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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

is this a big red flag? Or am I a big red flag?

648 replies

aquickfiresidechat · 25/01/2020 23:19

I've been dating someone for a year. He works in the Geneva office of my company and he travels to London, and I to Geneva, once every other week, so it works out that we have seen each other for a period of days (2 or 3) each week staying at each other's flats/or hotels.

In the company we have a bulletin that goes round daily saying who is in which office within Europe. New man and I also have access to each other's calendars so some days I like to see what he is up to and imagine him going about his day and I always imagined he liked this too.

Anyway, we both went away separately for Christmas and came back early January. We were talking and chatting regularly on the phone like we always do about when we could next see each other. He then went on a business trip and was busy with meetings and time difference, so we did not get a chance to speak much.

Two weeks ago, I noticed on the company bulletin that he was due to be in London the next day. I assumed he had just forgotten to mention it being so busy and that he would make arrangements with me shortly. The next day came and he was not in the office. I double clicked on his diary and saw that he was in meetings in London but not coming into the office.

I sent him a message and said "why didn't you tell me you are in London? Can we see each other tonight?" He texted back a bit short and told me to meet him for a drink after work.

I arrived and asked him how he was. He said, "shocked." I said "why shocked?" he said "because you have been going through my diary and checking up on me." I said "but we have access to each other's diaries, I saw you were in London, and I assumed we'd see each other?" He sat there open mouthed for about 10 mins while I tried to justify why I had looked at his diary and questioned him.

When I got upset he became softer and said he wanted to make me happy and he was sorry for not telling me, but he had terrible jetlag, was completely underwater with work and not yet recovered from Christmas and just felt he needed a night to sleep. He cancelled his client dinner and we spent most of the evening talking about it. I was actually crying because I was so shocked at the sudden attitude change. He asked me to stay the night and I was still quite upset and said no, and we went our separate ways and he flew back to Geneva the next day. We agreed that we would communicate openly about when he is in London going forward.

The next morning he rang me before his flight, quite agitated and said that he had not slept a wink because he felt quite angry that I would demand he see me every time he is in London. He said it had nothing to do with seeing anyone else or not wanting the relationship, but he would be travelling to the UK more frequently and just the thought that, that would be my expectation every single time he was here felt very demanding. His justification for this was that he was most often knackered and would have evening meetings with clients or customers and therefore would not want to trek over to my flat at 11pm or midnight and then fly back to Geneva the next day. He said "you are my priority, but you cannot be my priority all the time." While I wasn't really happy with this, we agreed that he would tell me when he was in London even if he was not going to see me.

I found this new arrangement quite difficult to understand, as this was obviously not our previous pattern, so I didn't feel I was delusional or imagining the relationship was more than it was, for expecting the previous pattern to continue, even though at the time he was telling me this I was apologising rather than justifying my thought process. I felt that he reset the relationship and bamboozled me into thinking that questioning him or his behaviour was stalker-esque or obsessive.

We carried on speaking on the phone every day and texting a lot (it's always him initiating contact. He calls me about five times a day just to chat,) Three days later the company bulletin came again saying that he was in London. He had not told me this.

I double clicked on his diary only to see that he had codified it. Ie, replaced information with a letter and a number. All bookings and reservations that he usually made and I could previously see were now password protected and then diary entries had been made private. Seeing this made me feel like a stalker and made me think that he thought I was a stalker.

He carried on throughout the day communicating with me as normal. I did not ask him where he was. At around 7pm he said he was off to a client dinner and that he would sign off the the night as it would be late. I assume he thought I thought he was in Geneva.

I don't know what got into me but I felt I wanted to know for sure, so at midnight I went to the hotel he normally stays at while here, and I waited in a bar over the road where I could see the door. Lo and behold, I saw him returning to the hotel and going in late. Alone.

I texted him. "Hey can we talk?" He replied immediately. "Sorry, no. Off to bed."

I felt humiliated and embarrassed of myself and like a true stalker. The next morning I decided it was over. I felt that if I told him the reasons why (I was upset he had coded his diary and I had spied on him outside his hotel) it would give me more reasons to feel embarrassed. So I just stopped communicating with him entirely.

Two weeks went by and I ignored all calls and messages and took a week off work to go away and switched my phone off. When I came back to work, I found him in my office, beside himself. Why had I done this to him? What was my problem? Why had I not replied to him? What did I think I was doing? He had been in London looking for me etc.

I've agreed to chat to him about it all on Wednesday when I am next in Geneva. I don't trust him. I cant tell him why.

I don't know anymore whether his behaviour is the red flag or whether mine is.

