I'm in such pain

[NeverGotMyPuppy]

I just dont know what to do.
DH and I have been married for 10 years. All mostly happy. We have a 16 month old DS.
DH has always been argumentative - I often feel I have to replay conversations to 'prove' my point. I've often said I could do with CCTV and feel like I'm often on trial. He gets obsessed over the minutiae of arguments and i feel like we have an argument within an argument within an argument IYSWIM.

He has got worse recently. He is utterly defensive and sees so much as criticism - it blinds him to everything else. I'm finding myself utterly exhausted living with him. Today as an example:

DH gets DS ready for childminder. I say - perfectly nicely 'r those the trousers he was wearing yesterday? If so they r dirty'. DH asks 'really - where?' I tell him. He repeats the question in 2 other ways, disbelieving that they are dirty. I say 'honestly, I had to brush the food off them to get him in the carseat last night'. DH asks me to show him. DS isnt fond of staying still. DH says a little bit of a mark isnt important so he wont change him.
So I go and change him. I show DH the old leggings 'oh, I didn't see that'.

The day before he spent 20 minutes arguing why DS's toyboy was a perfectly sensible place to leave his toothbrush - 'it's a flat surface' when I pointed out that it makes my life quite difficult when he doesnt put it back in the bathroom as I have to search around to clean DS's teeth.

I know it sounds like a tiny thing. But this is most days of my life. I'm utterly exhausted by it.

What do I do. Im so sad and i feel so alone. Am I going mad? Am i in the wrong here?

What was DH like before you married? Was he difficult then? It sounds like he was a bit...

If you are sure you want to stay together could you reduce your working hours to take over more of childcare then you’d feel more comfortable? Perhaps not the perfect solution but whilst he has been a bit neglectful frankly, most men arent as good at looking after children in my opinion as mums are...

Sounds like too much hard work to me OP.
It’s not helpful to flirt with others every time you hit a brick wall.
I hope the counselling works out - however, I have a feeling it’s just his nature.

I have RTFT.

One thing that really stood out to me (other than the strange and rather aggressive response to AnneLovesGilbert's perfectly reasonable comments) is this:

I also reassured him and said that the cat can be quick and comforted him

I thought you were talking about your DS, OP, but you were in fact talking about your husband. It sounds as if this is part of the problem. It must be horrible to know that every one of your decisions/actions is going to be criticised, analysed, scrutinised, found wanting. Your husband presumably feels that whatever he does, isn't good enough.

I think your decision to involve professionals is good, as there is too much for you to unscramble alone (and everyone on here has their own views, based largely on their own experiences and on the limited information they have about your situation).

I do agree with the PP who says you would be crucified on here if you were a man saying he had already had one EA and was flirting with another woman, and blaming his wife for his behaviour.

However, I am not saying that to criticise you - just an observation about MN in general. I had both an EA and an actual affair when I was married, so I can hardly criticise anyone for that.

Thanks

Just to repeat again, I havent blamed him for my behaviour.

And I started this thread saying I was very upset. Annie's first response was to tell me that i wasnt very upset and the leggings couldn't have been that dirty. When the whole point of the discussion was i feel I have to defend myself and explain everything to my husband, surely it seems quite obvious that that comment might be quite tricky?

What struck me is that he is a barrister.

He's used to arguing cases where it doesn't matter (to him) if his client did it or not, all that matters is whether he can win the verbal sparring match.

I think you need to point this out to him and explain that, when it comes to your son, what actually happened does matter because ultimately DS was safe or he wasn't (e.g left in car seat, bleach on vest, cat).

It doesn't matter if DH convinces himself (and tries to convince you) afterwards that DS was never in real danger / it wasn't his fault / that isn't how he remembers it... because it doesn't change the FACT that your son wasn't safe. Ultimately that's all you're concerned about, and there's no point in having a debate afterwards.

Thanks.

He does get it... eventually. But it takes the post mortem to get there. And if I just let it go he would think that everything was ok.

Bleach example - DS with DH in bathroom, I was in bedroom. I hear DS cry but I know DH is with him so I dont panic. A few mins later i go into bathroom, ask - out of interest not in an accusing way - if DS is ok. DH says 'the toilet brush fell on him' I say 'but it was up on the shelf?!' DH then says 'well I knocked it'. I say ok, did he get anything on him, DH says no. I go to pick DS up and see it is all down his front. I strip him and give him a cool bath. During this I'm getting a barrage from DH, everything from 'why is there bleach in the toilet brush holder' to 'why was it up on the shelf' mixed in with 'nothing happened, u dont need to do anything'.

I then show him the vest - his response is 'Oh I didnt see that. Do we need to call a doctor?'

Its knackering.

Op he doesn’t seem to have much common sense :(

Just to repeat again, I havent blamed him for my behaviour.

You did though because you said that the EA and flirting relationship was your reaction to what's going on at home is your husband's behaviour. So, you are blaming him. Has your husband worked through his feelings about your affair? Is this subsequent behaviour a residual effect from that? How did it come to light? Is he finding it hard to trust you so when you say something about your son he doesn't believe you and is compelled to keep questioning you about it?

Honestly, you both need relationship counseling but I wouldn't be too quick to blame him for all of the problems. Many people would never be able to forgive their partner for having an affair.

I had an EA because I was getting completely ignored. That is the reason. It isn't his fault I did it, it wasnt the right thing to do, it was entirely wrong. I chose to do it. But I did it out of loneliness.
The person who murders someone because they have been raped by them is still a murderer. But there is a reason for it.

Clearly I'm not comparing what happened to being raped.

He doesnt have any trust issues. I told him about the EA. He didnt care. At my behest we went to counselling. The therapist actually turned to him and said 'do you care at all about what your wife does?'

I had an EA because I was getting completely ignored. That is the reason. It isn't his fault I did it,

But that is blaming him. It's exactly the same as men who have affairs because their wives don't understand them, or have gone off sex, or who ignore them and concentrate on the children... There were problems in your marriage and so you had an affair.

Maybe the counselor did ask him if he cared what you did or not. Maybe he is devastated by it but won't talk to you, maybe he doesn't care. Either way, it doesn't sound great. Why bring a child into a relationship that you are so unhappy in?

I couldn't be taking clearer responsibility. It wasnt the right thing to do. But that is the reason I did it. I'm sure lots of men who cheat do have sexless marriages. They are still arseholes.

This happened over 8 years ago. It was a very long time ago. I didnt bring a child into an unhappy relationship.

Well it doesn't sound like the problems were resolved does it because it's all still going on.

He's still doing what he did and you're doing what you did do, it might be 8 years later but what's changed?

I hope counseling helps you both.

OP if you visit Relate's website, disconnection, imbalance and feeling unloved are all listed as common reasons for cheating. Like you've said, it doesn't make it right but when you look inside yourself and think about the reason why you did it, that's the same reason as many and acknowledging that doesn't mean you're saying it wasn't your fault or wasn't a bad decision, and it doesn't mean you're blaming your partner but at the same time it is acknowledging you were missing something from your relationship and you sought that elsewhere. Please don't feel like you have to keep justifying yourself to people on here who likely know fine well what you mean.

Sorry, no, I don't know what she means.

If you're not happy in your relationship, it's lacking something, you aren't happy whatever then the answer is to leave. The answer isn't to have an affair. So, no, I don't understand any possible justification at all for having an affair.

Did i say it justified it?

If you are unhappy, the best thing to do is try and resolve and if that's not possible, leave. OP made a bad decision and had an affair. She's had the self awareness to identify what feelings were behind her doing that. Doesn't mean she's blaming her partner, doesn't mean she's not taking responsibility, means she's acknowledged that what she did was wrong and has taken the time to figure out what was going on in her head.

She's had the self awareness to identify what feelings were behind her doing that.

Well not really because she's now embarked on a flirtatious relationship - whatever that might be - but doesn't sound that far removed from an EA so is history repeating itself?

So what exactly are you taking issue with? I defended OP because you were accusing her of blaming her husband for her emotional affair, now you seem to have moved on to taking issue with the fact that it looks like maybe she hasn't learned her lesson and you're challenging me on that.

It's obvious from what she's written that she knows she's in the wrong she doesn't need to be told again.

I'm challenging her on excusing her behaviour based on what her husband was doing. And is doing so again now with regards to the baby. So everything appears to be his fault - he won't do what she says, keeps questioning her which she finds upsetting, etc etc. However, isn't this exactly what men say when finding reasons at to why they had affairs - it's all the wife's fault - she was cold, too fat, let herself go, disinterested in sex etc etc. Basically nothing is their fault. That's how this is reading to me. Nothing is the ops fault. She's saying the EA was her fault, but...and then says that due to what's going on at home she's started up a flirtatious relationship with a man at work. Whose fault is that then?

Her fault. Obviously. Driven by the feelings she has as a result of what's happening at home. Doesn't mean she's dealing with it in the right way, but neither should she ignore the issue is there. What do you want her to say? I'm having an emotional affair conpletely unrelated to the fact I'm unhappy at home, there's no connection whatsoever, it's just because I'm an arsehole?

I think I know how you feel. When my marriage to ExDH was breaking down, everything was questioned and dismissed. I used to tell him we were supposed to be on the same side and I wasn't his enemy. I felt utterly defeated. My heart would sink at the monotony.

Well if it were my husband doing it then yes, I would agree with you last sentence.

People make choices. She could have chosen to leave 8byeaes ago when she had the first EA if things were so terrible at home, or at anytime since. She could leave now rather than start up another affair is things are so terrible.

I couldn't imagine living day to day with this. But for what it is worth, I don't think his behaviour is focused on you per se. What strikes me is that it is important to him that he is NEVER to blame for anything - so he denies anything bad happened, then denies there were any consequences, then thinks it was not his fault anyway - and finally reluctantly admits. The bleach incident was classic of this.

I've met a lot of men (not women) in law who operate on this basis - won't admit any fault. It works quite well for them in their work lives. Most of them are able to leave it at work and not bring it home.

On a side note, astonished at how many MNers are just fine with a child going to nursery in food-stained clothes, being able to knock over a cup of tea on the floor, have bleach on their vests, and being left in a car alone and consider the OP very highly strung because these things matter to her. Amazing.

TBF, I think the leaving in the child is a complete no no, a never event, and I said so.

The food stained clothing isn't the greatest thing but not is it the worst thing. Depends how bad, how obvious etc.

The cup of tea I can understand. In a rush to stop something dangerous from happening you just drop what you're doing. You don't stop to think about where to leave your tea.

As for the bleach incident - I think it's dangerous to leave an open container of bleach where it can be knocked over so on that I think it's 50:50 - a pot containing bleach shouldn't have been left where it could be knocked over and then the DH should have checked the baby properly. Luckily this time it only stained his clothes but it could have splashed in his eyes. Whose fault would that have been - the person who left an open container of bleach where it could be knocked over it the person who knocked it over accidentally?

I really don't think it's so clear cut as to be able to say 1 of them is to blame here.

When my children were born I had my ways of doing things and to me, they were the right way to do them. I soon learnt that they weren't the right way they were my way and my DH no more had to do them my way as I had to do them his way. It's no good keep criticising someone for every little thing they do eg leaving the toothbrush in the wrong place because you erode their confidence and make them feel like their is no point in doing anything because no matter what they do it's wrong.

Take some responsibility for your affair.

@pallisers incredible isnt it? When a couple of weeks ago a lady asked about leaving her child in the clean vest he had slept in for the next day she was called all sorts. What can I say.

@Emma198 thank you. I'm going to try and leave this thread now because I'm sort of getting tired of being attacked and not listened to. People will create whatever narrative they want to.