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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

What would you do next? Am I over reacting?

370 replies

WhatWouldYouDoNext · 23/10/2019 09:53

Hi all. This is going to be quite long for clarity. Sorry and thanks for reading.

I have been very close friends with a married man for around 8 years. I'm also friendly with his wife but have a lot more in common with him. It's all above board - our families have holidayed and spent Christmas together, there are no concerns about impropriety.

Around the start of the summer, his behaviour towards me started to change - I feel like he 'argues' with me now for the sake of it (claims to be playing Devil's Advocate but also to hold these views dear, yet has also contradicted himself); has started 'picking' on me - finding fault in what I'm saying; saying things I can only assume are intended to undermine my confidence - things like telling me men have looked at me in 'disgust' or that my 'ego is showing' when I'm simply not being down on myself and that I'm single due to my resting bitch face (joke!). That kind of thing.

We play in a band together. We've gigged a lot over the summer and some of them have included overnight stays and have been a lot of fun so I didn't say anything - not wanting to create an unpleasant atmosphere for the others - and largely dealt with it by ignoring and avoiding but it hasn't made much impact. I did try telling him that his behaviour towards me had changed and I didn't like it but rather than asking what I meant or opening a dialogue, he just said, "I could say the same about you" and shut it down.

A couple of mutual friends suggested he feels threatened by my new friendships within band and is feeling pushed out; that he is jealous because I play a 'higher profile' instrument than he does - not only does this mean that I'm more 'visible' than he is but that if I can't make a gig/left band, I'd have to be replaced whereas he wouldn't. It's been suggested that he is struggling to find his place in the band and that he is trying to be 'blokey' to fit in with the men better - I know that a couple of people find him a bit 'try hard' with a particular persona he has pushed.

I don't disagree with any of that and I think that all of it is relevant. I agree that he has found it socially difficult with them but he really likes them and loves being in the band. I agree that all of those are probably an issue for him. But none of them are my fault or my problem to solve.

However, in the event that I had inadvertently 'pushed him out', at the start of September, I resolved to make more of an effort to spend time with him. Although, the only reason I was spending less time with him was because of how he was behaving towards me.

Nevertheless, I have seen him a few times over the past few weeks and it seemed to all be relatively back to normal. No issues except for maybe a couple of little comments that I didn't like but I wasn't sure if I was just more 'sensitive' to things he was saying now. But there wasn't anything specifically unkind that was directed towards me. So I started to see it as having been resolved.

Anyway, fast forward to a few days ago. We travel to/from band practise together and, at the end of practise, he said it was time to go and he straighted his arm out and put his outstretched hand into my face to push me backwards/aside. I was horrified and stunned. We'd been talking to another man who was visibly shocked by it. I felt humiliated and didn't know how to react.

What I wish I'd done was say, "what the fuck are you doing? Don't you ever fucking touch me like that again!" What I did was try and laugh it off and said to the other man, "he's a bit of a twat, isn't he?" to which my 'friend' laughed and said, "yes I am" but he was behind me and halfway out the door by this point. The other guy just looked a bit shocked and didn't reply.

I had to travel home with him but didn't speak to him and just said I was tired when he asked what the matter was. He was talking about us going out at the weekend so clearly didn't see anything wrong in what he'd done.

I have a long standing history of abuse stemming from childhood and following on to a number of abusive relationships, that still impacts on me now and, coincidentally, the following day, I had a pre-assessment appointment for therapy to deal with this. Which i why I'm not sure if I'm overreacting to this because now I feel I have completely shut down to him. I no longer consider him a friend. I want nothing more to do with him. I don't want to see, speak to, or even be in the same room as him again.

I can deal with the family/friendship side of it - I will just have nothing to do with him but I don't know what to do about band. I don't want to be in practises with him. I don't want to do gigs with him. I don't want to see him in any capacity whatsoever. But I don't see a solution. I could leave but we have several gigs coming up in the next couple of months and I'd be leaving them massively in the shit.

I've since mentioned it to one person in the band who feels that I ought to give it no energy, put it down to being his problem and not let it affect me but I've woken up again thinking about it , feeling angry and with my heart pounding. So I thought I'd bring it here.

What would you do next?

OP posts:
WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 10:59

Sadly, Random I think you're right.

It was a couple of years ago that I realised he hadn't told her. I set up a whatsapp group with the 2 of them because she's a bit rubbish with messaging and I knew that at least she'd see the plans. But he didn't use it.

