I've got to end this, haven't I? So fucking stupid.

[CampfiresAndBeer]

My head is in a complete spin and I don't know what to do for the best. I can't think straight.

I've been seeing someone since Jan. Very compatible. He's kind, thoughtful and loving.

But I've been worrying about the fact his ex wife and subsequent ex girlfriend are both far, far, far more attractive than me - slim, fit and beautiful. I'm just not. I'm best described as 'soft and curvy'; more accurately as 'plump'. I don't wear make up, my hair is natural and just left wavy - I never style it. Appearance wise, I'm the right side of 'average' in a good light...

I supposed to be meeting a small group of his oldest and closest friends in a couple of weeks and, to say I've been feeling a bit anxious about it would be an understatement.

I know his friends are going to be judging me on my 'suitability' for him and comparing me to his exes. It's normal and I know mine did when they met him! The fact they judged him favourably is besides the point.

I've been so anxious about it, I've been trying to manage the drive to call the whole thing off - the meeting of friends and the relationship. He doesn't know this. I've been working on talking myself down from just running away from it all but he's just said something that's sent all my barriers up

We were having a jokey text exchange and I responded to something with "ah no, don't say that, I'm already worried your friends will wonder what you see in me!" and his reply was, "Don't worry about what they think. It's what I think that matters and I think you're beautiful".

So he knows exactly what I mean. They will be wondering what he sees in me because I'm not as slim, pretty etc as his exes. And he is also acutely aware that they are going to be thinking that because he also knows it's true. Fucksake, I know it's true!

I'm such an idiot for thinking this could ever have been anything real or proper. My biggest relationship fear is being settled for..

I just need to learn that I'm not cut out for relationships, that this is all I'll ever be - not quite good enough and just stop deluding myself it could ever be anything different.

I'm just so fucking stupid 😢

And really sad.

I think you need to go into therapy not talk to him. This is very destructive thinking. Do you have any patterns of destructive behaviour in your past? This isn't going to go away and you wiii create your most feared thing to happen if you don't stop. You need to work on your self esteem. If this is a new relationship I would tread carefully.

"Well they do, otherwise slim, beautiful women would never have boyfriends/get married... " - that's 'all or nothing' thinking.

All or nothing/black and white thinking is the road to anxiety and depression!

Its funny how you agree with the other all or nothing side "if I am not slim that means I am not beautiful and don't deserve to be in a relationship or loved" ...

I don't see how he can love me or ever love me as much as them if he can look at me and objectively say, "X and Y were better looking and had better bodies"

Because, and I don’t know how else to say this..., YOU and not just how you look. YOU are a whole package. Plus not many of us IRL only have ‘one type’ that attracts us. As I posted earlier, my ex’s have varied in looks enormously, but a couple had similar attributes...they may be the case for your new bloke, his other girlfriends might have looked more like you.

You’re placing FAR too much emphasis on his ex’s looks. I can understand why due your mother and your ex’s, but people like that are not the people you should be listening to. All the normal/nice/sane people are telling you the same thing. You’ve said yourself you’re not unattractive, why not let HIM be the judge of what HE finds attractive?

Why not say to him ‘My Ex said he was with me because I was less likely to cheat on him, as given my looks I’d have far less opportunities to cheat than his more attractive Ex who cheated on him. I’m scared you feel the same’.

Not had chance to read through everything but one thing that stood out to me from your post was the fact you pin everything on the superficial. Just because you've decided you're not as attractive as his exes that means you're not worthy of this man?
Beauty cannot be defined. My sister loves a smooth, tanned muscly man. I prefer a hairy dad bod. It's not comparable because it's individual. It sounds like it's YOU who's decided you're not as attractive, not him.

In a relationship, there's no such thing as being 'good enough' it's about being right for each other. You're equals and so long as he's attracted to you, there's no measure. His exes are exes for a reason.

Beauty cannot be defined. My sister loves a smooth, tanned muscly man. I prefer a hairy dad bod. It's not comparable because it's individual. It sounds like it's YOU who's decided you're not as attractive, not him

Yes, I understand that but he does find slim, beautiful women attractive. That's his type. Those are the women he's previously dated. The fact that not all men prefer women who look like that is irrelevant because he does.

I have a male friend who much prefers larger women. And always has done. He's never fancied/dated a slim woman. He's had women who are slim and conventionally beautiful proposition him but he isn't interested because he doesn't find them physically attractive.

But my boyfriend does find slim, beautiful women attractive. He has dated them.

I'm just going round in circles in my head now.

And it is manyfold.

I know he likes me.

But I hate the fact that his exes were more attractive than me. And that's not going to change. If he'd been out with a broad mix of 'types' it probably wouldn't bother me so much. But I feel I've been here before.

I worry that, ultimately, that will have an impact on his attraction to me. Or that he will have preferred sex/been more aroused with them because they are so much more visually appealling.

