way?

My partner picks at anything until he finds a disagreement or a reason to fall out.

Recently he told me he doesn’t like the way I need to go for a walk when I’m frustrated or upset, especially if it’s fairly late, and would I mind not doing it because he worries.

I said fair enough but I do like a bit of space to clear my head but I won’t go out at night if he’ll worry (it doesn’t happen often btw, maybe twice in the last few months.)

I thought that was the end of the conversation but no.

He then said “if you did still want to go for a walk, would you tell me?” To which I replied “of course, I’m always honest with you and there’d be no reason not to tell you”

He then said:
“Are you calling me a bullshitter?”

I was so surprised at the direction that this took but said “no, of course not”.

He’s now saying that because I said I’m honest, I’ve indirectly said that he’s not.
It’s been over 24 hours now and he’s still really worked up over it even though I’ve told him I dong feel that way and don’t think that and definitely didn’t imply it or didn’t mean to.

Anyway, after lots of shouting and arguing from him, and me staying calm and telling him that I don’t think he’s a bullshitter he’s summed it up saying that the issue is that I don’t understand.

I said “I do” and he replied saying “no you don’t”.

I’ve asked him what I can do to help us move on and he said his lost where he is with everything but he won’t back down because that will mean I’ve won. I don’t see it as winning or losing I just think there’s been a bit of confusion and rather than letting it go he’s clinging to it.

I don’t know why he’s like this. Can anyone help?

[Note from MNHQ - 22/11/2020: please note there is a recent update from the OP].

Sounds exhausting.

Oh my lord. God I hope you can get out and not get sucked back in.
This is really serious OP. Really.
The added stuff you’ve said is extra awful. And it’s been 8 months.
I’m a people pleaser too and it’s so hard to start putting yourself first. I forgave every awful thing my ex did. He kept doing it though

It's being controlling prick.

Walking helps your mental health. He doesn't want to 'let' you go for walks (!) Therefore he's bad for your mental health.

Ltb and get outside support to do so if you think he'll turn nasty.

I had an ex who also didn't like it when I went to process things. (I used to go for a run). He said it was that I was crap at communication. But actually, it was my way of processing things, and it worked better for him if I didn't process things. Because then I might realise how wrong some things were.

You know when I read threads like this and see that the relationship is quite short, you don't have kids and don't live together, I breathe a huge sigh of relief that it will be easy for you to extract yourself from this.

He is clearly searching for arguments, why would somebody saying they are honest imply that the other wasn't. That is just trying to fight, and why would you do that with someone you care about.

Sounds v tedious & exhausting.

& Go for a walk whenever you want to OP.

You're young, you're not living together. You have a chance to escape.
It may be learnt behaviour from him but it is not your place to fix that for him or try to make him understand.
I spentt hours talking to my abusive ex how I felt, what we could do to make it better, how we could move on. Hours!!!
Then the next day, even later that day it was like the whole conversation hadn't happened! He had no idea what I was talking about and it went straight back to how it was. I thought I was going insane!!
They wont understand because there will be years of this embedded in him. Ot is not your place to 'fix' an abuser. The only solution is to wall away.
@willsa I hear your experiences, sorry you went through that and it is so common and close to mine. It is so good it is spoken about. It really is like they have a text book or something on this as so many women say the same things.
You have a chance OP. Take it. You are more important.

@Melandri

The biting!
He ended up biting me quite seriously during sex. He did it in anger after yet another disagreement. Then claimed innocence :I thought you liked that, I often "nibble" and kiss your neck, you don't seem to mind.
That is where it all came to an end : I moved out and one of my friends saw the bruises with actual teeth marks and called the police.
So the biting might escalate too...

@Aerial
Another set of situations that is so recogniseable! The crazy making, out of nowhere conversations/arguments and then.. Nothing. Back to normal. He used to Hate with passion examining what went wrong and how to improve it: "It didn't happen that way. Anyway, past is past, nothing is gained by looking at it. I'd rather not talk about it. Let's just leave it and have a nice day. I know what I've done wrong there is no point of looking at it." If I would be looking for closure, not long before I'd be called argumentative. Ugh! I used to have so much pent up frustration and negative energy inside. All gone now. He's gone.
I do think there is a certain number of personality types and the ones who "go wrong" do it in a certain kind of way according to their type. So we see things on repeat. And can also predict future without magic!

Morning everyone, just been catching up on the posts. I barely slept a wink last night and feel like I’m going insane. I’ve been questioning myself this morning wondering if I’ve blown this up or if there was something else I could have done but I know that’s not right.

I’ve spoken to a friend and have told her that I’ll be collecting my stuff from his tomorrow and that I’ll keep her posted.

Do I tell him in advance that I’m going to be collecting my things and leaving or do I just arrange to go over and tell him tomorrow?

OP, I had an exDP who had a terrible relationship with his sister when they were young, and I think he carried it over. It was all about point scoring and not backing down. I wanted to say: 'if you ever admit you're wrong and apologise, it doesn't mean you've lost and I'll have something to use against you - I will just be really grateful and say thank you!' They don't realise that sometimes when they win the relationship loses.

Sorry, I've just RT other half of the FT. Doesn't matter why he does it. Get out.

He’s just messaged me saying:
^Morning, this whole thing has gone too far. I still understand what I'm saying, i asked you immediately after what you said does that make me a bullshitter, not that you called me one, regardless this has come far too far now, we are at a stale mate, you tell me you understand what's happened but from where I am even I can see that you aren't on board with what I'm trying to explain to you, to me you understand from your point of view not mine. I do want what we've had and what we actually are but like i keep saying if i just say fair enough its me thats just gone mental, that would be me taking all responsibility for whats just happened and thats not the case in my eyes, so I'm struggling to get past this point. I feel insecure about us and a little bit rocked by all of this, is there another solution?^

I feel like my head is going to explode.

Go fetch you things, leave and then tell him at a later date. Unless someone can go with you.
If you tell him your leaving, there'll be another row.
Leave. Tell him you've left

crossed with your post.

Exploding heads all round I think. I can't get my head around that at all.
take a friend with you to collect your things. Do not go by yourself.

Stop engaging. He sounds unhinged. The reason you feel like you're going mad is because he is behaving irrationally. Just go and collect your things. If you need to give him a heads up, a brief "I'll be there at X time to get my stuff" will suffice. Just stop talking about this other nonsense - it's all ridiculous and he's deliberately trying to wind you up / wrong-foot you / make you apologise, imo, and you've done nothing wrong.

Because he's messing with your head. Twisting things.
I wouldn't tell him in advance it's over as he will have time to prepare and work on you. More mind fucking.
What solution does he want? You to be a good little woman and agree with him. 'You aren't on board' blah blah blah
It's all pointless and shit words
Wouldn't it be lovely to be free of this OP and your mind clear?

He can’t and won’t change. Please leave.

He is a complete Head F*ck, run for the hills!

Everyone else is totally right and you need to leave - I wouldn't tell him in advance you were getting stuff unless someone coukd go with you.

But I love the concept of "you see it from you point of view and I see it from my point of view so you're wrong and unreasonable and being ridiculous". That's essentially what that long garbled message from him means. Which is clearly nonsensical. Added to that is the fact that he prioritises being right over the relationship...have you never apologised to a friend or family member or partner because although you didn't think you were wrong, the relationship meant more to you? He's clearly incapable of even considering that. You'll be well rid of him!!

Jesus op I'm struggling to understand wtf he's on about. No wonder you're confused.

I'd respond to his 'is there another solution' with 'yes, there is another solution, I'll collect my stuff tonight and we'll call it a day on the relationship'

Then stop engaging

@Melandri

The more sneaky you can be about getting your things, the better.
If you have to have "the talk" then play it down. Like it's nothing big, just need some space. You're amazing, I just don't think I'm the best girlfriend I could be right now. I'll be back once I've figured out how to make you happy.. And so on. Get your things, so he has no form of control over you and then talk if you must. Even out the playing field. He is not going to like that, so be prepared. It's great you have a friend on hand! Tell her not to allow you to wobble. It is difficult to leave but you deserve better.

My ex used to insist packing my bags in aggressive manner for every misdemeanour but every time he would sneak some belongings of his in there to have a reason for further contact ( as in asking for his stuff back). The tactics!
Don't let him pull too much out of the hat by forewarning.

P. S
I'm 32 as well and it is great to be single. Lockdown has given plenty of time to reorganise life and be ready for every opportunity when this Virus malarkey is over. Career, dating, studying - whatever! Fantastic age to be in control of your own life.

Whether he is unwell or very much me me me no man who can send those texts after the conversation had is material for a relationship. How on earth would he cope with a real disagreement or problem and why do you need to do all the changing to keep him happy. Stay here and not only will you soon not go for a walk you will only ever appease until you barely exist.

It might be interesting to reflect on why you agreed to stop going for walks initially. There are a very normal thing to do. If your partner felt concerned for your safety why did his feelings get treated as more important than yours. He could have worked in his anxieties - any good partner has to see you as a separate and responsible individual.

You're in stalemate. Theres no compromise. End it.

Go and get your things with a friend.
Then put this in your experience bank of what not to do again.

@Melandri - that message sounds like a long, waffling load of bullshit.. So yeah, he is in fact a bullshitter!

I think you know the solution!