Building up courage to leave - support thread

[myotherface]

Hi everyone,

Just seeing if anyone wants to get together to support each other in difficult relationships thinking about divorce but not quite having the courage for it yet.

I've been married for 10ish years. 3 primary aged DC. First three years together before children were amazing. The past 10 have been rocky to say the least. DH was emotionally abusive throughout a big chunk of that although I still feel he hasn't done it on purpose. I've gone through cycles of saying I'll leave, him being tearful and begging me not to and then eventually turning it all so that everything is my fault. Lots of arguing all throughout the years (can't even think what all this has done to the kids). Episodes of my depression with one of them ending me in hospital.

I've had loads of therapy, worked on myself and what I want from life. I've realised I only have one life and decided I don't need to stay married to a person I don't like. I expect it's going to be unbelievable difficult as he will oppose the divorce with all he's got. I'm going to need support and people who will remind me why I want this in the first place.

Whether you're nowhere near thinking about divorce and have only just started opening your eyes to abuse or even just your own unhappiness in the relationship. Or whether you've already ordered the divorce papers. Please join me and we'll support each other through this. There's got to be a happier life on the other side of this.

@maybeonedaysoon I feel exact the same as you in regards to how you feel and how it will effect your son.
All my family tell me it’s a better environment for my daughter to grow up in a peaceful house with her mum happy. They just don’t understand the guilt I feel every time I hve left when she tells me she misses daddy. And I overthink about whether he will make an effort to see her.
We all seem to be in the same situation in regards to guilt.

Well I told my daughter, I did it alone as asked DH if he wanted me to do it and he did, he got really sad, I feel sad too but more because he is and I'm worried about her. Guilt.
She barely reacted, took it in her stride then carried on playing her computer game.
Lord knows if it's even sunk in, possibly not.
Probably the next few weeks are going to be the hardest ever. Him finally moving out, making the practical arrangements, the first weekend without me or without him..
Still keep second guessing myself but I know it's right. I couldn't carry on like this and I didn't want to anymore. Very hard to remember that when he's being just OK, kind etc.

Can I join? Been lurking and reading for ages. Everyone’s stories resonate especially @takethegirloutofscotland. There is no abuse in our relationship - just a complete lack of physical and emotional intimacy mostly at my DH’s choice but I’ve allowed it to continue. I posted on relationships about three weeks ago www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3918580-Would-you-leave-this-marriage

I am now about 98% certain I want to end the marriage. But I’m
Terrified about how rigid and self righteous my DH gets when he’s in pain. We both spoke individually to a “marriage crisis specialist” who actually resonated strongly with me - more than traditional therapists. But I just don’t feel I actually want to “fix” it and feel that whilst it could be improved there is just no way he could be what I actually want and need without becoming an entirely new person. This advisor is monstrously expensive so I’d rather do a more traditional therapy together to navigate a more peaceable ending. But I’m fairly sure I’m being naive to think he’d engage in that ...

His talk with this therapist brought up an overriding feeling that I am “controlling” (my view that in the great vacuum of his passivity what he is actually seeing is me now being proactive and stating my needs). So anytime I say anything I am “being controlling”. I’m not sure he knows what that even means, truly in relationship terms.

Our kids will be devastated- not least because it will feel like a total bolt from the blue .... but my sense of deepening conviction and wanting to live a full life is overcoming my fear.

Hey @HaggisBurger just read your thread and yes lots of similarities there!!
I totally understand you talking of feeling so fearful of a future out of this marriage I am the same. The fear is paralysing at times however I feel I can work through it and provide myself and my kids a good life
It's the guilt that chokes me the guilt of hurting someone who like you said I love as a friend but not perhaps as a lover

My DH knows my feelings around sex
I feel like I tried for so long initiated sex and felt rejected. One of my moments of clarity was a special break together we had away from dc for the first time and before we went I bought some nice lingerie and challenged him for us to have sex e very day not once!!! I told him what was important to me and he never heard (or that's how I felt) this was a number of years ago now but it was a pivotal point in our relationship
I don't know that I can allow myself back to those feelings so keep them locked away. However i feel young and can't imagine the rest of my life without sex it's almost like I'm not sure I can trust him with those feelings again!!

I thought the feelings that made it so hard to leave were due to the relationship not being abusive or awful but reading this thread has made me realise that even with those things in play women feel guilt!
We are programmed to feel it and that's doubled when there are kids involved.
Fear guilt and an obligation to hold everything together for everyone else and put our selves bottom of the pile. It is shit

Sorry no answers from me but guess we all need to find our own way and our time will come like you I feel that time is soon but want to do it with kindness and compassion if I can (perhaps naively) and keep my kids as safe and happy as I can xx xx

@takethegirloutofscotland thanks for your response. Your description of the trip and your unreciprocated attempt to spark your sex life really resonated with me. It does dreadful things to your self esteem - and for me I’ve had a lot of shame that I don’t have a “normal” sex life.