I worry that his friends will have similar thoughts. That they will say things like, "fucking hell, he must really like her. She's hardly X or Y, is she?!!" and that they'll all laugh and agree.

Thanks Whatad I'm not sure I'm feeling strong enough to watch those yet. I can't really even tolerate positive messages about the things I hate about myself. I can feel my throat/chest constricting and it makes me feel sick and I end up hating myself more not less. But thank you. All the body positivity stuff around at the moment doesn't help - I see far bigger women than me who exude sexiness and confidence and it doesn't help. It just increases my self loathing.

"Meeting your friends is making me feel insecure about myself" he may or may not realise that, but if you tell him then he can at least choose to check you're ok or make it a situation where it's easy to leave "early" if it's too much?

Yes, that's also a good suggestion. I think he felt nervous about meeting mine so he will get that. He's already said that me feeling happy and comfortable is his priority but he has no idea I feel like this.

Thank you, Offside. It's the reality of now that's the issue for me though. I know the future is likely to look like that but it still won't change the facts.

What do you love about him OP?
Is it his looks, his body, or just him?

All of it! He's not perfect and he has insecurities and I know what they are. But if I were told that he is the only man I would see naked for the rest of my life, I'd be happy with that. He's also very kind, loyal, loving, thoughtful, caring, not scared of his emotions, able to be vulnerable. He's also a bit grumpy at times but no one is perfect!

I have read all the replies and I'm taking everything on board. Or, at least, I'm trying to.

Yes, I understand that but he does find slim, beautiful women attractive. That's his type. Those are the women he's previously dated. The fact that not all men prefer women who look like that is irrelevant because he does.

But, he's not dating them now is he? He's dating you. In your eyes you rank lower on the attraction scale than these people, but that's only in your eyes.

How do you know his exes are gorgeous?

Were you introduced to him, or did you know him before you started dating so you already know some of his family and friends and exes? (sorry if you have already said)

When I was 20, I did have a guy tell me that I had the best ass he'd ever seen on a white girl... But I was about 3 stone lighter then (too skinny really if truth be told). But I would like to be more confident in myself and not hate myself so much so that I don't care as much. I see women with similar figures to mine wearing skinny jeans and tight dresses and they exude confidence.

I was at my most confident at a stone and a half lighter than I am now but, sadly, that's also when I had comments from the guy I was seeing that I could stand to lose a couple of kilos. So it still wasn't good enough.

Not only that but I was out at the pub around the same time with some people I knew (including friends) and they were laughing but stopped when I got back to the table from the bar. I asked them what was so funny and they wouldn't tell me. One of my friends later told me that someone had commented to the effect of I had a big arse for someone my size (I'm quite petite overall).

I was devastated. So much so that I cried and told my ex husband. He said not to let it get me down and there was nothing wrong with me and they were probably just jealous that they knew I'd never agree to fuck them (the man who'd said it was in his 60s).

But either way, it's not just in my head.

In the past year, I've lost 16lb and been going to the gym so I'm stronger and I've lost fat and gained muscle but I've still got a way to go and, sadly, I know from experience that, even when I get there, there will still be people who feel it's appropriate to comment negatively on how I look.

Whatad I did watch the videos. Of course, I've heard them before!

And I get it but it still won't stop me being judged negatively by others.

Although I don't feel as awful as I did last night anymore so thank you.

Last night, I didn't feel I had any choice but to end it and I was really sad about that because, in every other way, we are really well suited. I don't feel as bad now, although my thoughts on it are pretty much unchanged.

So thank you all for that.

There's no accounting for attraction. Do you have a type?

I don't (though I do seem particularly attracted to arseholes lol).

It's the whole person that gets me. Kindness is something so attractive in a man if they're particularly cute, and power and confidence is something attractive to me if men aren't so cute.

David Beckham is my ideal man looks wise. Have I ever dated someone who looked that good? No - I'm no Victoria!

I end up dating intelligent, or powerful, or rich, or funny, or someone who 'gets me' men. I've never once dated a man purely for his looks.
Although when I was 16 I fell head over heels with a guy who was just so pretty to look at - tall, tanned, funny, could play guitar and sing! I believe he's married now. I brought him to my Debs.

The ones who 'get me' I'm easiest with.

I think your mother has conditioned you to think that looks are all that matter if you're female.

You sound incidentally like you've probably got a good body, a cute ass, you've already said you don't need makeup as your skin is good, so you're possibly not seeing what he he sees! He's seeing a hot, loving, kind, probably deep, intelligent, educated, shy, beautiful woman.

I have no ass. Even when I do lots of glute exercises. Nope. Not an ass in sight. I have boobs though! We can't have it all!

Not sure what I have to offer really apart from being as mad as a box of frogs, but men like me nonetheless. Not all! But some!

Oh and I've remembered one last thing.

