How much porn is okay?

[wantobeamum]

Strange title I know! But seriously, I know my husband is somehow finding the time and the space to be able to watch porn on his phone because embarrassingly we were at his parents house and I had to google something and went to type on his phone and the first thing in the search bar was porn-related so from there felt the urge to look at his history and BAM! I think it's ok for a guy to watch some porn but how much is too much and when does it become not ok?

This is a short so necessarily superficial but still interesting discussion on the subject. Worth a listen.

Banning things because there is illegality in some areas of its industry isn't a solution to anything.

Some alcohol is sold illegally, is smuggled, and as a substance it's a source of addiction and a cause of illness, of abuse. But prohibition isn't a realistic solution to those things.

"Ban it!" lets you off the hook of confronting the real causes for the things you want to see addressed. I don't have an answer for addressing those things, but if your suggestion is "ban all pornography" respectfully then neither do you

Preferably zero. I can’t think when my DH would have time to watch it now but when we first got together he was absolutely addicted to it to the extent he had death grip and struggled to ejaculate. It damaged our relationship at a time when it should have been fun and exciting. I’d never experienced it before and I was convinced he didn’t find me attractive enough, I always felt deflated after sex.

Luckily he overcome it fairly quickly but he did have to stop watching so much porn. I like to think he doesn’t watch it now but I have no idea, like I say I can’t really think of a time he’d have chance to unless he does it in the shower (gross).

I believe that saying to young people 'no porn at all' is just unrealistic, and potentially very harmful to their self esteem and sex lives as they grow up

Porn is immensely damaging to the self-esteem of young people and gives unrealistic expectations of what a healthy sex-life should be.

I have a friend who is an ex-porn star. Massive star in America.

Tell her that porn is empowering and she would laugh you out of the place. She earned a fortune. She doesn’t believe that’s worth the coercion and abuse - how many “stars” do you think actually earn anything like a decent wage?

“I believe that saying to young people 'no porn at all' is just unrealistic, and potentially very harmful to their self esteem and sex lives as they grow up”

I just don’t understand this @pinkunicornsparkles. Can you say some more?

I just don’t understand this @pinkunicornsparkles. Can you say some more?

It reminds me of strong old catholic Ireland sort of beliefs. Where children are taught from a young age that masturbation is a sin, any form of non-procreational sex is a sin etc etc. This form of thinking can end up having huge ramifications on their future psychology and actions. I have worked with young children who thought having sex before marriage and with no contraception was a double sin. So their thinking was 'I'll just commit one sin - and won't use a condom.'

If a child is taught porn in all its forms is awful and evil, and the child then grows up to discover they actually enjoy watching porn, they will feel ashamed and potentially hate themselves for this. Who knows what effect this may have. However, if they are taught that watching ethically produced porn (yes, there are samples of this out there) is ok and there isn't really anything to be ashamed of about this.

I understand 100% your stance on the unregulated awful samples of porn out there. BUT I think it's changing the terminology in how this is expressed to children is so important. That it's ok to watch porn, but NOT if it's not ethically produces.

It's ok for women to have consensual sex that they enjoy. It's ok to film in a regulated porn setting and earn from it if they so wish. They should not feel ashamed for watching it.

But at the same time, sadly there are thousands of abused people in the porn industry, which needs to be addressed and must not be viewed in the same way.

I still don’t understand, sorry. Of course you should teach children that sex and sexuality should be a free and joyful thing and shame free. But it’s also OK to teach them that there are some things which are not good and not right to enjoy. And coercive and exploitative sex, whether immediate or vicarious is in that category, surely? Not everything is OK.

@BertrandRussell I think we'll just have to agree to disagree

That’s a shame. I’d really like to understand. It sounds as if you’re saying that we shouldn’t tell our children that there are any not OK things sexually. Which I don’t think you can possibly be saying.

I think the problem may be that you maybe haven't seen the kind of porn I am talking about? It seem obvious that you detest porn but if you google Feminist porn there are many directors out there which wish to change the way porn made and attitudes in the industry. In most of the samples I have seen Condoms are worn, and emphasis put into this element of Sex. Verbal consent is shown. Women's orgasms are (clearly) real, not faked. It can be made very sexy for men and women to ask 'is it ok for me to.....' before the act is done. It's not all the time at every stage but it's there. Erika Lust is great I think.

Also, although they are paid actors, in the 'behind the scenes' bits I've seen in documentaries it's clear that they really do care about each other well being.

I do know about feminist porn and ethical porn.i an still not completely sure how I feel about the idea. However I do know that it is a minute fraction of the market. And, realistically, a minute fraction of lorn viewers are going to access it because it will, by definition, be more expensive. And I really don’t see how the perceived benefits of ethical porn can possibly outweigh the massive damage to induviduals and to society that the rest of the porn industry. I find the idea that young people need to be able to watch porn as part of their sexual awakening and education deeply disturbing.

my husband is somehow finding the time and the space

Sounds like the issue is less about porn and more about him having 5 mins to himself.

I find the idea that young people need to be able to watch porn as part of their sexual awakening and education deeply disturbing.

No I don't think all young people 'need' to watch porn. I just think some people will want to watch it. To brand them horrid perverts for this is what I disagree with (if they are watching the right kind of porn...)

How would one go about finding "the right kind of porn?"

@RoarkesMagicCoats research. As I said there are many feminist porn directors out there. What one parent will agree with as being acceptable will be different to another's.

“I just think some people will want to watch it. To brand them horrid perverts for this is what I disagree with”
I’m not branding them horrid perverts. I’m branding them people who don’t care about the exploitation and commodification of women. I have consistently not mentioned morality.

Can you give details of some porn that you are absolutely sure (and not just because the person who made it told you) is 100% ethical and exploitation free?

Yeah, I'm sure a teens first port of call would be to research ethical porn before having a wank

I’m not branding them horrid perverts. I’m branding them people who don’t care about the exploitation and commodification of women. I have consistently not mentioned morality.

Sorry I stand corrected. But I don't understand. If women fully consent to their sex tapes being sold how are they being exploited and commodified any more so than with any other kid of actress or actor? Or a make up artist selling videos of how their apply their products?

I feel I'm missing a massive point here and look like a bit of an idiot

I think @GuitarDadOf2 hit the nail on the head for me.

"Ban it!" lets you off the hook of confronting the real causes for the things you want to see addressed. I don't have an answer for addressing those things, but if your suggestion is "ban all pornography" respectfully then neither do you

Do you understand coercion and consent?

@RoarkesMagicCoats

So are you saying that there are no women out there in their right mind who would want to make a sex tape and sell it? They are ALL being coerced?

If women fully consent to their sex tapes being sold how are they being exploited and commodified any more so than with any other kid of actress or actor? “
Well, there’s a philosophic and politics argument to be had about that which is outside the scope of this thread. But for me the bottom line is how do you know that anyone you see in a screen is fully consenting?
I realise you can say that about many things. But as there really is no benefit to individuals or society from pornography, why risk it?

Some women can and do enjoy sex. Some women can and do enjoy filming these sex acts and making money from it. They should not have to apologise or feel any less of a woman/human for these actions.

It's just an extension of the slut shaming culture.

A woman who wants to wear a thong should not have to feel ashamed for wearing that thong. Say they discovered rape among thong wearing women was 10000% more frequent that women wearing granny pants. This does not mean we should ban all thongs and feel ashamed for doing so.