What do you think??

OP posts:
Leflic · 26/01/2020 00:38

Absolutely typical behaviour to only get interested once you blank him.If you want this relationship to work I’d not make any demands of him in terms of monogamy or time and assume that you have no ties with him either. Go out see other people be busy.
If he wants you, he’ll come get you.

Also the travelling thing does make things harder. You’ll both be more independent than regular couples. Takes a lot of effort to put your time into a relationship under the circumstances..

TatianaLarina · 26/01/2020 00:38

Some posters on this thread are really not getting it at all.

TatianaLarina · 26/01/2020 00:42

Absolutely typical behaviour to only get interested once you blank him.

Yes. It’s hard to know whether he’s dialling the relationship down intentionally and was incensed by the rejection nonetheless, or whether he always goes about relationships like this and doesn’t realise that it doesn’t really work.

1forAll74 · 26/01/2020 00:43

It's like something out of a silly movie.. You are the woman who stalks a man, who you think is serious about you. He, kind of likes you at times, but likes his own space as well. So best to leave him to his own life really.

myhoodie · 26/01/2020 00:45

The advice from GilbertMarkham is excellent imo, I would take careful note of that.

Qwerty543 · 26/01/2020 00:47

If the roles were reversed no one would be saying the man was justifed to act this way. He was clear he has a lot of work and is busy so too tired to come to yours so late but you ramped up the stalking. More red flags from you and shit communication from you both.

Oh and ghosting him was a shitty thing to do.

mummyway · 26/01/2020 00:47

Not you, its him. Don't tell him the reasons that you have listed, tell him he made you feel bad for looking at his diary which is common between colleagues and esp lovers and you don't want to be made to feel that way

TatianaLarina · 26/01/2020 00:48

Yeah, it would be a movie written by a man implying the woman was a bit crazy, when actually his weird behaviour had driven her a bit crazy.

She’s thinks he’s serious about her because that’s what he’s told her, so when he doesn’t want to see her she’s confused.

“The Crazy Ex Gf” out now.

MrsAJ27 · 26/01/2020 00:48

It is a massive red flag!!

I honestly wouldn't engage with him anymore, he sounds like an absolute fucking prick

PatellarTendonitis · 26/01/2020 00:54

This is not a relationship. So you send him some twaddle, feel like it's time to move on, all the best to you, so long and then move on. Don't bother about him anymore. Just cut it off with talk about how it's time to move on.

dellacucina · 26/01/2020 00:56

I don't really get why you're getting so much flack here. Your behaviour wasn't ideal, but his behaviour is at best confusing and alienating.

NRPDad · 26/01/2020 00:56

My perspective

  1. from what you say, the relationship is still relatively casual although monogamous, you aren't just dating/having fun but it's not like if you were both in one country you'd be moving in together

  2. I assume you are using outlook or Google calendar at your business. He didn't realise you both hold access to each others calendars and didn't realise until you initially revealed it. I can understand this could have been potentially quite shocking to him, imagining you constantly checking his whereabouts.

  3. now he is spending more time in London, probably panicked and thought your expectation would be every night in London spent at yours so tried to set boundaries and keep this as a 2/3 nights per week thing as it had been previously. Probably worried about losing control of his independence etc. I think this is quite normal in a relationship that is not ready for moving in together etc

  4. codified calendar and not always making it overt he is in London in order to feel he has some independence and freedom to have a kip in his hotel on his own and not be obliged to spend all sleep time and free evenings with you

  5. the waiting outside his hotel is creepy. I think if you told him you did this it would quite rightly scare him right away. The tone of your post seems generally quite intense and I guess you're an overthinker/worrier?

  6. the sadness he has after the lost contact. Well you had a good relationship seeing each other regularly when possible and now you're not talking to him at all. Makes sense to me. This is all crossed wires between him freaking out that you have been able to track him, his increased presence in London and him wanting to not feel obliged he has to spend all time in the UK with you and you thinking he is acting suspicious etc

My advice. Talk to him. Try and keep things broadly how they were. 2 or 3 nights spent together a week. Try to plan them around busy schedules. See if you can figure it out?

TatianaLarina · 26/01/2020 00:59

This is not a relationship.

Correct.

G’night OP and good luck.

youcancallmequeenE · 26/01/2020 01:01

Oh dear 🙈. It sounds a bit like a storm in a tea cup to me.

I can kind of see where your bf is coming from as I wouldn't have an issue sharing my calendar with anyone but I'd be feeling very weird if my OH started looking at where I was going to be. I suppose it's because I'd expect us to be able to have that conversation rather than feel like I'm being checked up on if that makes sense.