Completely agree that the guilt we feel seems to be irrespective of how objectively “bad” the marriage is. There is most definitely something inherent in societal expectations of woman / what we’ve been conditioned to put up with that means we stay in situations where our needs just aren’t being met much longer than we arguably should. In a lot of the cases I’ve read about here the men are just pretty ok with the status quo maybe.

I’m still so confused. My DH has had time to process some of what he discussed in his session and is less defensive. He’s agreed to see the other therapist and the atmosphere is thawed a bit at home. Makes it easier .... yet harder. Arrrrghh.

@HaggisBurger I totally agree with that. When I realised what was keeping me from saying what I wanted was guilt and that really, feeling guilty was going to eat me up, it was a relief.
DH did loads more at first too, he spoke with conviction and was very convincing in front of the therapist, he put washing on, cleaned, loaded the dishwasher, planned nights out.. But I still, even though the alternative is me losing my beautiful house, life, holidays, children lots of the time, etc etc, I still couldn't get over how resentful and angry I am. Every time he kissed me or tried to cuddle it just felt weird and icky.
I just didn't want to keep trying. I know I should, I know I should have used the lockdown period to try to really focus on the things I had that are good but the will wasn't there, the love isn't there anymore. I was more scared about losing the house and upsetting the kids than losing him. Maybe it'll hit me in a few months, maybe Xmas or birthdays will really make me realise what I've lost, but I think I'm more feeling positive about what I'll gain.

I was talking to a friend yesterday and said how guilty (there it is again, hello old friend! ) I felt that my kids won't have lovely holidays anymore, most I'll be able to afford for them is a rainy week away camping.
She reminded me that there aren't many people that had the holidays we did, we've had three major trips with the kids to unusual, amazing destinations... then reminded me that each time I was dreading going because of spending time with him in the evenings once they were in bed, that he left me to do the parenting as usual, that I avoided sex by watching films and drinking..as long as 2.5 years ago I was saying to her what I was concerned about and saying I felt like a single parent.

I remember listening to him sitting outside our room, sulking and drinking on one holiday because I was pregnant and exhausted and sick all the time. Or when he'd sulk because I didn't want to have sex, because I was tired again, pregnant. Or when he'd steadily drink all day from lunchtime.. Every trip featured a lot of booze.
I'm just trying as much as possible to stop being my harshest critic, stop trying to people please or make everyone happy, I can't do that, I'm not able to make everyone happy. Best I can do is make myself happy, stop making him miserable because he's constantly trying to do everything to please me and it can't work because I'm asking him to change into someone he's not.

The guilt doesn't serve a purpose apart from freezing us and making us do the same thing over and over

Morning everyone

I feel for every single one of you its such a heartbreaking decision to have to make. I always said that I didn't want to leave but rather I had to for things to change and for my DH to recognise his behaviour and address the issues that we both have in terms of intimacy/sex (dare I say on my part not his) I lost the attraction because of his behaviour!

I know its been said a million times in this thread but we all deserve to be happy whatever that may be alone/together who knows! Yes its gonna hurt people there is no way around that but as I said previously we are resilient as human beings and people survive relationship breakdowns everyday. Guilt is an emotion that is part of the process unfortunately but its important to sit with that guilt and feel it. By allowing in it and not fighting it that emotion will pass quicker as will all emotions.

The latest update with me is that DH has been having counselling as have I and we've seen each other regularly due to one thing and another. Dare I say but he is like a completely different person and making big strides to address his issues and behaviour and really really trying to change. Its a very positive step in the right direction and it has given me hope that maybe we could get back together! :)

I'm so happy at the minute although I miss him and my girls like crazy but I know this is the right thing at the moment for both of us. We are gonna try and go on some dates once everything gets back to normal or maybe even just go for a walk together. We've also decided that if we can get back together we will sell our house (which is 5 bedroom in a very sought after area) and downsize into something much smaller so we have disposal income to do the things that couples need to do to feel connected.

Sorry bout ranting about me just needed to give a little positivity to the thread and I really hope that you call all make the right decision for you :)

Hugs everyone :)

I’m still ebaying. Just put on a bundle of 6-9 month girls summer clothes. My daughter is nearly 7!

Umm, wrong thread!