So I got into the habit of checking he'd asked her. And wouldnt agree to go around until he confirmed he had. But there were a couple of occasions mpre recently when I was suspicious that he hadn't but she's too polite to ever say anything.

Then he started saying i could check with her if I wanted - which I did - and she did say it was ok on those occasions. But now I dont think she'd have said it wasnt anyway Sad

But this is not a recent thing, this has been going on for a couple of years but, like I said, I just thought they had an odd relationship at times and didnt really see that I was a part of that as long as I was 'above board'. And she actively encouraged our friendship because he meant he had someone to go and do this things with that she had no interest in doing. So she had no problem with me personally. But other people have since commented that that is also a bit odd.

OP posts:
WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 11:00

stop engaging with his 'but you did this'

Oh i haven't said anything to him. I'm just processing it here.

OP posts:
WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 11:02

Face push was a joke? What exactly was supposed to be funny about it?

Quite. Perhaps it was funny to him to humiliate me..? I think he meant it was lighthearted but physical assault is never funny, esp when the person you are doing it to is living with the aftermath of a lifetime of abuse!

OP posts:
shrutefarm · 28/10/2019 11:08

I can't imagine any scenario where I could put my hand in someone's face and it would be comfortable for them or light hearted. He absolutely did it to humiliate you and show you where your place is in front of others. It was incredibly demeaning. I'm pissed off for you!

holidayhelpp · 28/10/2019 11:22

This all sounds very dysfunctional. You need to be polite but no more with this man from now on.

Middersweekly · 28/10/2019 11:33

I can absolutely read his intentions with everything you have written OP. I think he was looking to be more than friends but you’ve shut it down (multiple times it seems) when he’s attempted to over step the boundaries of being ‘just friends’.
It’s so blatant that his actions were born out of jealousy because he wanted to keep you all to himself and off your chances of getting together with another group member (or any other person of your choice). Perhaps he hasn’t admitted it to himself yet but you clearly are not and have never been interested in him in that way. You have done the right thing by distancing yourself from here on in. He only has himself to blame!

DioneTheDiabolist · 28/10/2019 11:42

Your last msg to him was great OP. Now it is time to ignore him and his whiney arse messages. Well done you.Halloween SmileFlowers

WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 11:58

Thanks. I won't message him again now. Polite in group situation but nothing more.

Interesting, because I'd not seen it, but the few people I have told have all asked if I thought he might have been 'harbouring feelings' for me or words to that effect.

So maybe there is something in that.

Either way, it doesn't matter now. I'm hopeful that this will be an end to it.

OP posts:
billy1966 · 28/10/2019 12:25

OP, great advice from @Towel42.

He sounds like a very nasty piece of work.

He absolutely assaulted you.

I would imagine you don't have any idea of the shit his wife is putting up with.

Follow Towel's advice re band leader.

Do not respond again to him.

Remain calm and distant in your dealings with him.

Do not be pushed out of the band by a bully.

Any woman or man who tries to talk down your completely normal reaction to him assaulting you is not someone in whom you can trust.

Their judgement is off.

Your visceral reaction to his behaviour is the feeling you should place your trust in.
💐

LionsHeart · 28/10/2019 12:26

Every time you message him, you are feeding the beast.
You are giving him EXACTLY the response he craves.
He will make you out to be a diva and a drama queen.

Speak to your band leader.
Tell him that as a result of being physically threatened by dickhead:
he has been told you want NO further contact
that you will be professionally courteous and nothing more.

It is time to block him fully on SM.
This is not over. Nowhere near.

Pinkbonbon · 28/10/2019 12:53

I'd see it more just that a his kind expects you to include them in everything and to be friends with all your friends (or ruin those friendships for you because your 'MY toy!'). It's not romantic, it's just greed.

Definitely block him on everything now. Youve told him you don't see him as friend material anymore so there's no reason to leave lines of communication open. He will cause further trouble if you do.

WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 12:56

Every time you message him, you are feeding the beast.
You are giving him EXACTLY the response he craves.
He will make you out to be a diva and a drama queen

I'll say it again. I've ignored his messages. I haven't responded to them. I messaged him when he asked about going to the Saturday event to tell him I wasn't sure but would be travelling alone. I didnt respond to his "but what about me??" reply. And I messaged him this morning and that is it. Ice ignored all of his other messages and will continue to do so.

I haven't replied and I wont message him again.

