when is it not ‘banter’ anymore

[CracklinRosieGetOnBoard]

Bit of background...been with DP nearly 5 years, he is 36 and I am 43 so a bit of an age gap (this is relevant). We have a 2yo DD.
We’ve always been quite jokey with each other and have a similar sense of humour. There’s always been ‘banter’ (hate that word tbh) always instigated by him about the fact I’m older than him and I’ve given as good as I’ve got back. Ironically people always think I’m younger than him so the fact he takes the piss out of the age difference has never bothered me too much in the past.
However., he is becoming increasingly spiteful but under the guise of joking.
For example, he’s started making reference to my ‘saggy old tits,’ ‘old woman’s body,’ calls me an ‘old cnt and other things that I can’t bring myself to say on here. He’s been pulled up before by one of his relatives at a family party who heard him refer to me as ‘old woman.’ She told him it wasn’t nice but he brushed it off as her not understanding his sense of humour.
It came to a head at the weekend when he made a comment about how he’s always had a thing for women who are brunette and petite but he’s ‘somehow ended up with blonde and old.’ I’m embarrassed to say I just burst into tears and told him I’d had enough of the constant put downs. I asked him why he can’t just be nice for once. He never compliments me, I’d love for him to send me a nice text or say something sweet but it’s this constant bloody ‘banter’ and it’s wearing me down. He was very remorseful at the weekend and apologised but kept insisting that he’s ‘only joking.’
I kind of feel like I’m going mad here. He’s very good in others ways but my head feels fried...is he just nasty or ignorant? Or have I made a rod for my own back by always being so lighthearted about his ‘jokes’ in the past that I’ve inadvertently given him the green light to take it to the next level? I feel so shit about myself.

Im sorry but I don't think he can change. He was like that when you met him and probably for a long time before. He shouldn't talk to you like that but I doubt he will be able to change. So sorry. I accepted something my husband does when we got together 19 years ago and was fine with it for 15 years but now it really annoys me and is undermining our relationship. It's me that's changed. His behaviour is the same.

he’s saying he feels like he’s walking on eggshells as he can’t even ‘makes jokes’ anymore without me being offended

So he's verbally abusive to you and still protects himself from any consequences by portraying you and others as over-sensitive/ not having banter/no sense of humour? There are a few layers of bullying here. When he tries to pull this crap, you could very forcefully state that you're not sensitive and you do have a sense of humour (you ended up having a kid with a funny fucker after all), but your OH is just not funny. The other course of action if he doesn't want to treat you with respect is to kick his arse out.

Most people are smart enough to know when banter turns into nastiness, however much the hilarious Archbishop of Banterbury tries to claim otherwise. I was bullied at school by people who claimed this, and there's a 'special' someone in my life who loves to tell me I have no sense of humour when I pull him up on something mean he's said. He always gets very angry if I try making a joke about him though oddly enough.

I wouldn't reply with equal insults. My bet is this is the type of man that would get into a rage. I'd just plan your exit. Quietly. I can't say anything more than has already been said. This man is vile. I just hope that each scathing text he sends kills off any love you have for him because he doesn't deserve you.

Yeah you need to plan to leave him. He's being nasty to you and saying he's joking doesn't change that.

Thank goodness you recognise you need to leave!

He is awful, DH and I banter and this has reminded I also need to compliment him too...

I'm 17 yrs older than my OH and he would never ever make "jokes" like this. Ours is a big age gap and I'm sensitive about it. My OH knows this and over compensates by giving me compliments, saying he loves me etc. Sometimes I may make a joke about getting older, becoming a grisly old bird, him trading me in for a younger model etc & my OH hates it, I get told "don't put yourself down, you're beautiful " etc. Your OH is being awful, your age gap is nothing. Hes using "jokes" as a way to hurt you and he knows it especially if family have pulled him up on it. Unfortunately it becomes a dripping tap scenario, chips away at your confidence, the danger of this is that you may end up hating him. Is he trying to undermine you, make you feel worthless, maybe underneath hes worried that you're too good for him and is chipping away so you think he us your best option. Everytime he says something pull him up "dont talk to me like that" "iv told you that I dont think your jokes are funny, its hurtful and I'm not putting up with it". Personally I'd have throttled him or left him. When he acts hurt that you dont understand his jokes dont give in, stick to your guns, hes not the victim

So a new day OP.
I really hope you got some sleep.
Start to put a list together of what you need.
Info you might require.

Are you married?
What is the housing situation?
It is mortgaged?
In who's name?
Did you buy together?
Is it rented?
If so then in who's name?
Who is the higher earner?
Who is the main parent?
Do you know what he earns?
Do you earn well?
Could you afford the house on your own?
Could you stay with family or a friend over the weekend to get yourself some head space?

You managed before him and you can manage again without him.

My wife is older than me and I can tell you now if I said any of that to her, (I never would because it's not banter (pathetic word), not funny and would never enter my head) she would go ballistic and quite rightly so!!

I know the standard response on MN is to "get your ducks in a row" (almost as crazy a phrase as banter!) and LTB, but in this situation I really would, this "man" has absolutely no idea whatsoever.

From his comments it’s as if he doesn’t like you. The comment about walking on eggshells (to not make more nasty comments) is worrying. Should he feel this way just to be a bit nicer to you?

That comment about preferring blondes was AIMED at hurting you. When someones comments are deliberately so intended to hurt, they are not good ppl and you need to get away from them.

Hate to say it too but this behaviour is what you commonly see from narcissists and the like. Put downs in the guise of banter and comments that imply you aren't 'good enough'.

