Is this paedophile opinion a massive red flag?

[Eternalconfusion]

Namechanged for this.
New boyfriend of 5 months or so. I have dc (1 girl 1 boy both primary aged) he doesn't. I've been in previous abusive relationships so boundaries a bit off.
A month ago we were away for weekend and he voiced a theory - that paedophiles weren't to blame as such for their tendencies. Likened it to how society used to view homosexuals etc. I was horrified, voiced my opinion then asked him to drop it. (I can give further info on the details if necessary)
Since then I consciously forgot about it, reasoned with myself that as he doesn't have kids he can't understand etc.
Today something triggered me, I lost the plot then asked him for some space. He's in a huff, doesn't get why this is still an issue weeks later.
Please can I have your thoughts?

Yes.

@PlanDeRaccordement this was how I rationalised it at the time. I enjoy conversations about unusual topics, I don't enjoy debating as such but I like to learn from people who are more intellectual than me and have formed opinions on things I don't know much about. We'd had plenty of other really interesting conversations, transgender issues, porn, sex work were topics that had come up and I'd offered a feminist perspective and he was interested in it and had said he'd changed his opinion on certain things after hearing my thoughts. He's intelligent and I read a lot so we had some really great conversations.

But this one felt off - maybe I am overly protective but it triggered something in me and I added it to my list of potential red flags. I'd actually kept a list so I wouldn't forget things I'd been concerned about. Then yesterday he told me a lie (a small, petty one) and I reopened my list and suddenly thought, why the hell am I even in a relationship with someone who I keep a list of red flags about?!

No - don’t agree with the feminist “too delicate for a mother’s ears” argument. I’d say the same to a single dad. It’s about protection - and she’s the primary carer for her 2 children.

I get the impression from many PPs that it is just that it is taboo to talk about this particular subject to a mother? That makes me a bit uncomfortable as a feminist tbh, the idea that certain subjects are too much for my delicate mother ears.

As a topic of conversation with a mother of young children whom he has known for just 5 months?

This wasn't an intellectual discussions on the various psychological ills of society. It was either sinister or in extremely poor taste.

If you have any doubts about anyone no matter the “latest scientific research”, don’t let them near your kids. You made a responsible decision, probably nothing would ever have come of it and he may have been just having a discussion with you. You were upset and disturbed, you are a mum and it is your duty to protect your children. Thank heavens you did. Being sexually abused as a child destroys you forever, you never ever get over it. The children are the victims, there is no choice for them.

This is different, this woman has kids so he should understand her disgust sexual abuse of children.

@PlanDeRaccordement

If a man started to tell me that he had empathy for and compared the urges of a man who has fantasies about killing women to a homosexual - yes I’d run off and think there is something is wrong with him.

I’m all for debate and playing devil’s advocate but there is this weird current around at the moment that puts the feelings and lack of boundaries with regards to sexual deviancy above common sense. I think there is a strong risk that minimising extreme and illegal paraphilias creates more chances for someone who has the fantasy to make the jump into acting it out. They will hold onto that logic that it’s not their fault, they are victim of circumstances and the law.

Also not true that all sexual predators go in with sheep’s clothing. Some measure the boundaries and talk about and normalise certain behaviours - the make you feel like the crazy one for having an issue with it.

Thank God this thread settled down into a more reasonable discussion is all I can say. The first 20 or 30 responses felt like Salem on steroids.

You have done the right thing trusting your instincts here. Many years ago I worked for a solicitor who undertook criminal law. We had a client who was accused of child sexual abuse and as he had been called away from the office, he asked me to see his wife who was calling in with some paperwork.

I met her in the office and went through the paperwork briefly. She then began telling me that in future paedophilia would be viewed as a disease such as cancer or even Aids. It was an illness. I did not respond. She later bought me flowers. I just wanted to get away.

My boss told me later that he had sexually abused four out of his five children. Yet she was still his apologist.

Not the same of course, but it has always stayed with me.

Hang on, “We'd had plenty of other really interesting conversations, transgender issues, porn, sex work were topics that had come up” So they did have similar ‘controversial’ conversations, so maybe for him it was just continuing along those lines?

Sorry my English and grammar is awful this morning.

It sounds as though he's trying to minimise paedophilia which is obviously a red flag.

However it could be one of 2 things: that he's trying to say that he believes paedos are born that way and then has (unfairly, incorrectly and fucking homophobically) drawn parallels to being born gay - or he is sharing that he would be accepting of legalised paedophilia which is obviously beyond a red flag.

For eg.
I might believe psychopaths are born that way but that doesn't mean that I would stand for a legalisation of psychopathic behaviour. However, if I had psychopathic tendencies I might conclude that: because psychopaths are born that way, it would be unfair to try to control their psychopathic behaviour. Free the psychopaths! etc.

Which one is he?
Either way alarm bells are clearly going off for you and you've said you have a history of abusive relationships (towards just you or your children also?).

Just read you've got shot of him - good for you. Maybe take a break from dating, focus on your children and yourself and building up a level of self respect and love.

I get the impression from many PPs that it is just that it is taboo to talk about this particular subject to a mother? That makes me a bit uncomfortable as a feminist tbh, the idea that certain subjects are too much for my delicate mother ears

A man talking about it on a date with a woman who he knows has young children, and would be likely to be introduced to at some point, is weird. The topic might be interesting to him, he surely has many people in his life he can debate it with until the cows come home. I don't see it as anything to do with being too delicate, and the science might say whatever, doesn't mean that it is not grim in the circumstances to discuss with a mother you are romantically linked with. As a FeMiNiSt a far more important aspect is having the courage to stand up for things you are uncomfortable with, rather than roll over and accept a man's behaviours.

Omg. Do not let him near your children. Get rid of him.

Eternal you seem to have come to the conclusion that he wasn’t grooming you - just that he was choosing to debate with you a very inflammatory issue.

The fact is - you just don’t know. Don’t allow yourself to wander down that path as it will be easier to excuse it. You said your self your boundaries are blurred.

I agree with the post above OLD is an open door for abusers. I would never use it

@CaptainMarvelDanvers - no, that was a GREAT post

I disagree that this is 'just a topic that comes up in conversation', I have had many amazing intellectual relationships with men and I don't think it's come up once! If it did it might be in relationship to something like Jimmy Saville and child sex abuse, not a spontaneous thing you like to talk about. I do think that's odd.

Given there's absolutely no reason to hang out with odd men who talk about topics that make you feel uncomfortable, I don't think you have lost the love of your life.

What he said isn't that big of a deal to me personally, at least the bit about it being innate. Who would chose child attraction/perversion, given the hatred and wishes of death expressed on this thread? I would be interested in having a sensible discussion about what we ought to do with paedophiles, given the drive is innate, strong and not a choice and often not changed by therapy. There are some brave people who work in this field because they do believe it important to contain and treat and prevent, it's a field I would struggle with. However, I don't think it's like homosexuality in that we are all going to change our minds about it, and that is not what the scientists are saying either, as far as I can tell.

No need to carry on with this guy, because it is weird to feel compelled to discuss this, and there are now other things you are remembering that feel off, so the best decision has been taken.

@summersunandoranges you're right, I don't know whether he was grooming me or debating with me. Which is why I ended it last night. I'm now using this thread to think through what's in my head. I'm not going back on my decision - as I said, why was I in a relationship with someone whose red flags I was keeping a list of?!

I'm coming to the conclusion that my boundaries are no longer blurred, they're very very clear.

Haha yes lets put homosexuals and paedophiles into the same category -_-
He sounds like a douche.

Fact is i agree they cant help how they feel but it doesnt mean they have to act upon it and there is help out there for themif they chose that they dont want to be sick people.

Homosexuals decide not to hide it because they arnt harming anyone so being gay and being a peado is in no way the same.

I would run because i reckon he has peado tendancies

'as a feminist'
?
!
I think a large majority of women on this forum would identify as feminists.

Does that mean that we should all be comfortable with a man who himself professes that he likes to bring up the subject of pedophilia on dates?!

Seriously?

I do not have 'delicate mum ears'.
I have worked in and around this area for many years and I have personal experience as a victim of grooming and offending.

This is a perfectly natural boundary for a single mum to have.
There IS such a thing as grooming.
Single mums ARE targets.
Boundary pushing IS part of grooming.
Child and adult sex offenders DO prolifically use OLD to meet vulnerable woman and young people.
Offenders ARE routinely encouraged to change their name prior to leaving prison in order to protect themselves and to give them the best possible start to their new life .

You’ve gone with your gut and sacked him off. You’ve done the right thing. Don’t overthink it.

@Eternalconfusion 'I'm not going back on my decision - as I said, why was I in a relationship with someone whose red flags I was keeping a list of?!'
Just out of interest, where there other red flags with him?
I'm trying to work on my boundaries after a recent emotionally abusive relationship and I'm currently working out what things I missed/ignored/ excused and allowed.

@famousforwrongreason yes there were a couple of things. He had lied 3 times that I know of. Small inconsequential things but I noted them all down. He'd love bombed me early on and I'd called him out on it and he'd stopped. Noted that down too. He'd made a couple of "jokes" about addictions he had which he then said he didn't have, he had only been joking. Noted that down too.

All together the list became too long to justify/accept/excuse any more.

Actually the list was a really good way of keeping track of things. Because I ended up forgetting these small incidents, which on their own weren't enough to dump him for, every time I added to the list I'd be reminded of previous incidents.

Paedophilia isn't a sexual orientation, just like bestiality isn't. It's best understood as like a fetish; exclusive sexual arousal related to something which is not inherently sexual. Some fetishes are harmless, like popping balloons, and others are very harmful, like beating people.
People who are exclusively aroused by children are not just like people who are exclusively aroused by the same sex. Sexual attraction to other adults is normative human behaviour. Paedophilia is a malfunction.

Eternal - love the list! Fab! Go you!