I can't say that clearly enough.

I said in my very first post that I had no interest in talking to him.

I am well aware of how these things work - I will not be contacting him or responding to any contact from him again.

OP posts:
WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 13:07

I'd see it more just that a his kind expects you to include them in everything and to be friends with all your friends (or ruin those friendships for you because your 'MY toy!'). It's not romantic, it's just greed.

Except that I did invite him along to a few nights out with them (that weren't strictly 'girls only') and he turned all of them down. The one night out he did come to, he sulked and moaned all the way in the car and I wished I hadn't bothered! That was the night when he'd agreed to come out with me/us all but then tried to get me to do something else, just me and him, at the last minute. I told him I was going to x place as per my plans; I'd be driving past his house (was en route) at 8pm and if he wanted me to pick him up to let me know. He relented in the end but, like I say, he moaned/sulked all the way there.

And he met them all at the same time as me so they weren't 'my' friends,

OP posts:
WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 13:07

They could have been his friends too quite naturally.

OP posts:
Talkingmouse · 28/10/2019 13:11

He has got you questioning yourself again after those last texts/messages. You have nothing to explain/apologise for, to him or anyone. Absolutely no more messages. Ignore. Ignore. Ignore any 1-on-1 attempt at any interaction (wa, in person, ...). Be hi-level civil in a group. Last sat night sounded perfect. Good luck!

WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 13:17

Not really. I think it's natural to process what was said and it's reminded me of things that irked me but I'm not doubting myself Smile

OP posts:
AnotherEmma · 28/10/2019 13:18

Usual predictable counter-accusations from him and tedious over thinking and over analysing about everything. If you're not prepared to block him you need to work harder to ignore all the crap he says. He's a dick, he's possessive, he can't stand the fact you've been making other friends, and he has been punishing you. Well fuck him. Or, you know, stay Facebook friends!

WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 15:02

I've unfriended him on FB now blocked him after this morning.

OP posts:
eddielizzard · 28/10/2019 15:07

Excellent message!

He wanted you all to himself. He wanted an emotional affair, and you insisting on his DW being involved put the spanner in the works for his fuckwittery with her. Poor woman. I'm sure he's busy gaslighting her.

Now you won't play ball, he'll up the victim / passive aggressive / gaslight strategy. Best you can do is grey rock him.

And basically everything TowelNumber42 says is spot on. I went out and bought Rejection Proof on her recommendation and it's very good!

Good luck! You can do this!

AnotherEmma · 28/10/2019 15:16

Well done 👍

WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 15:40

Thanks, Emma and thanks for your support/advice - much appreciated.

you insisting on his DW being involved put the spanner in the works for his fuckwittery with her

Yeah, I kind of wish I'd questioned it a bit more closely at the time tbh.

OP posts:
TowelNumber42 · 28/10/2019 16:18

We only see the truth so well in hindsight because we know how it ended up. It could have gone down other paths. Don't beat yourself up for decisions made in good faith at the time. You didn't let him cheat with you so you are in the clear there. Him being a dick with his wife isn't your problem or your fault.

Pinkbonbon · 28/10/2019 16:55

Well done on the blocking! Just be ready for him to begin a smear campaign on you with your mutual friends. I'd give the band/band leader a heads up on the latest developments if you haven't already.

It would be good if they could replace him and you never had to see him again. Pity life's never that easy isn't it xD

WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 17:01

Well, as he's not there tonight, I feel like I've got a bit of breathing space which means I can speak to the BL in person - which is infinitely better than sending a message. I'll wait for the fag break and give him the heads up outside.

OP posts:
WhatWouldYouDoNext · 28/10/2019 17:13

Oh and I also think he will start a smear campaign which is exactly what happened last time.

Which is precisely why I took the decision this time to tell a few people. Last time I had this problem with a male friend, I said nothing in order to avoid gossip and telling tales etc and it backfired massively because he said whatever he wanted and people assumed I had no defence and that was why I was saying nothing. Maintaining a dignified silence did not gain me respect or benefit me in the long run. I lost everything last time. I'm not going down without a fight this time.

So whilst I do agree with Towel's approach in the main, I have been very candid with a few people. I will be equally candid with the band leader and take Towel's approach with everyone else.

I'll be interested to see if the witness guy says anything given ex friend won't be there. Tbh, its the sort of thing I can imagine him joking about- have ingot him sacked after last week sort of thing. Maybe he won't. We'll see...

OP posts: