Do you think this is normal for a family in a rural region in the 90s?

[Moralitym1n1]

(it has actually continued into the '00s as well)

• females (not sure about males) don't have sex before marriage

• females (as above not sure about males) have a curfew while single and while dating. (Weekend curfew later than weekday one).

• all live at home until married

• if females (no idea about males) go on trip with boyfriend before married, separate rooms and chaperon eg brother goes on trip as well (shares room with bf)

• all females except one becomes house wife after marriage (the one exception actually works in same place as husband)

• large families (4 min.) after marriage

• regular church attendance

• (before marriage) females encouraged to participate in beauty pageants and similar 'lovely girl' competitions

• no artificial contraception (except barrier methods at risky times alongside NFP)

• no separate socialising from partner (both males and females)

• almost exclusively family socialising (both)

• discouragement from drinking alcohol (both but females more than males)

• both males and females strongly encouraged to study and work close to home (as above only one female cont'd to work after marriage.

I don't think this was average/normal in the 90s but am being told it was.

Why does there have to be fault?

Why does there have to be fault in anything - including the law?

Divorce laws are the way they are because our courts do not have the resources to spend months or years listening to extended, complicated, back and forward, in many cases improveable allegations and claims, trying to decide fault. Nor do the majority of the population have the money to spend on solicitors and barristers to do so .. so we have the flawed system we have; but ask most divorced people (especially those who were cheated on) and they be very clear on where the fault lay.

*are very clear

(oh and I reserve the right to be selfrighteous in response to the self righteousness and judgement that I was on the receiving end of throughout the relationship (except for the honeymoon period of course, he was a different person then).

It’s not true of rural Scotland. The more rural the area the less there is to do, so that just leaves underage drinking and sex to keep the youth occupied :/

In Ireland, possibly, sex outside marriage is still frowned upon in some areas!

but ask most divorced people (especially those who were cheated on) and they be very clear on where the fault lay.
If you ask both sides where the fault lay you will get very different answers. The truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

If you ask both sides where the fault lay you will get very different answers. The truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

Of course; but I wouldn't agree the truth is usually somewhere in the middle; more like sometimes. Divorces tend to be non sociopathic individuals suffering at the hands of sociopathic individuals.

(Of course you do also get divorces among very long term couples who truly have become only friends, and they are mutual and non-fault based as such).

It’s not true of rural Scotland. The more rural the area the less there is to do, so that just leaves underage drinking and sex to keep the youth occupied :/

Not bird watching, hiking, beach litter collection? 😉

Overall, this would be rural, religious, with a small family farm, not into politics, pro-life. I’m guessing Cavan.

Donegal, and interestingly I have seen a pro-life Facebook post by a family member.

@Moralitym1n1 that’s just what you tell your parents you’re doing ;) (I’m pretty sure they weren’t as green as they were cabbage looking though!)

In rural Ireland there seems to such clannishness and clique-nesd among extended families that I can imagine that you quickly become 'not one of us' and the enemy especially as the woman I find. I see way more successful matches where the ‘foreigner’ which includes UK was a man and the woman Irish.

I am in agreement with you on blame. ExDP wavers from either blaming me for the breakdown of our relationship or when I challenge him, saying oh it’s just incompatibility. I went along with this as the reason for a while, and because of it, doubted myself hugely, acted in a way to still give exDP credit, including over matters of custody etc.

This is having serious consequences and I’m realizing that I am in a situation where I could get alienated from my child and my mental health suffering. That’s not to say exDP is an awful person, but the reason for separation is that exDP has some bad attitudes towards me. If I did not at least see these clearly, I would not be taking the vital steps i am taking now.

I see this in relationships around me here. No one blames or names coercion, control etc and I see the consequences in both sexes, and in the kids. Kids who treat women badly because it’s the norm. We do need to cal, out things that are wrong.

Maybe in the 1890's! Not in the U.K. perhaps in rural Ireland though or certain religious groups (to this day).

P.s. I’m not in Donegal or Cavan but I’ve friends, lovely ones, but who belong to at least three different religious Christian cultish organisations where I am too. It’s quite common. My friends are great but my goodness they all have ‘issues’.

Not in the U.K.

Sadly it's alive and well in my part of the UK

I'm from the ROI and no that was not the way it was for women in the 90's

If I did not at least see these clearly, I would not be taking the vital steps i am taking now.

@orangecookie - you sound switched on/wise, I'm glad they couldn't condition you and that you're taking the right steps now.

Don't let them get you down.

Rose of Tralee is basically a Lovely Girl competition.
I know a family fro. Cavan who go to great lengths of respectability. The border areas are a it odd and produce far more hard line piety and a Kind of rigid thinking that bewildered me.
I have friends with parents from Fermanagh and their take on religion was very literal and absolute.
We look louche in comparisin

Thanks @morality sounds like you had a lucky escape!

There’s security in keeping close to family, but the downside is insularity and never being challenged, not accepting change. One of my neighbours says he is still treated very much like an outsider, by everyone here including his wife’s family, even though he’s lived on my road for 20 years. Where did he come from originally? 8 miles away.

In my rural community sheep come first.

I read the OP and immediately thought Traveller community. OP, I think you should watch this on catch up

www.channel4.com/programmes/big-fat-gypsy-weddings

My family is from Donegal - rural farm area - none of this applies to them apart from going to mass on Sunday was expected. All of my cousins were free to travel abroad from 18 and most went to universities in Dublin and Cork.

But my family aren't Travellers (or settled Travellers). I think you'll find your answers in this and other documentaries.

I read the OP and immediately thought Traveller community. OP, I think you should watch this on catch up

They are most definitely not Irish travellers and would be outraged at the idea 😆.

I have watched parts of big fat gypsy weddings (and the spin off with the lady who makes wedding dresses for the traveller community employing some traveller women in her business) though and I agree there is so e overlap in terms of the 'traditional', chastity (for women)-obsessed and women at home culture.

Not sure if you meant they are similar to travellers or are actually travellers (probably the former) but just to make the point that as someone who's mostly lived in northern Ireland and visited the Republic of Ireland on many occasions, your opportunities for interacting with travellers are almost nonexistent. I've sold clothing to them at car boot sales, passed a few in the street/out shopping and been stopped and asked for money by a woman outside a pub who claimed she needed money and had had to flee her home ... Aside from that, no interaction. Traveller men (in my experience anyway) do not get involved in relationships with non traveller women; we simply do not fit their requirements or culture. It's like expecting a devout Muslim from the middle East to consider you relationship/marriage material; they do not and will have s semi arranged marriage
within their communities.

In my rural community sheep come first.

As they should.

The Conservative, traditional values were alive and well in the city in which I live at that time with the one proviso that all women were expected to work before and after marriage.

(not are they 'settled travellers', they are probably typical background of small farming & fishing, with large Catholic families, family members going into priesthood/nunhood etc) .. now actually extremely successful in fishing related industries e.g. wealthy and recipients if business awards.