Just another MN cynic or are these red flags?

[Strawberryblondereally]

NC’d. Divorced 2 years ago and have been dating with various success. Met my DP 10 weeks ago and have been overwhelmed by my feelings....He has been everything I could have hoped for. We have seen each other most days since meeting initially if even just for a coffee during lunch, the sex is the best I’ve ever had, we have so much in common and he makes me smile so much....

I’m a MN veteran and have read about narcissists and the like over the years so am quite attuned to the signs....I haven’t wanted my DP to meet my DC yet as I thought it a bit early but he was very keen from the off. He has DC too. It was my DC bday and I’d mentioned in passing to him that I’d forgotten to pick her up cupcakes and an hour later he turned up at my house unannounced and delivered 48 Lola’s cupcakes. My DC opened the door to him....it was all quite awkward and I didn’t know what to do....now I know this was a generous act but I stressed that I didn’t want him meeting my DC yet and he just totally ignored it....when I confronted him later about it he accused me of being shut off as a result of my marriage breakdown....I’m not at all and my marriage ended amicably....

I’ve spoken to friends and they say he has red flags everywhere which I’ve probably just ignored to be frank....he’s lavished me with expensive gifts, taken me to fancy restaurants, holidays etc all in 10 weeks which I thought was just generosity but my friends think is alarming....he’s also talking about us living together and getting married this year which sounds ridiculously soon to me but each time I say that he gets really upset and accuses me of not loving him....

Am I being cynical here? Might this guy just be a gudun and I’m allowing my paranoia to creep in?

Hang on - so the man who was so desperately over-invested in meeting your kids, to the extent that he steamrollered through all of your boundaries, is now claiming that he was thrown out of his previous relationship because he absolutely doesn't want kids????

Sure that makes sense!

He can't even keep the lies straight!

I don't think calling the OP thick is helpful. So many women have fallen into this trap and it has nothing to do with intelligence (I have 2 degrees and I've fallen for it more times than I care to admit). It is psychological manipulation and if you are an empath or codependent then it's like a moth to a flame.

OP, if you are taking the week to think about things, please at the very least educate yourself on narcissistic abuse and learn about the cycle. There are some excellent videos on youtube about lovebombing and if you watch them, you will be able to see the similarities in your story. This is not a coincidence, it's almost as if they have a script they follow. At least then you may recognise the other signs he will inevitably start to show as the relationship progresses.

Narcissists love drama so I'm not surprised in the least that his story is full of tragedy where he is the protagonist. This is how narcissists view themselves, as a victim and lack the insight to realise they create their own downfall and abandonment. They are also pathological liars. If their mouths are moving then they are lying. I wouldnt take things he says seriously unless it is in front of you in black and white (and even then he probably only shows you things that put him in a good light).

Please dont feel put off from posting again

Give me a break. I suppose this makes you think that you are perfect for him, providing young children for him to enjoy and I'd imagine you aren't looking for another child, so he gets the best of both worlds from you. He is feeding your ego on every level. Is this more important than the safety of your children? Next you will believe that he is so attentive to your children because of his sad loss and this belief will leave them unprotected. I hope this is a farce.

He was going to meet your children when he decided he wanted to, not when you decided

I think what he did was deliberate; in so far as he gave with one hand (cup cakes) and took with the other (boundaries).

You will find this with him a lot. He will do a generous act but will trample on your boundaries whilst doing so.

When you question it, he has the cliched response: I'm not like your ex-husband.

Money doesn't equal kindness, OP. Don't be blindsided by him flashing his cash; it's all part of the act to get you suckered in.

In life, with most situations of this nature, we are given warnings.

Blimey OP he's clever, I'll give you that.

Stillborn baby? Couldn't get any more tug-at-the-heart-strings could it? And it absolves him of any blame in the breakdown of his marriage.

Please OP. He's a devious manipulative liar who is sinking his claws into you.

The ex having a stillborn child is also a perfect way to ensure the story in never checked. What sort of heartless woman would get in touch with her boyfriends ex and ask that sort of question? Or question him, or ask for proof?

OP, if you still read this thread (and if indeed this is for real...it’s getting kind of hard to suspend disbelief) then I hope that you take some time and ensure that means away from any communication with him. Reach out to RL friends and be 100% honest about all these developments.

As for posting for advice, I have never in my years here (which are many, I regularly name change after a - you guessed it! - narc in my life stalked me on here) seen anyone return after ignoring a LTB, in distress and been given anything other than kind support.

I know responses can feel really challenging, but that’s because people really do just want to do what they can to prevent others suffering what they did.

If he turned up and my door uninvited with cupcakes 'that were on offer'
I would have thanked him - and shut the door.

To answer your question OP, having been in an abusive relationship,

There was enough red flags in the beginning to make me suspicious and a bit upset, but he was so sweet and caring and good in bed etc I became addicted to him. He had me at the point where I was so invested he could start escalating the abuse knowing I didn't want to leave. What he didnt realise was I really did have my limits to what I would take.

The trick is to get you emotionally invested and to wear down your defences and have you doubting yourself. It's like these men have an instinct as to when to move on to the next level of poor behaviour.

I am concerned about what I have read here. I suspect the red flags will continue to pop up left right and centre and you will eventually come to your senses. Hope he doesn't hurt you before that happens.

I dated someone once who was quite similar to this OP.

He had really quite complex MH issues - not a personality disorder- and was just super intense about everything.

That’s the short version. The long version includes him turning up at my house at dawn to check id got home alright after nights out, dissecting my personality until I cried, fixating on parts of my body (hip bone/ forearm etc), extravagant promises and gifts, and declarations of undying love after a couple of weeks.

I liked him a lot, terribly handsome, very very interesting, had a good business and had been a performance artist when younger so totally my type on paper - but it was just TOO MUCH.

I see his Instagram feed now, and do wonder “what if” when I see his new girlfriend looking deliriously happy- but I also know being with him would have taken everything I had and then some more.

I didn’t have kids then, but I walked away - because however fab he was in lots of ways. However much I knew the MH issues weren’t his fault- I also knew I’d lose myself in the relationship. And I loved myself too much for that.

he sent it to me and it was very upsetting....they had a stillborn child and the loss took such a huge toll on them that he decided he didn’t want to have anymore children

Sick to say, but he is a liar. This never happened

I think his story is implausible but not impossible . But if it’s true there will be a birth and a death certificate online which can be checked.

Though I’m a bit confused about the timing . He and his wife split 4 years ago after they lost a baby. So she can’t be any older than say 46 or 47 now. But they have “adult children” - that phrase usually means 21plus. Let’s say 22,24 and 26 ( there must be at least 3 as the OP refers to “all” the children not “both” ).

So she must have met and married him and had their first child by aged 20 or 21 at the oldest. Unusual not impossible I guess.

Op have you experienced pregnancy loss he knows about? Or someone close to you has?

I'm also not convinced what he's told you is true (and there are ways to check).

It's a very clever story as it means he's not blaming his ex (which would be a definite red flag) and it's not something which is his fault, plus it's something most people wouldn't dare question for fear of being seen as heartless and cruel.

Very clever.

He's skilled. Or at best if this is true it gives him a great blameless reason for his last relationship breaking down.

Doesn't mean the other red flags don't still exist.

Doesn't mean he isn't a narc or abuser - bad shit happens to them too!

Difference is they make use of it.

"That’s probably why he can’t see much of his kids too. It’s just waaaay too painful for his delicate little heart." Excellent point! Yep "works" for that too.

@IMOGEN, I was also confused, but after rereading OP’s posts upthread, I think it was his last gf who threw him out.

I doubt this. I think if he’d recently had a stillborn child, he would have already told you during your discussions about family, children, etc. Surely you will check this out.

I agree with MsDogLady, he's spoken about marriage within the year but never mentioned to you a major life even like a still birth? I appreciate it might not be something that you'd speak about with anyone you've just met but this man wants to marry and make a life with you. As hard as is could be to talk about, surely he'd have mentioned it at least?

Netflix Dirty John?
OP. This is DEEPLY disturbing behaviour.
You sound insightful and bright. Use those innate skills to interpret this man's behaviour.
Forget about what lovely moments you've shared and concentrate on the red flag behaviour and read other's posts.
I wouldn't trust him at all. V sinister.
And think about his effect on your children too. He doesn't observe your boundaries...He won't observe theirs, and your children are the crux of your world, I would imagine.
Get out before you are drawn into the vortex, that is him. Please.

Think, " Is this safe?" It doesn't feel safe to me

It feels like letting Ebola into your life but thinking it's a hangover after a lovely night....

He didn’t tell you till NOW about the still birth?!?! Nah, sorry. Even this is wrong.

OP, you sound almost victorious in your post about the stillbirth, as though that explains it all and you can now go back to being swept off your feet. To hell with MN and your friends, you’ve found your guy and what a poor tortured soul he is. You and your family can save him and bring him joy. Happy happy days.

But all you’ve actually achieved is that your right to questioning his past has now been firmly filed away in a box labelled “don’t go there”. And by allowing him to email you’ve denied yourself the opportunity to watch for the telltale signs of a liar.

Please, it’s very rare when you get an almost unanimous response on MN. Wake up and smell the bullshit, it stinks to high heaven.

@MsDogLady

@IMOGEN, I was also confused, but after rereading OP’s posts upthread, I think it was his last gf who threw him out

Ah, that might explain why he left his wife so his adult children wouldn’t speak to him.

But later his ex threw him out because he wouldn’t try for another child.

I’m guessing that he’s older than I have estimated and his children are older, if they are ‘scattered around the world’. That says at least mid 20s to me.

Funny that a man would go from never wanting any more kids ( so much so that he left a serious relationship because of it ) to a few years later dating a woman with young children and wanting to get involved with them very quickly, go on holiday together etc .

It’s a big change .

@Gruzinkerbell1

I don’t think the OP sounded victorious at all. I think she was just reporting factually what her bf said. And she didn’t say anything about saving him. I think you are imputing things to her that she didn’t say and it’s sounds quite mean TBH.

If he is a liar then he is very skilled and I don’t think anyone could spot “ tell tale signs “. There’s nothing wrong with emails, if that’s how she wants to deal with things it’s gives her time and space to consider .

You sound a bit annoyed that the OP hasn’t done what you wanted.

Am I the only one who thinks you're all being a bit dramatic?
Sure, turning up at the house with the cupcakes would totally piss me off.
But you're all condemning this man as some kind of mass murderer

Harry not all narcissists are murderers but nearly all murderers (particularly those who murder women/partners/ex partners) are narcissists.

I think women should be more afraid of who they invite into their lives.

I'll repeat the statistic that 2 women a WEEK are killed in the UK by a partner of ex partner.

I'd rather be cautious than dead!

Also, even if they don't directly kill you, many women are left suicidal after narcissistic abuse.

It's not about the cupcakes, it's about all the red flags listed previously and the fact that he is already emotionally abusing her.

Abuse is about power and control and many different tactics are used to gain this (many of which OP has listed)