Funnily enough comments about how he preferred blondes, and how 'sarah' from work really suited blonde and that I should be blonde were common place with mine...I have no doubt if I had went blonde it would have been 'oh...you don't suit it' though. They delight in whipping the carpet out from under you.. then kicking you again when you are down.

Dunno if that's what you are dealing with. But he's a bit either way and its time to go.

*a git.

Jesus Christ OP. I am aghast. No one, NO ONE, should speak to their wife and mother of their child like that. He needs to pack it in right now.

And none of this "walking on eggshells" bullshit. He manages to interact with everyone else in his life without insulting them or calling them a c&nt so he can do it with you too.

My ex who was abusive would call me “dear” “yes dear” - I told him I didn’t like it - ( I see it as a reference to older people) I was only 52.
He was 10 years younger. He carried on doing it for months and months. He physically assaulted me.
He is an abusive nasty man. You know what to do.

I would block his number actually. Replying/retaliating/showing you're upset by his messages is what he wants. Take away his ability to send these vile messages. Realising his messages aren't delivering will kill him!

Hello all
@hellsbellsmelons to answer some of your questions: we are not married, we rent our property and are joint tenants. I’m currently working PT but plan on going back FT in the near future. Dp is currently the higher earner but that is due to me being part time only.
I’m about to go to my mums with Dd, i think I will stay there for the weekend. Feel a bit overwhelmed but also like I have taken back a bit of control in my life.

A couple of posters have mentioned that they bet Dp doesn’t behave like this with other people and I thought that was interesting. He struggles with authority and has got himself in hot water at work a few times for being bullheaded and confrontational after being pulled up on things he has done wrong. He once made an almighty slip up at work and instead of taking responsibility, he just walked out and proceeded to rant to me about how they were all a bunch of wankers. In his mind he is never, ever in the wrong. Sorry I’m just blabbering on now.

You blabber away OP.
It's your thread to use as you like.
Rant, blather, use as a diary, anything you like.

Google NPD and see if this fits the bill with him.
(narcissistic personality disorder)
I suspect it does.

Thank you @hellsbellsmelons Going to have a google now

If you have the higher earning power (which you do as if you were both FT you’d earn more) then that’s another thing he probably feels emasculated and resentful about and further explains his behaviour.

He just sounds like a complete wanker.

I suspect this is a bloke who thinks he’s a bit of a ‘geezer’, a bit of a laugh and has got into being like this as a habit. What he hasn’t quite grasped is many women are sensitive about looks and age and whilst they may initially laugh off stuff like this it wears thin very quickly

I understand how this happens. My ex and I had a lot of banter, but it was never this bad. The truth is that this is a man (and there are many, like my ex) who are consumed on some level with self-hatred and masculine identity bullshit issues. But without empathy or self - awareness or kindness they simply project it onto the woman they supposedly 'love'. You have become a bin.

If you think being aware of this yourself, and or trying to illuminate him to this truth will make it stop - transforming him to the person you think you love, then you are likely mistaken. The genie is out of the bottle - he gets far too much relief and satisfaction from dumping his shit on you.

My ex also very rarely gave compliments, but the worst he ever said to me was "I love every inch of your shabby body" - bad enough - but the level of cruelty you have found yourself in is way worse.

He is a bully. Under the guise of humour (and so much passes under this) he has manoeuvred you into a no win position. For example - what he calls 'eggshells' are actually elements of basic care and respect. I would let him tread on them for rest of his days, however you will exhaust yourself trying to maintain these basic boundaries of respect and personally I think he will find another way to make you pay.

I'm not sure he's worth the fight but if you do want to fight - then I might suggest you get some counselling to determine how to deal with this and why/how perhaps you have found yourself here.

Something else that may work is this. Next time he hurts you - tell him, even if it's in company - "that hurt me" - "I don't accept it as a joke" - don't enter into any discussion, be totally okay with being 'humourless'. Then later, ask him to leave your home for a trial separation - That he needs to think. Be really really fuckin tough. This guy needs one huge serious shock. Otherwise, you will wither and die here.

I also suspect if you talk to relatives and friends frankly, you may also find out how bad they think he really treats you.

Good luck.

This is abuse, plain and simple. He is bullying and emotionally abusing you under the guise of ‘banter’. My abusive ex used to do the same, he would constantly put down my appearance and when I called him out on it he would say ‘just ribbing you, stop being so serious’ .

It’s not funny, it’s cruel and unkind. Imo you should leave if he is unwilling to change.

I always say it’s only a joke if someone laughed. If I didn’t find it funny it wasn’t a joke it was just mean.

Oh, OP! He is horrible. He is doing it deliberately to hurt you, and then being asked to not deliberately hurt you means he's 'walking on eggshells?'

No. Just no. I've dated men over 20 years younger than me, and none have mentioned my appearance like this! The one who did was the abusive ex - he was 14 years younger, but funnily enough, the insults would only come out as he was in the 'abuse' cycle of the wheel of abuse.

Even though he is doing it 'cleverly' by making out it is a joke, it's abuse. I fail to see how calling someone a cunt can be at all funny.

Please don't try to 'work through things' with an abuser. He will simply find another way to abuse you.

Show yourself how much you love yourself by getting away form him. I'm so glad you are going to your Mum's, and are having time away. Be prepared for 'the big turnaround', where he'll shower you with compliments and reassurance. It's a lie. Give him one chance if you must, but no more than one.

Preferably, understand that this, what he is now, being horrible, this is the real him. The Beast is real, it's the Prince that is the mask.

I fail to see how calling someone a cunt can be at all funny

^ THIS.

I have a mouth liken sailor but this word is loaded with such violence, and the idea of saying it to someone I loved? Never.