It's weird that he calls you 5 times a day. What do you even have to talk about?! In your defence I would be pissed off if my oh lived in another country and came over here without telling me. I would understand if logistics meant it was too difficult to arrange a meeting but to not even mention it would feel evasive.

I suspect it he's anything like my OH it's nothing to do with evasiveness and everything to just not wanting to have the conversation as that would involve having to explain himself and a potential argument (in his head).

Going to the hotel and watching him WU but it's horrid when you've got suspicion going round in your mind due to a lack of communication.

YWBU to just ghost him. It shows his feelings for you that he came over to see what was wrong. He obviously cares about you. He just got the communication wrong.

I guess it depends where you want to go with this. Either own up and tell him the truth. It's really not that bad. Especially when it's in context. Tell him that you were hurt that he just neglected to mention something so important and that you don't need to see him every hour of the day but that it's not the done thing to hide things from your partner. Tell him not to be a dick next time.

PersonaNonGarter · 26/01/2020 01:04

People who are calling the OP stalkerish for the diary thing - it’s a work culture issue. At my firm everyone has access to everyone else’s calendar and you are expected to check each other’s even before making a phone call.

If it is that sort of place that the OP works, he should definitely have said which City he was in on the calendar.

youcancallmequeenE · 26/01/2020 01:04

Oh. And tell him that he doesn't need to codify his calendar as that's just led to more unrest. Ask him what arrangements he wants. Does he want to stick to the 2/3 times a week? If so reassure him that you're happy with that! He probably just thinks that you'll be demanding to see him all the time.

NoWeAreNotNearlyThereYet · 26/01/2020 01:09

It seems very odd to me that from January to Christmas everything if fine and dandy. But you both go and do your own thing over Christmas and when you get back together the goal posts seem to have changed. I'd be wondering what happened over the Christmas period.

PatellarTendonitis · 26/01/2020 01:10

What person, who's made it patently clear to you he doesn't see this as a relationship, is worth making such a fool out of yourself? Seriously! Have some self-respect here. You got what you did out of each other, it's run its course, done, over. Have some dignity here! Just stop talking to him entirely if you can't just message him some twaddle about 'It's been lovely, but I feel it's time to move on. All the best to you. x' The end. No need for dramatics, just cut and drift.

LangSpartacusCleg · 26/01/2020 01:13
  1. Never mind a red flag, this is the whole flag factory.
  2. Stop engaging with him socially. (You have already done this).
  3. Don’t volunteer an explanation. If he pushes or you need to ‘explain’ to get him off your back, you do not owe him a blow by blow description and rationalisation of your actions. Other options include -
A) It just wasn’t working for me. B) I need some time to myself. C) I’m seeing someone else. D) I didn’t think we were that serious that I needed to explain myself to you. OR E) there really is nothing more to say. I don’t want to see you socially anymore. I have moved on. Why? Because I’m no longer attracted to you or see A-D above.

If at all possible, have this conversation during the daytime, not over dinner or drinks. And in a quiet spot in the office, rather than restaurant or hotel room.

In the gentlest possible way, he sounds like a player. He is not honest with you. He has made you cry because of his response to your feelings. He is not the one for you. You can do better.

Fartnite · 26/01/2020 01:15

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Butterfly98 · 26/01/2020 01:18

@aquickfiresidechat he is the red flag here not you! OK it was a bit OTT of you to wait and watch him go into his hotel from across the road! This is a relationship of a year so hardly a fling. Wtf would he be secretive with his work diary, I'm assuming it's a generic one which lists all employees locations on various days so it's hardly personal? These are very common nowadays. Surly other colleagues would need access to it as well to arrange meetings etc, wouldn't it be frustrating for them if they have to enter a password each time and would they even know it? Btw when you meet up to discuss your relationship DO NOT under any circumstances tell him that you waited across the road to see him going into the hotel! For starters he will think you're a real stalker and could even use this against you with HR if he turned nasty.

LovePoppy · 26/01/2020 01:21

I don't think you waiting outside the hotel was great, but I wouldn't call it 'stalking' - you wanted information to find out if you needed to end the relationship

What would you call it had a man done it? I’d call it stalking.

Fartnite · 26/01/2020 01:23

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Luckystar777 · 26/01/2020 01:23

Lol, he's an idiot. Did he not realise you could see his calendar? That's his fault, not yours. And after a year of dating I would expect the person to tell me when they're going to be nearby so we could potentially meet. He's the jerk, not you.

Fartnite · 26/01/2020 01:26

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.