Hi @Stegasaurusmum totally agree re the reality of holidays/family home as things worth staying for - or not. For a long time I thought there was just no way I could consider lowering my DC's standard of living etc etc - but now I more and more see that these material things are of much less "value" than true happiness and them seeing what a truly loving marriage looks like.

Sounds to me like you've done all your trying - all the years you describe is trying to make it work in my opinion. Ive not seen anything on this thread that suggests anyone hasn't tried their damndest to make it work. After a while though it can be too far gone maybe.

Well done you for getting as far as you have and being in the process. I am very envious that your DH agreed to move out of the family home. I am about 99.9% sure mine would never agree - hes intimated as much to be honest. He is very black and white and if the split was my idea it would be very much - no way is he leaving the family home.

My only idea around that is to offer him a "nesting" arrangement whereby the kids stay put in the family home and we rotate in and out say 50:50 or whatever. I think seeing that I am taking an equal hit on it might persuade him - but I am not hopeful. That arrangement isn't without many pitfalls and requires somewhere else for us to stay when we aren't in the family home - and wouldn't be a long term solution. But I could not afford a 4 bedroom place anywhere within 30 minutes of my kids school in a million years and I am very keen not to disrupt them more than necessary.

More likely though is that we would end up separated and being in the same home which would be dreadful. Weve been in separate bedrooms for years - but still. Ugh.

@Diabetes123 - sounds like you are keeping an open mind on all fronts which sounds positive. Hopefully your DH will benefit either way from the counselling. Your plan re downsizing sounds good too. If I stay with my DH I think we will end up making some real life changes too that focus on quality of life and so on.

can i join together 29 years not married
for the first 25 years the relationship was miserable well thats an understatement but heres a list of the things hes done.
countless affairs didnt try to hide them scratch marks on his back lovebites on his chest grass stains on his shirt
pushing me around. throwing things at me, pinching me
when i spoke to people he would tell people not to listen because i was stupid and didnt know what i was talking about i lost so much confidence , i started to stutter if someone asked me anything
looked me up and down and said no one would fancy me
when i told him my dad had died he just said oh in a sarcastic tone at his funeral he stayed at the back of the church and didnt come to the wake
hes had thousands of pounds left to him and never gave me or the kids a penny or bought anything for the house
the reason i have stayed was because i was scared to tell him to get out
over the years i have learnt to drive got a job and built my confidence up and saved quite abit of money
now to the present day
were ok now, well on the surface hes stopped the affairs probably because hes old and over weight and the abuse as stopped although i still get the look if i say something he doesnt like
but even though were ok i cant forget the past and if i tell him i'm leaving he will act like it's all lies and i'm making it up (this is what he does if i call him out on anything) and then i'll get scared and back down
i wish i could find the strengh and courage to leave him but i know i won't
i envy all of you that have done it

sorry for the grammer mistakes my keyboard is on the verge of breaking (like me)

Had a busy weekend and interesting to read all the updates. I think all of you are awesome . I am definitely starting to turn a corner with the guilt. My DH is again and again showing me what a Jekyll and Hyde he is and I am feeling big relief I am out of there. I am even starting to believe that I deserve better! Really wish the kids didn't have to go through it though. The money thing resonates. I am officially as poor as a church mouse. I will be agreeing an uneven financial settlement in order to not uproot DS from school and house and lifestyle. I could go through courts (may still have to if DH carries on being an arse) but it will be massively traumatic upheaval for DS and cost a bloody fortune, and in my eyes, DS is more important than extra money. I do have enough, just not enough for luxuries, but I no longer care.

@youcancallmeow Hello . Well done for everything you've achieved...it sounds like you have done brilliantly in an awful situation. Glad you are here and posting. It's never too late x

@Stegasaurusmum Regarding the other man. I'm not judging you. Sometimes we all need to escape. x

@Diabetes123 I am so pleased things are looking up for you. Any luck with younger DD yet?

@PickledLilly . I am in awe at your organisational ebay skills

Haha, my eBay skills obviously aren’t that great or I’d have done it sooner but decluttering is focusing my mind whilst I’m in limbo and giving me some sense of moving forward.

I’m moving somewhere small so I can’t take all the clutter with me and anything I sell is much needed extra cash.

morning everyone
i hope my post didnt sound too rambled.i haven't told anyone in real life.
i think i am getting stronger. i've stopped pretending to ppl at work that i have a good relationship. i need to stop lying to myself that everythings ok when its not
to the outside world everyone things he's great, he's the first to offer help to the neighbours and his family he's just a pig to me so ppl would be shocked if they knew the truth ,well i dont think they would believe me anyway
the funny thing is how the tables have turned, he lost his job a while ago and now hasn't got a penny to his name.i had to give him money to top up his phone.
but that leads to another problem because i pay all the bills , he would have nothing if i left. i don't know how he would get by.
i shouldn't care really as he didnt give a shit about me over the years but i'm not as heartless as him
am i making excuses again not to leave?

it such a relief to get this off my chest, thank you for listening

@youcancallmeow,

He can always go and work in a supermarket?? His budget is not your problem after you leave, do you have small children who could suffer from lack of funds while spending time with him? If children older or approaching 18 I wouldn't give it another thought...

What motivated you to marry him after so many unhappy years together?

hi cass
i didn't marry him , the only reason i stayed is because i'm freightened of him, he can be quite nasty.
my dcs are all grown up now i think thats why i feel stronger about leaving still working on the courage
i know i shouldn't worry about him if i go but its the way i am
i need to grow a backbone don't i

@youcancallmeow It sounds like you have plenty of backbone and you are obviously a very compassionate and caring person. Do you have a Womans Aid type charity near you? If you have been a victim of abuse (emotional or physical) they will see you, completely free of charge and have a chat. I found it really helpful for getting perspective and support. x

Well DHs rental fell through... So he's looking again. He's a uggested looking in the next town, 15 mins away. Which means me ferrying the kids to and fro, as he can't drive. Means I'll still be doing all the school pick ups and drop offs around my job, plus I won't have the freedom to have any of the day when he takes them to myself, as I'll have to pick them up, wait for him to be home, then drop them off, by the time I've done that I may as well just put them to bed myself... No midweek stays either if he does this.

@youcancallmeow he sounds horrific. Completely agree with @Weetabixandcrumpets you don’t need to grow a backbone, you need to find your confidence and courage which have been massively eroded over the years.

I just found out I can move on 4th July. Feel excited but scared and a bit sick. I now have to face organising all the logistics and more importantly, having to tell him and the kids.

OP just read your post. In same situation, came on here to write my own post but don't have strength yet to get it all down. Emotional abuse too, for years but never "bad enough" to leave. Come to a head recently. I can't see how I can stay worth my DH. He can be utterly nasty, twists everything I say when he's in a mood, and his "buttons" change weekly so I'm always ok catch up. I'm never good enough. Don't clean well enough. Don't cook well enough, although on some days I'm an amazing chef and apparently should "sell my meals as they are so tasty". Can't keep up. Need to leave but been laid off, no family near, two young kids, couldn't bear to be apart from them and he'd try and get them 50/50 cos he knows that would hurt me the most.. I get on with his family but they won't say anything to him even though they must see it. Whenever I call him out on his behaviour he says I have hormonal imbalances and PMT which causes all the arguments (apparently). He left again the other day, back in the house now but being vile. Slamming doors, muttering insults etc. Trying hard to keep it together but struggling. Sorry not read all the posts on here yet so not sure if anyone's texted similar, but not sure what else to do.
I don't feel like I can divorce. But I know I have to. But why can't I go there?

@geekatheart - that sounds like pretty clear emotional abuse to me. Do bear in mind that as women we tend to minimise, rather than exaggerate abusive behaviour. Blaming conflict on PMT etc is abusive imho - I really hope you get some clarity. Sending strength to you.

@PickledLilly - wow Independence Day sounds like a very apt day to move. Im envious but know the thought of logistics and more importantly telling him and kids is really tough.

@stegasarusmum - thats such a pain re the rental - is there genuinely nothing in your town? The logistics of that sounds tough with him not driving - I really hope you find a good solution

@youcancallmeow - wow that sounds horrendous. Be gentle with yourself in terms of how difficult it is to leave after years of abuse - it wears you down in ways its hard to fathom I think and even writing how you feel here is a step towards making change.

Logistics are a bit of a nightmare tbh, I thought I had everything pretty well planned but I didn’t factor in a global pandemic, working from home, kids out of school etc. It’s hard to know how to plan the nitty gritty bits of life when everything is so up in the air with no idea when anything might get back to normal.

I hope it's alright if I join in as well. I came here a few years back when I was trying to leave my husband. I got the advise I wanted, to leave, but the guilt pulled me back in.. I've suffered with him for another, I think 3 years(?) now. My tipping point this time is him spending $900 on an assault riffle I told him I wouldn't have in my house near my toddler, this is in addition to a handgun he got a year ago. Neither of which has he ever used, they just sit around within my child's reach. I can't stand to be around the man, and his touch makes me cringe. Why on earth do I feel such guilt while trying to leave though? Why does it hurt so bad trying to bring up the words that i'm leaving.