DH and OW's baby. Can he see the baby without seeing OW?

[Lovelytea]

Husband cheated and got somebody pregnant but i decided to work on forgiving him to keep my family together. Would it be possible for him to have a relationship with the baby without having direct contact with the OW?

He confessed what he'd done himself I suspect because she was going to tell me anyway. We split for 6 weeks whilst i decided how to proceed. During this time I had conversations with the OW and I do believe it was just a one night stand that culminated from an EA and that he was no longer in touch with her. He has been transparent ever since.

He bitterly regrets the affair and cut contact with her before he told me what they'd done. Eventually I agreed to stand by him and we're now going through counselling to work through the problems we were ignoring prior to the EA, of which there were a few.

After coming to terms with the reality of the situation I realise the baby needs it's father. As far as our family goes I'm prepared to facilitate a relationship between our DC and their half sibling, I'm prepared to have the baby over our house and for our DC to slowly get to know them. It will be painful but I'd never begrudge an innocent baby a relationship with its relatives on my watch.

The babies mother has told DH in a series of rambling texts that the baby will have nothing to do with our DC and she won't allow them to come to our house. She wants him to spend time at her house with her and the baby if he wants to know him and that our family are to have nothing to do with him or be involved in discussions.

Unfortunately that doesn't sit right with me because she's made it very clear she wants to be with DH. I've seen messages where she has said as much and she's been particularly vile about me and our DC. I don't think I should have to put up with such vitrol after what they've done and if anything it should be me lashing out which im not. Although he has been unfaithful she isn't entirely innocent and is a manipulative, spiteful and so herself.

She isn't interested in being civil and adult about the situation and has done nothing but cause trouble since it became apparent I'd be standing by him. She was expecting me to leave him and for him to go and be with her and the baby. He has said he wants no contact with her whatsoever but does want to see his baby which I think he should.

So my question is, is there any way he can have a relationship with his baby without having to have direct contact with her?

We're trying to repair after what he did and quite frankly I cannot stomach the thought of him spending any time alone with the woman. I don't want to break up my family so please don't tell me to LTB as for now I've decided to try to make it work. It's been a long and painful period of deliberation but for now I'm satisfied that I've chosen what's best for my family.

A relative dealing with hand overs? A contact centre perhaps? If he took her to court would they support his stance of not wanting to speak to her? Is that even possible?

The baby is 2 weeks old now and he's yet to meet him.

You’re looking at this in an unrealistic and unworkable manner.

He isn’t just ‘having access to the child’. He will be co-parenting with this woman. If you or he wants that child to grow up happy and content then they need to co-parent, which means discussing things and existing in the same space together. Or does the child need to spend their childhood making sure mummy and daddy never need to be in the same room together? That’s an awful childhood.

You’ve made the decision to stay with him. Fine. But you can’t force rules onto the child mother. And you can’t expect her to hand over a newborn child to be taken away for hours at a time. He needs to go to hers. He can take someone with her, but he needs to go to hers. They need to find a way to parent together, and you need to find a way to accept that he is in a co-parenting relationship with another woman. Or you need to rethink your decision to stay.

Did he know her before the encounter?

I am thinking why would a new mother hand over her tiny baby to a man she had a one night stand with, assuming she doesn’t know anything about him and if she can trust him (if his story is true of course.)

I second paternity test. If the child is his you may need to play a longer game and wait for her to ask for financial help and childcare support. If he didn't go with her to register the birth he may not have any rights. I'd have to be very sure of parentage before I introduced children etc.

If only he'd worn a condom.

Oh OP, I'm sorry this sounds like such a mess. I can't see how this could work with a newborn sorry.

Yikes...what a clusterfuck.

OP - this woman will be in your life for the rest of time. I'm a step-mom and I thought my DH's wife would fade from our lives as the kids got older. To a degree...yes that happened but she wants to be part of our lives so she creates issues to get our attention.

It will never end. You will be explaining the half sibling to everyone for ever more and they will do the maths and realise the child was conceived while you were married. Can you cope with that? I'm not sure I could.

But...I do get where you're coming from re: keeping the family together and I get you want to feel some sense of control because you've had none to date.

First off:

Paternity test like everyone is saying. Demand it.

Court order confirming visitation rights

Court agreed CM.

Then think long and hard about how you will deal with a child in your home who has a mother that seems to hate/resent you. How will you deal with discipline? How will you feel when she phones up during visitation to speak to her child? If she phone 10 times a day (like my H's ex did)...Think long and hard before you expose your DC to this toxic soup.

You dh is putting up conditions and expecting her to agree because he doesn't want to act like an adult. You can't expect her to hand a baby over or walk in to your home.
She may of been nasty, but she isn't married to you.
The more you talk about your dh the more my skin crawls.
He didn't think about you or his kids because and then when the shit hit the fan he blocked her. When it go serious he ran and has a third person dealing with communication.

She gets nothing from helping out your relationship by sending the dc to you but stress and it may not be fair and she is part of the situation but that's her choice.
Also you say it's not the babies fault but you haven't experienced the reality of actually seeing this child and watching it grow up looking like her and him, so even though you believe your being the bigger person, she has no idea what your actually be like or him. Especially as he's a liar, and a court will not assist no contact because he doesn't trust himself not to get back in bed with her.
I feel for you, because his night of stupid is going to be a life time of hell.

Why can't you split with him ??

I have not read the full thread. However, some of the advice I can see is quite poor. You may get better advice on the legal issues board. However, the answer to your question is yes, he can see the baby without seeing her mother. He will need to communicate with her but that can be indirect. And yes, the courts will support this stance if this is the best way to enable contact. And, contrary to what some posters seem to think, the courts will be happy to demand she hands over the baby for contact. It is important for the baby to build a relationship with both parents. The sooner that starts the better. The court would probably order something like a couple of hours once a week at this stage.

You don't think your dc will have a pt father anyway, if he decides to spend time separately with the baby for next 18 or so years.

If she didn’t trust him to look after a baby, she shouldn’t have had unprotected sex.

Or maybe if OP's husband didn't want to have to communicate with the OW he shouldn't have had unprotected sex with her. If he didn't want to be in this mess he shouldn't have had an affair. She isn't obliged to hand over her 2 week old or have the angry wife in her home as penance for being the OW.

He's the common denominator here. He has the poor OP tying herself in knots trying to make things right for the kids involved and is trying to make unreasonable demands of a very new mother, that aren't in the interests of the baby. All to make his life easier. He's a total shit.

He basing his acceptance on the date they had intercourse and the due date of the baby? He's a fool unless she was being held under lock and key somewhere. What on earth makes him so sure that she didn't have sex with someone else, either before or after their 'encounter'? Her 'word' for it? Please!! In her situation I'd be the one insisting on a DNA test so the putative father had no doubt!

He needs legal advice right away. I agree that her conditions are unreasonable, especially that the child is never to have any contact with it's half-siblings. That's just wrong, and unfair on the child. Whilst I agree in point with the baby being visited in her home whilst it is still tiny, I feel having a third party there (even if it's a relative or friend of hers) is a very good and reasonable compromise. If she's refusing that, there's a motive for her refusal!

What's more important to you - working on saving your marriage and keeping your own family together, or your DH seeing the baby? Because it sure as hell looks impossible to have both.

OW is calling all the shots because she can, because she wants to spite your DH and you, and because she would like him to leave you and be with her.

Personally I think you and your DH should concentrate on your marriage and forget about contact for now, He can always pursue a relationship at a later stage when things aren't quite so raw.

I think you need to leave. Why would you put up with that shite? Also, you are very kind to be worried about the baby's relationship with your children, but quite honestly, that's not your problem. Take care of your own kids and kick that pair of assholes to the kerb. Don't lose a moment worrying about any of the 3 of them.

You or he don't know how many other ONS she may have had.

If he's not insistent on a paternity test I'd wonder if this was going on longer than you've been led to believe.

It's not really possible to have a relationship with the baby and not see the OW at all.

Ive got a friend who was in your situation and due to the insistence of the OW that my friend was not involved.... they took the decision to go NC.

They have kept all their attempts to have a relationship with his DD safe...along with the abuse from the OW.

They're prepared for her to contact him when she's 18...but their marriage would not have survived him having contact with the OC/AC (other child/affair child) while the OW wanted my friend's DH to leave and be with her.

To be completely honest I'm worried that if I leave I'll have a complete breakdown because I won't be able to oversee or maintain the very small piece of control I have left over his communications with her that i have whilst I'm with him.

I realise how toxic that sounds.

Most of the time I try not to think about the inevitable because when I do it makes me cry. I'm far from over it and have been deluding myself into fighting to keep my family together.

OP I think you are dealing with this by trying to take control of a situation where you simply don't have any.

Trying to dictate the terms of contact to suit your understandable concerns isn't going to work.

ATM (and for the foreseeable future - by which I mean until the child is an adult) the OW holds most if not all the cards - this is especially true whilst the child is very young.

If she doesn't agree with what you propose, even if your H backs you there is no way a court is going to agree to a mother being separated from a baby because of your concerns - even if it's for a day at their fathers house.

How you feel is irrelevant. All the court cares about is the welfare of the child and when they are this young that's also invariably tied to the welfare of the mother (esp if breastfeeding etc).

Realistically from what you've posted I think you're facing a future of your H offering financial assistance and very little else based on your boundaries.

If you're committed to staying in this relationship I think as per pp's you need legal advice to really understand the ramifications as tbh from these posts you seem to think you and your H are in a stronger position to "dictate" terms than you are.

Knowledge is power and frankly if you had it I'd doubt if the compromises you seem willing to make to save this relationship would be worth it.

Oh god.
That’s no way to live. Really no way to live

It sounds like trying to make something unworkable work for want of a better phrase

When my dc has contact at a contact centre with their father, there were a few babies who were there too.

Your H could quite possibly get contact at a contact centre for a few hours whilst the mum waits in a waiting room for baby.

I can’t see it happening without your H going to court tho if mum won’t co-operate.

This vision for the future (where you have his child within your wider family life) isn’t going to work in the interests of the child without you and everyone close to you having some kind of cordial relationship yourself with the OW, plus your husband having an unrestricted father relationship with the child which means a lot of contact with OW. How feasible is that? Are your kids, wider family, the shared grandparents etc all on board with this? Do you want that relationship for you and your children? You would be asking a hell of a lot of yourself.

We have some experience of something a bit like this in my family and it has been very very difficult for everyone, the two partners with kids from the same man do not feel able to have a relationship with each other, so major wider/extended family celebrations like milestone birthdays, weddings or funerals have been very difficult and there is effectively a split formed in the wider family now because of their situation.

Tbh it sounds as if you are more worried that either way he will resume his relationship with ow, if he ever really finished it, but are trying to retain a semblance of control. If that it going to happen it will make no difference if you stand by him now or not, you would be deferring the inevitable. Maybe take a step back , ask him to leave while he sorts this mess out himself.

I can see you are really well meaning OP and it's really generous of you to be able to do so. But in the nicest possible way, it's got nothing to do with you.

Your DH needs to be able to communicate with this woman to co parent and build a level of trust with her and the child. That will need to be on her turf where she is comfortable, and the reality is that she may never want your DC to meet hers, let alone have any sort of relationship.

Not your circus, not your monkeys.

Can't believe you have stayed with him, I bet he can't either!

I agree with the ladies that say she is offering reasonable access, although I totally understand why you have a problem with it. Why does your husband object to it?

If she is breastfeeding then I doubt any court will even allow a contact centre and I think it's unlikely at this young age even if she's formula feeding. I do know someone that had his child at a contact centre from 5 months, but it was for very short periods of time.

I also think it's strange no DNA test has been requested, especially if it was a one night stand.

This woman will be part of your lives for the next 18 years and a court will not take your feelings into consideration. There will come a point though when contact has been established and increased that the child will be allowed to your home and she will not be able to stop it.

@Lovelytea you can have control by kicking your H out and let him sort out the whole sorry mess. Unless you are with him 24/7 you can't control what he does. If he can only keep his cock to himself by being policed - why bother?