I'm in such pain

[NeverGotMyPuppy]

I just dont know what to do.
DH and I have been married for 10 years. All mostly happy. We have a 16 month old DS.
DH has always been argumentative - I often feel I have to replay conversations to 'prove' my point. I've often said I could do with CCTV and feel like I'm often on trial. He gets obsessed over the minutiae of arguments and i feel like we have an argument within an argument within an argument IYSWIM.

He has got worse recently. He is utterly defensive and sees so much as criticism - it blinds him to everything else. I'm finding myself utterly exhausted living with him. Today as an example:

DH gets DS ready for childminder. I say - perfectly nicely 'r those the trousers he was wearing yesterday? If so they r dirty'. DH asks 'really - where?' I tell him. He repeats the question in 2 other ways, disbelieving that they are dirty. I say 'honestly, I had to brush the food off them to get him in the carseat last night'. DH asks me to show him. DS isnt fond of staying still. DH says a little bit of a mark isnt important so he wont change him.
So I go and change him. I show DH the old leggings 'oh, I didn't see that'.

The day before he spent 20 minutes arguing why DS's toyboy was a perfectly sensible place to leave his toothbrush - 'it's a flat surface' when I pointed out that it makes my life quite difficult when he doesnt put it back in the bathroom as I have to search around to clean DS's teeth.

I know it sounds like a tiny thing. But this is most days of my life. I'm utterly exhausted by it.

What do I do. Im so sad and i feel so alone. Am I going mad? Am i in the wrong here?

Hey OP,

First of all I'm so sorry you feel this way. I know it's a tough situation.

I'm not discrediting your feelings at all. I just wanted to offer another perspective?

My DS is slightly younger, 7 months old. And my husband sounds incredibly similar to yours. My standards are fairly high and I'm very vigilant with health and safety, he however is a little more relaxed. He isn't negligent, but there are things he would do which I wouldn't. Neither of us is perfect, and neither of us are right or wrong. I can come across as a control freak and sometimes he comes across as relaxed. He is, however, an absolutely amazing dad and loves his son a lot. We are both lucky to have him. And I would hope he says the same about me.

Fact is, accidents happen with kids and adults make mistakes. We've all made mistakes. But most importantly, it sounds like he's keen to learn from a mistake when he makes one (like the cut or the tea).

I do think mumsnet can be be guilty of encouraging people to 'LTB' when a situation could be resolved. Only you know if your child is safe to be around his dad, but the fact that you've allowed him to be around him for 16 months makes me suspect he is. (It sounds like he's pretty hands on by the sounds of things, to get him dressed in the morning).

He might not do things the way you do them, but appreciate your way isn't the only way- and yes certain things should never happen (like being left in a car alone!), but if that's the case and it compromises your child's safety, perhaps you could clearly spell out a list of things you don't want him to ever do.

I'm guessing you were on maternity leave and he didn't have a long paternity? Perhaps he's lacking in confidence as a result. My advice would be, on the things that don't really matter, for the sake of his confidence, just let them go. Let him learn through making mistakes.

Or if it really does both you, perhaps find a way to communicate that you both respond well to. There must be a reason that he's defensive. It doesn't make it ok, but what causes it? Can you change your tone to help communicate more effectively?

Sorry, I've just read my post back and I've realised that all the advice I've given is really cantered on things you could do, but not your husband taking accountability.

As well as counselling (which is a great idea), I wifi come up with some basic rules that you both agree with (do it together, let him come up with them to) around how you bring up your soon. Really factual and basic., ie.

1. DS never left alone in car
2. never leave tea within reach of child

And then basic rules for communication. Explain how his tone make you feel. Let him explain how you make him feel when you ask for him not to something and come up with some basic solutions, I.e

1. trust my opinion (when you question it it makes me feel belittled as your wife and his mother)
2. never undermine one another's opinion, so long as it's not compromising child's safety

Write them down and both agree to live by them. The minute one of you goes against a rule, remind of the thing you've both agreed and it's over. Conversation closed. You're both accountable for living by those rules

Hope that helps! Just an idea x

Hope this helps!

Doh! I meant 'centred' not 'cantered'. Sorry! Didn't mean to post again!

Lol I knew he would be a barrister!!! I feel for you OP. Sounds like he can't switch off.

If poss perhaps you and DS could stay over with a friend or family member over the weekend just to get a break and a clear head. All this bickering is not doing anyone any good.

Apricot, @livelovelaugh30 has put it so much more eloquently than I did, but that's basically what I was saying. Please ignore the critical posters and those telling you that splitting up is so wonderful. You are clearly in pain over this, and I suspect he is, too. But from your original post, you were mostly happy in the past and you can be again.

You are confused and upset because you haven't hit rock bottom yet. With a man like this you will though, it's just a matter of when.

Thanks everyone.

I'm feeling brighter this morning, not because I've decided anything but because I feel like I will make it work out whatever happens, whether we split or not. He is very happy to try counselling and he has also agreed to go for an autism test. He didnt argue when i said that this is untenable. He also looked genuinely sad, like he actually believes me.

Today he has said that he is going to try agreeing with everything- not because he thinks it's a healthy long term strategy but just to see if he can.
We will see.

We had a rough patch a few years ago. DH was at home doing a PhD and had a lot of spare time, he got involved with every hobby going. He literally just stopped caring - e.g. we went for an anniversary meal and he took me to the local shit pub, inemdednup walking back alone cos his mates were in he wanted a catch up. I ended up having a very intense emotional affair with a man - completely unsuitable, not someone I would have actually left DH over. I was honest to DH that i had feelings for this guy, he just didnt seem to care. I take full responsibility for what i did, ir was entirely wrong.

