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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is it my business? How to help man being pushed out of baby's life.

284 replies

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 12:10

I'm going to be deliberately vague for obvious reasons.
I'm writing on behalf of a small group of concerned people who want what is best for the baby, and who we see as a wronged, innocent man.

A female acquaintance/associate/family member had a baby several months ago. Her first baby, and her last chance at motherhood (age reasons). She is not with the father. She has told people that he is not interested. The story didn't add up from various people we know who have all mentioned conflicting info that she/some members of her family give. One of us vaguely knows the father (small town) and found him on Fb. From looking at his fb, he is indeed desperate to see the baby, and is devastated. As are his parents. He has sought legal action and things seem to be progressing but he has still not been allowed to see his child. We don't think he knows where his child is, as we know the mother has moved to a relative's home. Of course, there is a remote chance this is justified and he's been violent, but we really don't believe this is the case, and knowing the mother, she grabbed a chance to get pregnant, and never planned to involve the sperm-donor. We believe he did not know he was being used as a sperm donor. Lesson learned for him and all our sons.

I am sad for him, and we are wondering if it is our place to reach out to him and be supportive, even if there is nothing we can do. I want him to know he has people on his side, even though we are related/acquainted to the mother/mother's family.
One reason we don't believe he was violent or that her actions are justified is because she finally invited him to the town she is hiding in, only to set him up on a wild goose chase as once he had paid for his transport and accommodation, a day before he was set to go, she told him she wasn't there. Being a small town, people are talking, and NO ONE believes he has it in him to be violent. We accept we can't always know people though, of course. But he seems a nice, meek, mild-mannered man. Our experience of the woman is that she manipulated things and only ever wanted a baby to herself.
Now, the crux. When the courts finally grant him access, the mother has put a huge obstacle in the way by making plans to move hundreds of miles away, necessitating either a flight or a ferry ride as well as a long car journey meaning it will be very difficult for the father to see his child - if the courts allow him every other weekend, it is feasibly financially impossible for him to make it to see his child this often, based solely on the mother's actions to deliberately distance themselves from him geographically. She is stating she's moving for quality of life. No one believes this. She is moving to keep that baby to herself.

Can the courts insist she not move? She has set it up to look like she has been living there since the baby was a newborn, but we know she has not been up there except for a few trips. (Her family have a holiday home there, and a spare home in her hometown, so she has options.)

Sorry it's long. I feel so sad for him, his family, and for some men in general who have this happen to them, and don't feel we should be silent when women behave like this.

OP posts:
CodenameVillanelle · 19/08/2019 14:29

It MIGHT be wrong what she's doing but you don't know
Furthermore the courts are the people who have access to evidence and statements from both parents and they can and will make an appropriate decision under the circumstances.
There is nothing you can do that is appropriate and your interest in this situation is prurient and vitriolic.

CmdrCressidaDuck · 19/08/2019 14:30

I think you should get this deleted, because you need to get a serious grip, and enmeshing yourself in online arguments about it clearly isn't going to give you one.

You need to learn the difference between "injustice" and "something I personally absolutely have to involve myself in and sort out".

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 14:31

CV, I DO know. I wish people would take that at face value or even just go on that when giving answers. Say I absolutely do know. And it's still not my place to support the man?

OP posts:
ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 14:33

Have asked for it to be deleted, Duck. Please feel free to report too.

It IS injustice and what are we humans for if not to speak up against injustice? This is I think what is giving me sleepless nights - that I have thus far been silent, when I should speak out.

OP posts:
gottagetouttahere · 19/08/2019 14:35

For gods sake stop posting and repeating yourself while claiming you want the thread gone Confused

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 14:35

I DO know. I wish people would take that at face value or even just go on that when giving answers.

People say you don’t know for two reasons.
First, in your op you say that vaguely know him.
Second, unless you are the man in question or were with them for every single second they were together, you don’t know.

That’s not to say she hasn’t planned this or that she is acting very unfairly, but you simply cannot state that you know, because you don’t.

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 14:38

again, Keith, and for the twins in oz who aren't listening, I DO know well, my OP was vague and deliberately not quite accurate soas to be less identfying. I am sorry for that. I should have kept it brief.
I am not the man, I am a female relative of the mother, family talk, she's tripped herself up with lies, but we do know what she is like and believe fully that she told him she wanted a family, then as soon as she was pg, she dumped him.

OP posts:
AuchAyeTheNo · 19/08/2019 14:39

Wow.

I really hope for this woman’s sake there isn’t a horrible backstory and you could potentially be putting her in danger.

This is her child and her situation, who gave you the right to play judge and jury?

Techway · 19/08/2019 14:40

Do you have a supportive campaign against toxic men in your family or village or is this your only campaign? Why not look for female victims of men who abandon their families? Why not have a charity coffee morning of your little group for Womens Aid?