I met my exh when I was 25. It sounds ridiculous to say it but:

he wouldn't introduce me to his friends for nearly 2 years. There was always a reason for it - usually along the lines of they all went to boys only grammar schools and didn't know how to talk to women (which, given they'd all also been to university and all worked, was clearly bollocks).

He managed a bar at the time and forbid me from ever going there, although his previous girlfriend had been there often. He told me it was because there were loads of lechy men in there and he didn't want me to be uncomfortable around them. Again, I was an adult and had lived away from home for 7 years by that point so was quite used to handling 'lechy men'.

And he also walked 6 ft in front of me whenever we went anywhere. He said it was because he was taller than me and couldn't help that his natural pace was greater.

I didn't meet his friends until they also got girlfriends and it transpired that the reason for keeping me away from everyone/not walking with me was that he was ashamed to be seen with me because I wasn't as beautiful as all the women they all admired/fancied (eg in films etc).

I should have walked away really but my self worth was non existent at the time. I told my mum and she just said that I shouldn't make a fuss because I was lucky he'd 'taken me on' and not to rock the boat because no one else would have me if he dumped me.

So I have had bad experiences with men all through my adult life. I am aware now that it is because of choices I made informed by things I'd learnt about myself growing up. But they all still fed into the belief system I had and I've never experienced any different.

This is all very much unknown territory for me.

Well it sounds like you've found a good one now! Who wants to show off his girlfriend!

Don't let your mother's voice in your head ruin one more thing in your life. Listen to your bf. Listen to us. Listen to yourself - that hidden little voice that says - you know what? I'm not actually all that bad!

@CampfiresAndBeer how did he take it ?

I'm never going to be the prettiest in the room, I'm never going to be the most educated in the room, I'm never going to be the most intelligent in the room, but I'm me! I'm just me. If you don't like me, that's fine, fuck off with yourself. But I like me!

You've a job, you've a good ass (more that I have), you work out, you're intelligent, your BF thinks you're beautiful, you've got a lot going for you! Try to relax and realise that everyone is not your mother judging you.

Most people are too busy judging themselves to be honest!

Do you have a type?

Not really. I have a series of 'types' I suppose. Not everyone I have been attracted to falls into one of these types. I do find 'youthful' men attractive; those with a twinkle in their eye who you know are still going to be having fun when they are 80+. I don't have a preferred physique though.

I don't have a good body or cute ass. No. I was probably closer to having an 'acceptable' body when I was a stone and a half lighter but I'm overweight and flabby

But no, no one has ever accused me of having a good body even when I was young, 3 stone lighter and pre children.

how did he take it ?

Sorry, how did who take what?

OP I reckon the majority of the population feels as you feel, to a greater or lesser extent. I think the confident are less common. Many gorgeous women I have known have felt the same as you, to do with the narratives left in their brains by their parents or because of bullying or something else.

If you get a guy gazing into your eyes and you think he is almost certainly in love with you, but at the same time you experience dissonance because you have this hardwired narrative telling you you are not lovable, then it is easy to understand why you might end up sabotaging.

I would say that it is early days yet in this relationship - a few months. I would try to take the heat off yourself and go with the flow a bit, and wait and see. If he is in love with you or falls in love with you it may take breaking a few eggs to make an omelette but it will work in the end. And getting true love from someone is the only way to heal and erase the old narratives maybe.

Know you aren't alone, in how you feel, in any event. As a comedian once said (can't remember who) there are millions of women out there and only 8 supermodels.

I did wonder though how you knew that his exes were gorgeous, as per my previous post...

Also realise that most people don't judge people the way your mother does.

@CampfiresAndBeer didn't you say last night you had no choice but to end it ?

I get it - you felt like it but didn't. Silly me.

I did wonder though how you knew that his exes were gorgeous, as per my previous post...

Sorry, I missed that.

He is still friends with them on fb.

Bloody hell, give the poor bloke some credit. You are insulting his intelligence by assuming that you know better than him what he wants.

Believe it or not the world doesn't revolve around looks. Anyone that thinks that way are shallow and vain. Op, you don't judge people that way. Nice people don't. Maybe your exes and mother weren't nice people but give the rest of us credit for not being so one faceted.

Looks help with the initial attraction. There has to be a great more depth for things to develop to a relationship. If any bloke gets stuck in that first phase of initial attraction then you don't want to be in a relationship with them anyway. Use it as a filter to filter out knob heads. Your bf obviously isn't one, as he's stuck with you and likes your many other qualities. And he wouldn't be with you if he didn't like your physical attributes as well.

Don't insult his intelligence or character by presuming you know better than him.

I don't have a preferred physique though.

Most people don't. And your physique is obviously doing it for your bf, so roll with it. Keep at the gym and fitness if you want to stay in shape, but you're not a write-off lol.

Have you ever had an eating disorder btw?

I get it - you felt like it but didn't.

Yes.