The reason I mention this is I have been quite flirty with a guy at work this week. I've always fancied him in a superficial way and I know he fancies me. I realised yesterday that there is a pattern - i turn to that when my marriage is bad. And I know that isnt a healthy, long term strategy.

Nothing will happen with this man, but I realised yesterday that that explains the increased flirtation.

The other thing I think we need to really genuinely examine is how many 'rough patches' we have had. I have happy memories of our marriage but there have also been some bad times and we need to examine if actually the balance is right. If this is more miserable than happy then life must be better apart.

if you are not getting any emotional support from your DH, & he is making you unhappy, it's easy to enjoy feeling that someone else does actually respect you.
Human nature,

Thank you. But it isnt a way of fixing things and I dont want to be that person.

but god I'd like him in a hotel room for an afternoon

I wonder if you are conflating the intense emotional connection you get in these affairs with what you think day to day emotional connection in your marriage should look like.

You won’t get the same. You just won’t. Not when you’re married, raising kids and both working. Your affairs aren’t a real life benchmark and it isn’t fair to measure your husband against them.

been there, know what you are saying puppy

I know. You are absolutely right - I'm not going to get that. And I think it is significant that the 2 guys i have felt a connection with are unsuitable (that very 19th century but u know what I mean)

I haven’t RTFT but I feel irritated for you.
Some of the replies are incredibly patronising and clearly indicate some of you have no idea how absolutely bloody awful it is to live with someone like this.
The poster that used the “water up a hill “analogy has it right. If you are unlucky like I was then this is actually the tip of the iceberg and is the start of the excruciating process of escalating emotional abuse.

I left because I couldn’t stand the toxic mixture of feigned incompetence, carelessness and obsession with control crossed with argumentative tendencies. Then other nasty stuff like gaslighting, lies to family and friends and financial control, making me hysterical about the children started.

They don’t change

I’m glad you feel more positive today & have some kind of plan. It’s encouraging that’s he’s at least open to dealing with the issues.
ExP was similarly useless about most of the practical aspects of having a small child. He took Dd out once wearing just a nappy and woolly tights on her bottom half- said he thought they were leggings with feet .
His behaviour was abusive towards me but I’m sure part on the reason I put up with it for so long was that I was utterly terrified of him having times when he had sole care of her. I could never relax when he was supposed to be looking after her. Lie-ins were impossible because he would just go to sleep on the sofa and leave her to her own devices.
This is the man though who zipped a 2year old into a backpack with her head poking out and then rode his bike with her on his back.
He had a very tough upbringing (not in this country) and joined a gang in his teens and ended up in jail. I just think his perspective on this is totally skewed.
Only you can decide what the reality of your relationship is. Good luck..

Having just read your other comments about emotional affairs then I don’t see how all this can carry on it will just damage all of you especially your child

@Thuglife oh that's awful, I'm sorry. My gut reaction is DH is not like that but there have clearly been examples when he has been similar.

@stophuggingme - I think counselling will be very helpful even if that is the decision. DS is my priority and i will do whatever I need to to protect him.

Speak to home and ask him what its all about ...tell him your sick of the pettyness just be honest with him, have it out or your going drive yourself crazy.....you shouldn't be feeling like you

Thanks Piper. I'm afraid I've tried that a billion times - it's part of why I'm feeling so knackered. I'm our relationship coach a lot of the time. After the event he usually sees what the problem was but then it just happens again. Before I was hopeful that every time was the last but I've now accepted that it isnt going to be. He went to private counselling at my behest, that worked for a bit but has clearly stopped working.
If marriage counselling doesnt help we are done. That isnt a threat, it's just an acceptance.

It sounds like your drained with it hun? If you love him it will be hard for you. But everyone deserves to be happy so do what you think is best don't just make do because thàts not fair on you

After the event he usually sees what the problem was but then it just happens again. Before I was hopeful that every time was the last but I've now accepted that it isnt going to be

You've just admitted to having a full blown emotional affair, another flirtatious relationship with an emotional connection and now your husband has agreed to agree with everything that you say????

One person in this relationship is being emotionally abused for sure. If you were a man posting that you had an affair of any type, emotional or physical, but tried to use his wife's behaviour as justification for it he would be hung drawn and quartered.

Leave your husband op. He doesn't deserve to be cheated on.

My usuabmd hadn't agreedntonsnything - that was his idea. I've said it doesnt sound like a long term strategy and nor is it what I want.

I'm not using his behaviour as justification for anything. I've not said its a right response. I've said when there was a rough patch many years ago that is what happened. I've said ive flirted with someone this week.

Ive never defended what I have done in the past and I have said that I'm not going to have an affair because it doesn't solve anything and it wouldn't be right.

But have a go if you wish, it makes no odds to me.

Thanks Piper. I want us both to be happy. If that is apart then that's what it has to be but DS is our absolute priority. Everything has to be as good as it can be for him.

I had undiagnosed PNA after his birth which hadn't helped anything at all. I went to my GP 3 times (I then tried anotther) but I was told anxiety was normal when you have a baby. That's definitely not helped.

I don’t think you’re bullying him or abusing him or cheating on him, but some of the things you’ve said (that PP have already picked up on) suggest to me that you don’t really respect him much.

But you were very dismissive of PP who didn’t see things your way. It makes me wonder if you respond in a similar way when your husband disagrees with you. Is it because you don’t like people disagreeing with you, or is it related to your anxiety? I would guess the latter. Anxiety is shit. (And anxiety is probably also the reason for desiring a bit of attention from other men when your own husband is not a source of feelings of comfort and contentment.)

Ive never defended what I have done in the past and I have said that I'm not going to have an affair because it doesn't solve anything and it wouldn't be right.

But you have had an affair.