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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

How do you reconcile someone being capable of being aggressive/violent with them being a "nice" person.

186 replies

GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 13:41

A short while ago I posted a thread asking for opinions on my dh, who was violent towards me (flung me, held me down, no hitting) about 14 yrs ago during a cycle of severe arguments, and who had not repeated such behaviour until he "loomed" over me/squared up to recently during a bad argument.

I'm looking into separation and trying to get my head around everything - the latter being v important to me in choosing a course and sticking to it.

The thing is my DH is - quite honestly - a nice/good person 99% of the time. He is, and I'm not deluded in the way most MNers will believe an op to be when they say this, a good father who takes as much strain off me as he can in spite of having a v demanding job and has since our DD was born.

He is on the while very kind - just one example off the top.of my head is that, when my sister was arguing a lot with her DH and it looked like he was going to obstruct her from going on a trip (marathon and sightseeing) and money was ab issue, he instantly looked troubled and said 'how much does she need, we'll give it to her".

How do I reconcile all the good parts of his character (the majority) with what he did, the line he crossed years ago, and was toeing up to again recently?

OP posts:
Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 14:34

I am reading and taking in everyone's posts btw, I appreciate them all.

OP posts:
Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 14:36

Because everyone is capable of violence under the wrong circumstances.

MN says some men are never ever violent. That you should always ltb and find one who is never ever violent.

OP posts:
category12 · 29/02/2020 14:38

Everyone is capable of violence is not the same as everyone uses violence.

12345kbm · 29/02/2020 14:38

OP, I don't have a ringside seat into your relationship. I was giving examples of a trigger that may cause an abuser to resort to physical violence. He went to a lap dancing club, you argued with him about it and he got violent. It doesn't matter what you said or did, he has no right to become violent.

Do you have any guarantee that your lovely, nice and adoring husband isn't going to 'loom' over your child when he is tired or challenged? Do you have any guarantee that your child isn't going to witness him becoming aggressive with you?

Your relationship doesn't sound particularly good anyway. You cheated on him and lied about it. He went to a lap dancing club and got violent with you when challenged. He became aggressive with you again and loomed over you to get you to shut up.

Couple's counselling is never recommended in abusive relationships. It's obviously up to you if you stay and he no doubt will get aggressive with you again because that's what he does to get you to STFU. You're taking a risk by staying with him and risking your children's safety by doing so.

Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 14:40

He's a nasty person capable of pretending to be nice.

While I don't disagree with Toria's list and it is helping me - he dies t pretend to be nice. He does genuinely have good, kind afoects to his character (the majority in fact), I've seen it consistently over the last 16 yrs when he had no benefit from it.

Again, I'm not saying this because I don't want to hear what you're saying, I'm hearing it. I'm just being honest/fair.

OP posts:
NotNowPlzz · 29/02/2020 14:41

He went to a lap dancing club, you argued with him about it and he got violent. It doesn't matter what you said or did, he has no right to become violent.

Disingenuous in the extreme. She had just explained her cheating and lying in depth and said she would do so again. You conveniently missed that out. I'm not excusing the violence but really at least try to get the facts right instead of slanting it like that.

AnotherMurkyDay · 29/02/2020 14:44

In the situation with about the grotto, I think you had overstepped. He had tried to leave the argument and you pursued it even though you knew emotions were heightened and you were both sleep deprived. You had cornered him emotionally and so he responded by making himself bigger ("squaring up") which is how we are predisposed to react when feeling under attack. I don't think that he was abusive, I think it is a flash of our more primitive reactions. It's like the partner who keeps shouting in their victims face until they snap and hit them. It sounds like You pushed him too far and it scared you when he didn't stay calm and kind and passive. I don't think this is a clear cut situation at all.

12345kbm · 29/02/2020 14:45

@NotNowPlzz Can you explain how he has a right to get violent please? It doesn't matter if she rubbed the affair in his face or not, he does not have a right to get violent. People are not entitled to smack others around because they don't like what they are saying. Don't excuse male violence and abuse. He could have walked away but he chose physical aggression. He's done it again now. I'm not the one being disingenuous here and finding excuses for domestic abuse.

Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 14:46

He went to a lap dancing club and got violent with you when challenged

He didn't get violent when challenged about going into the Lao dancing club on the stag do, I challenged him about it, questioned him, finished with him, didn't follow through, asked him to explain repeatedly (as nauseum in fact, I admit it) .... It was weeks if not months down the line when we were having another "discussion" about it and he said he's never have finished with me over the equivalent of worse and I told him the full details of when id cheated (and expressed a lack of regret and that I'd do it again now that I'd seen what he'd done) ... That he was violent.

Just to be clear.

There is still no excuse for it though.

OP posts:
NotNowPlzz · 29/02/2020 14:46

@AnotherMurkyDay agreed

BumbleBeee69 · 29/02/2020 14:47

1% is enough to kill you

category12 · 29/02/2020 14:48

If you have no sex life, plus other issues, and he agrees that you should separate, why are you focusing so much on these particular incidents? Does it have to be him completely to blame for you to call it a day?

Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 14:48

Everyone is capable of violence is not the same as everyone uses violence.

But is that what that poster was saying, I thought not. Maybe I've misunderstood her post.

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NotNowPlzz · 29/02/2020 14:49

The first incident was abhorrent, yes. Her behaviour was also disgusting but didn't excuse his behaviour. But he has not 'done it again'. The second situation OP was emotionally abusive and he did not touch her.

Fannia · 29/02/2020 14:51

You know we were just talking about the late Jean Vanier the founder of the L 'arche communities who did so much for the disabled, they called him a saint and people were absolutely devastated to learn he sexually abused women, my mum was in tears when she read about it.
I think it's impossible to trust someone who has behaved so badly and broken your trust.

NotNowPlzz · 29/02/2020 14:51

@BumbleBeee69 highly unlikely. Men who kill most often have a continual track record of violence and control and kill when she threatens to leave or leaves. He is amenable to separation. He is not that man.

Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 14:53

After the incident 14 years ago, did he recognise that it was wrong and take any steps to work on himself to try to ensure that nothing like that would ever happen again?

It's a long time ago now but he said there was no excuse for it.

He did not, to my knowledge, do anything/take any steps.

Recently, after he loomed over me/squared up to me and we discussed it, he looked troubled, said/agreed that it was a type of bullying and when I asked if he would consider getting "help", said that he would be open to that.

However he has not arranged anything in the week (?) since that discussion, though he had been away with work.

I also think he thinks that he could do that but all the other issues; lack of affection, no sex life, being like friends/co-parents/housemates but not partners or lovers etc are still there.

OP posts:
CassidyStone · 29/02/2020 14:56

Do you actually want to end your marriage? Or are you both willing to work at it, and stop the 1% of nastiness? The first episode of violence sounds as if you taunted him with details of your affair, and his reaction, although over the top, was due to that. I'm not minimising domestic violence, but you sound just as bad as him, tbh.

HGranger · 29/02/2020 14:58

My husband has pushed and shoved me a couple of times. That doesn't bother me as much as the nasty words. I asked him why he did it, and he said he just wanted to hurt me. And now he wonders why I've distanced myself from him. You need to do the best thing for you.

AnotherMurkyDay · 29/02/2020 15:00

Do you feel like there needs to be a big blow up of some kind to be able to end the relationship? Somebody needs to cheat and be found out? There needs to be abuse/violence? Somebody needs to be the villain of the peace? Because honestly it sounds like you are both unhappy, not in love anymore, enmeshed in many ways but not together, just in an unhappy state of stasis too paralysed to make the next vital step and separate.

If he had hit you would you have left him? If you would have done you know it's time to leave. You don't need to go out fighting, the fire has dwindled out already. Stop living in the ashes.

Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 15:01

He has told me he wants a divorce maybe twice or more since our DD arrived; when I went to follow on one of those times through, he backed out. I know he'd probably go for it though if we didn't have DD.

Ironically if we didn't have DD a lot of the sleep deprivation, tiredness, strain, stress, pressure, crankiness etc wouldnt be there and we probably (?) wouldn't be considering separation.

OP posts:
Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 15:02

*follow through

OP posts:
AnotherMurkyDay · 29/02/2020 15:04

@GilbertMarkham

It sounds like you are both trying to avoid being responsible for the ending. He initiated it, and backed out. Your still burying your head in the sand and blaming your circumstances. One of you needs to brave, or this is going to be drawn out and painful, and your child really deserves better than being in the stuck in the middle of that. If you can't do it for you, do it for your child.

Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 15:06

Do you feel like there needs to be a big blow up of some kind to be able to end the relationship? Somebody needs to cheat and be found out? There needs to be abuse/violence? Somebody needs to be the villain of the peace? Because honestly it sounds like you are both unhappy, not in love anymore, enmeshed in many ways but not together, just in an unhappy state of stasis too paralysed to make the next vital step and separate.

No, I don't.

That's why I'm taking the practical steps (consulting cab, looking at finances etc) and trying to process the emotional side .. partly with some help from all you wonderful MNers.

I'd like it to end civilly and constructively if it ends.

OP posts:
Original poster
GilbertMarkham · 29/02/2020 15:12

Sometimes I can feel quite neutral about separating and later divorcing, and him not being my partner ... Other times I feel like I love him and absolutely don't want to do it

He seems to have some similar conflicted feelings. A while back I asked him if he actually loved anymore/at all and he said yes, and that he probably always would. But I know that he thinks there's lots of things wrong and is pessimistic about hem being fixed.

He seems ashamed of his behaviour (looming over me/squaring up to me) but also focuses on the other things he thinks are dysfunctional/dissatisfactory (lack of sex life, lack of affection from me etc) whereas my focus is on this issue as the one that decides whether I stay and try to resolve any other issues.

OP posts: