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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is it my business? How to help man being pushed out of baby's life.

284 replies

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 12:10

I'm going to be deliberately vague for obvious reasons.
I'm writing on behalf of a small group of concerned people who want what is best for the baby, and who we see as a wronged, innocent man.

A female acquaintance/associate/family member had a baby several months ago. Her first baby, and her last chance at motherhood (age reasons). She is not with the father. She has told people that he is not interested. The story didn't add up from various people we know who have all mentioned conflicting info that she/some members of her family give. One of us vaguely knows the father (small town) and found him on Fb. From looking at his fb, he is indeed desperate to see the baby, and is devastated. As are his parents. He has sought legal action and things seem to be progressing but he has still not been allowed to see his child. We don't think he knows where his child is, as we know the mother has moved to a relative's home. Of course, there is a remote chance this is justified and he's been violent, but we really don't believe this is the case, and knowing the mother, she grabbed a chance to get pregnant, and never planned to involve the sperm-donor. We believe he did not know he was being used as a sperm donor. Lesson learned for him and all our sons.

I am sad for him, and we are wondering if it is our place to reach out to him and be supportive, even if there is nothing we can do. I want him to know he has people on his side, even though we are related/acquainted to the mother/mother's family.
One reason we don't believe he was violent or that her actions are justified is because she finally invited him to the town she is hiding in, only to set him up on a wild goose chase as once he had paid for his transport and accommodation, a day before he was set to go, she told him she wasn't there. Being a small town, people are talking, and NO ONE believes he has it in him to be violent. We accept we can't always know people though, of course. But he seems a nice, meek, mild-mannered man. Our experience of the woman is that she manipulated things and only ever wanted a baby to herself.
Now, the crux. When the courts finally grant him access, the mother has put a huge obstacle in the way by making plans to move hundreds of miles away, necessitating either a flight or a ferry ride as well as a long car journey meaning it will be very difficult for the father to see his child - if the courts allow him every other weekend, it is feasibly financially impossible for him to make it to see his child this often, based solely on the mother's actions to deliberately distance themselves from him geographically. She is stating she's moving for quality of life. No one believes this. She is moving to keep that baby to herself.

Can the courts insist she not move? She has set it up to look like she has been living there since the baby was a newborn, but we know she has not been up there except for a few trips. (Her family have a holiday home there, and a spare home in her hometown, so she has options.)

Sorry it's long. I feel so sad for him, his family, and for some men in general who have this happen to them, and don't feel we should be silent when women behave like this.

OP posts:
ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 13:14

Hailey, knowing what we know of her, she did this on purpose, she wanted a baby plain and simple, she's spoken before about doing it on her own, not wanting to compromise, look, we DO know, we know she fooled him into it. People have babies outside of marriage and living together. She told him they would live together once she had sold her house, but to crack on making a baby because of her age. I know more but I don't want to say more as I am worried it's going to out the situation - I have changed some facts to remain vague and unidentifiable whilst remaining true to the premise of what's happened here. Those who know her are sure of her intentions here, we feel bad that she did this to him. There. Are people still saying sod him he deserves no support and she does?

OP posts:
PicsInRed · 19/08/2019 13:15

But he seems a nice, meek, mild-mannered man.

Yeah, yeah, so's mine. Great guy.
Unless romantically involved. Then he's monstrous. 🤷‍♀️

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 13:17

To clarify. We 'do' have 'insider information' but I have tried to be vague soas to not identify anyone.

Tl:dr. Woman deliberately tricked a man into getting her pg. Once pg she dumped him. Man is definitely the father. He is not allowed to see his child. She is moving hundreds of miles away to stop him seeing the child.

And according to mn, it's not society's business to tell her she is wrong to do this Or to sympathise with the man here?

OP posts:
PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 13:19

we know she fooled him into it.

You seem to know an awful lot about this women given that you only vaguely know the man involved. You can’t be that close to her if you never met him.

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 13:20

Woman deliberately tricked a man into getting her pg.

YOU DON’T KNOW THAT

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 13:22

To clarify further having seen more comments, some of us do know him very well, and his family, we accept he could be ted bundy and a chamer we don't know really, but it's VERY unlikely, and knowing her vs knowing him, we know how things are. We do.

Those of us who know her better have so far asked those of us who know him better not to say we are ashamed of her or angry at her actions as we HAVE stayed out of it, but now she is moving we feel extra incensed that she gets away with this. He has a lot of support, just not from her side - so basically that is what we are getting at - whilst trying to be vague - that most on her side have been silent, but should we be? It feels wrong to me to be silent on this.

OP posts:
cookiemonster3 · 19/08/2019 13:23

Stay out of it. You have no idea of the circumstances and just because you have seen some posts on his fb account doesn't make any of it true.

10 years ago my ex made a huge song and dance about not seeing our kids. I was painted as the villain and "took half of everything". The reality was I got saddled with all the debt as he had put everything in my name then cleared the accounts taking all his wages plus the child benefit and tax credits leaving me homeless and penniless because I dared say I had enough of his affairs. And he never once attempted to see the kids despite my insistence and letters from my solicitors asking what he wanted re visitation. Then he pretended the kids weren't his and I cheated. Now he pretends his new spawn is his first and only child.

You never know what the real story is based on a few posts online.

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 13:24

To clarify further having seen more comments, some of us do know him very well

Well you said at the start that one of you knew him vaguely. Make your mind up.

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 13:25

Ok, I can see we are not getting anywhere here, people aren't accepting that we do know a LOT, but that I wanted to be vague re who is who and relationships to whoever, in order to make this anonymous and unidentifying. Sorry for that, I felt it was better to be vague but I think I have been too vague.