Honestly I think you need to consider your motivation, this feels like a feud that you will not stop until she is "harmed"

The court process does not take that long, from application to first hearing, often a few months. Then a judge will order a report to investigate circumstances of mother & father. I can assure you that courts protect men's access to children (often to the detriment of children).
With this legal process on place you need to drop your campaign and allow courts to decide.

Btw, You keep referring to violence but there are more types of abuse. Most abusers don't hit as that is obvious and police will take action and they often appear charming. As a mother yourself you know how difficult early days with babies are. If she is struggling on her own there is likely to be a good reason.

Also the most active man on FB who talks about his child and lack of access is a complete socio and courts have prevented his access because of his dangerous personality, previous violent history, and drugs. His internet campaign is very, very credible and I know some people believe it. He never mentions that court has restricted access after years of his awful behaviour. He appears very charming and fools many women.

The cases of women blocking men is rare, certainly if you put this against the stats for men abusing women or those who walk off without any responsibility. None of it is right but courts can protect men's access but they cant force men to behave well or be responsible. If you want a cause that it about justice and protects children I suggest you campaign for women.

Parent999 · 19/08/2019 14:42

@pancakeAndKeith

When people post about friends that have cheated or friends that are abused why dont posters tell them to mind their own business and that they dont know what they are talking about?

"but you simply cannot state that you know, because you don’t."

How is this not the very definition of gaslighting? trying to convince someone they dont know what they claim to be certain of.

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 14:43

People read and respond to the op.
You said you vaguely knew the man in the op and this is what people are responding to.

blubelle7 · 19/08/2019 14:44

None of your business.

No-one knows what goes on between two people but the,

I have been in as coercive controlling relationship and if I had fallen pregnant I would have gone to extreme lengths to get away and not involve him. I would have looked guilty and he would have looked innocent.

We were engaged and I went to great lengths to leave. I couldnt confide in family as he isolated me and turned them against me, even when I did they took up for him and said I was unreasonable.

You don't know the ins and outs of it.

STAY OUT OF IT

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 14:44

trying to convince someone they dont know what they claim to be certain of.

Because they don’t know. No one knows what goes in behind closed doors. It’s not gaslighting.

Parent999 · 19/08/2019 14:48

"trying to convince someone they dont know what they claim to be certain of.

Because they don’t know. No one knows what goes in behind closed doors. It’s not gaslighting."

Try saying that to the next abuse victim that posts here. Man or woman. Lets see what happens.

Ounce · 19/08/2019 14:48

This thread is painful.

Loveyou3000 · 19/08/2019 14:48

I am not the man, I am a female relative of the mother, family talk, she's tripped herself up with lies, but we do know what she is like and believe fully that she told him she wanted a family, then as soon as she was pg, she dumped him.

Doesn't matter what you believe love its absolutely none of your business as you've been told multiple times

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 14:49

Are you being deliberately obtuse Parent?

Ounce · 19/08/2019 14:49

If OP were an abuse victim, it'd be different.

She's not. She's just your common or garden busybody.

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 14:50

Try saying that to the next abuse victim that posts here. Man or woman. Lets see what happens.

If someone posts and says they are being abused then I believe them.
Someone saying that they know someone and know that they wouldn’t abuse their partner then I don’t believe them.

There is a difference.

gottagetouttahere · 19/08/2019 14:51

Well, no, because that man or woman would be behind the closed door wouldn't they @Parent999? Hmm

elizalovelace · 19/08/2019 14:51

Wow I wonder what your motives really are. Its NONE of your business, stay out of other people's lives.

DeadButDelicious · 19/08/2019 14:56

Jesus H Christ OP, this is absolutely NONE of your business, even if you are related to her and see it as a massive injustice.

I would advise you to keep well out of it but as it's plainly obvious that you've made your mind up and you absolutely are going to involve yourself/already have involved yourself then I shan't waste my breath.

Parent999 · 19/08/2019 15:00

No Im not deliberately being obtuse.

I have been through this. Ive been dangerously close to suicide with feeling hopeless against this kind of onslaught men cant be abused. Or that somehow it will be ok for me to lose my child, Ill be fine. I really honestly cannot fathom why you can all be so heartlessly ruthless on a mass scale. You havent met an abusive man, youve met an abusive person, just like I have. Whether you like it or not there are vulnerable men out there and this blanket belief that the woman must be the victim and the man an abuser absolutely destroys those men. I know first hand why the suicide rate in men my age is so high. I am genuinely shocked at how fast and ferocious the backlash is on this thread simply because its a man who is the victim this time.

AudacityOfHope · 19/08/2019 15:02

Nobody said it was right. Everyone, however, said it was fuck all to do with you.

Off you trot to get this deleted because you didn't get the replies you wanted Hmm

Parent999 · 19/08/2019 15:02

For the record, all Im saying is make friends with the guy, just let him know that someone out there knows the truth and encourage him to keep fighting. There are no words that can explain how much it would have meant to me when I went through this.

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