We DO know she tricked him, we DO know he wants to be involved, we DO know she is making it pretty impossible for him. And we DO feel that as a society, or even just a small nosy village, we should NOT be ok with this.

OP posts:
FuriousVexation · 19/08/2019 13:25

Fuck me love.

Your thread title asks "is it my business"

Youve had an almost unanimous "No it is not"

Get a job, or a hobby. Start binge watching old episodes of the x files. Better yet, volunteer at a charity. Any of those would contribute to the human race more than you gossiping about a situation you know fuck all about.

DioneTheDiabolist · 19/08/2019 13:25

And according to mn, it's not society's business to tell her she is wrong to do this

Society, in the form of the Court Service can intervene. You should not. It sounds as though he is using you all to get at her. Classic abuser's strategy. And you may be falling for it.

SteadyAreYouReady · 19/08/2019 13:25

Keep out of it

My sister is in a similar position and if she could run far away she would.
The guy is charming, he fooled us all, still fools everyone else.
He’s a fucking loon behind closed doors.

You can never say for certain, so stay out. It’s his battle

Parent999 · 19/08/2019 13:26

I’m going to lay it out here knowing posters will do anything to discredit a man.
My ex tried this sort of thing, she lied to everyone and the lies changed depending on the audience. I’d have given my right arm for someone to tell me they understood what I was going through, that they knew the truth. I was very very close to suicide before court. Thankfully my child got joint residence. Reaching out to this man might be the difference between keep fighting and suicide. Do it. Ignore the posters here, if it was a man doing the kidnapping the backlash would be ferocious.

gottagetouttahere · 19/08/2019 13:27

What was the actual point of this thread? Were you hoping we would be equally "incensed" and ask to join the witch hunt??

CmdrCressidaDuck · 19/08/2019 13:28

I have nothing but sons and I think you sound positively loony.

"BUT DOES NO ONE THINK THIS IS WRONG" it's not a question of whether we think it's wrong. It's not a question of whether you think it's wrong. It's not your job to figure out how wrong it is and it is 100% wholly and solely NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU.

If he is so pure, and she so rotten, the courts will sort it out in the end, won't they.

And seriously, what bat is in your belfry that THIS is the injustice you choose to fixate on, of all the injustice in the world? Time to spend some time self-reflecting, quite possibly seek some counselling, but most of all, stop indulging your saviour fantasies and butt out.

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 13:28

The ONLY thing we don't know 99.999999% is if he is violent, and we 99.9999999% believe that he is not. That the sole reason she is excluding him is because this was her plan all along.

OP posts:
CmdrCressidaDuck · 19/08/2019 13:30

this was her plan all along

Unless she turned to you a year ago and said "I have an eeeeeevil plan to steal this man's sperm and then ban him from the baby's life, muahahahahaha!", you cannot possibly know this.

You have seriously lost the plot and need to take a major break from this situation for your own mental health.

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 13:32

Dione, he's not using anyone. He speaks to his parents, who are trying to help him. Word gets out to siblings etc. He's not a user, no red flags at all here.

999, I am sorry for what you went through. I have seen the recent case of the father committing suicide over a similar situation. It is interesting to me to say you'd appreciate someone reaching out to you. I hope you have a good happy relationship with your child.

I'll end here. I do feel sad people have projected their own issues with men here, and a genuine innocent man is being cast aside like this. Courts are failing him taking this long to get things worked out. It has been many months, and he has missed out on all the firsts, not been able to bond, baby has missed out on their father too. I think that's plain wrong.

OP posts:
Thingsdogetbetter · 19/08/2019 13:32

Your silence is not support. She'd be very thick-skinned not to feel your disapproval. I doubt anyone who knows you thinks your are supporting her!

Do you really think support from your group is what he needs or wants. A bunch of random he doesn't know. Where is the evidence that he is lacking support? It sounds like his family are.

She may have done what you say. He may be a lovely man. But you really, really don't know. And it really really isn't your place to interfer. Worst case, she never speaks to any of you again and you never see the baby again.

Tell her you don't approve all you like, but do you think it will make a difference to what she does? Do you think she's going to suddenly see the light and become co-parent of the year because of your groups disapproval.

I am intrigued how this is impacting your lives so much?. That it's causing difficulties in your life? Is it the busybodies in your town's judgement that is making this so personal for you? Has she somehow embarrassed you all?

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 13:32

The percentage that you are sure he is not violent keeps increasing.
No one, absolutely no one, knows what goes on behind closed door.

DioneTheDiabolist · 19/08/2019 13:36

When did he first apply to the courts to get PR and access OP?

ForfarFourFifeFive · 19/08/2019 13:36

things, she is toxic, and yes, her actions and our lack of speaking against it mean people judge us as being as bad as her. As it is, whilst I haven't been vocally supportive, I haven't said anything against it either, I try and remain silent except within our inner circle. It reflects badly on us, it's the talk of the town that she's taking the baby miles away and how can we let her do this.
I don't want to say more as I worry I am being to identifying. I would be happy for people to flag any posts they think I have been too open, though like I said, I have thrown in a few non-facts to make it vague and unidentifying - hopefully. Or at least enough that people don't know for certain.

OP posts:
MsPavlichenko · 19/08/2019 13:36

You don't need to support her though. Just keep out of it altogether.

PancakeAndKeith · 19/08/2019 13:36

He speaks to his parents, who are trying to help him

To answer the question in your title that’s who business it is, his parents, the child’s grandparents, his friends, his siblings. Not a bunch of gossips who by their own admission ‘vaguely know him’.

Parent999 · 19/08/2019 13:37

Im also shocked that at all of a sudden everyone has such faith in the legal system. From my recollection most posters believe the courts arent worth much more than the CMS but thats ok, feed the poor bloke to the family courts. His problem.