Being accused of gaslighting and abuse

[OmmiMama]

Married 3 years, have 1.5 yr old and pregnant with much wanted number 2.

Just been away from DH with family for a lovely stress free week.

Came home and within an hour or two he was getting grumpy and stressed with me (because I asked him to get something out of the blue suitcase in the car, and then he asked where something else was and I said 'the blue bag' meaning the one right in front of him in the house, but he thought I also meant the blue suitcase in the car - so he got grumpy accusing me of 'not giving him enough information' etc).

Then when that blew over we were in the car talking about upcoming scans and I asked if we were going to find out the sex this time. He said of course we would, we did last time, and I reminded him that I hadn't initially wanted to last time. He said 'ok you decide this time' and I said I'd rather we discussed it and decided together (like last time). He then said that he had given me 'what I wanted' and why was I arguing. I said I wasn't arguing, just wanted us to discuss and choose together. He said he would never discuss it again. Kept repeating that he was 'agreeing with me' while declaring that he would not talk about it with me again. When I said he wasn't agreeing with me because that wasn't what I wanted he shouted and swore at me (with our baby in the back of the car :( ).

We then stopped talking and a few hours later he apologized for the shouting and swearing but said it was my fault for painting him into a corner. He said we could talk about whether to find out the gender if I wanted. I went to bed.

This morning he was acting like nothing had happened, I was talking to him as necessary for getting our baby up but when he tried to start another conversation I just said I really didn't feel like talking to him. He accused me of giving him the silent treatment. I said I was talking to him, just feeling pretty upset.

He repeated that he had been 'agreeing' with me and I had argued with him and what could he do. I said he hadn't been agreeing. He said I was 'gaslighting' him.

I then told him what I had been feeling, which was that I had been so much happier away from the arguing and stress. (I didn't tell him that I didn't miss him at all, but that's how I feel. Without him I was happy).

He said he had apologized but I was continuing the 'abuse' and 'gaslighting' him over what happened.

I just want out. I just want my baby and then one to come out of this place where they will hear shouting and swearing.

You're hard work.

You do sound like hard work tbh.

It may just be that you were trying to keep brief and to the point, and so left out some details, but I could imagine this looking different from his point of view, e.g.:

You: Are we going to find out the sex this time?
He thinks: We did last time, so she must be OK with that. I don't care, so I'll make her happy.
He says: Sure, we did last time.
You: But I didn't want to last time!
He thinks: Oh, OK, then she isn't OK with it. I don't care, so I'll make her happy.
He says: OK, then we won't.
You: But I want to discuss it!
He thinks: So "Yes" was wrong and "No" was wrong; not sure how that discussion will go.
He says: I agreed with you, why are we arguing?
You: But you didn't agree with me!
He thinks: I tried to, but whatever I said was wrong...and now she's telling me my perception of reality is wrong. Didn't I read something about that on Mumsnet?

Agree with others.

The scans thing was escalated by you. He answered and you 'reminded' him you wanted the opposite when he answered. He said 'ok you decide this time then' but that still wasn't good enough.

Now your the one ignoring him when he has apologised.

The bag thing was just a stupid misunderstanding and probably happening all over the world as we speak!

So now you’re going to take his kids away too? When it is you who starts all the arguments? Unreal.

I'm not going to 'take his kids away' FFS. The kids are not going to be done any favours living in an environment with daily shouting. Therefore they will be better if we are separate. I'm not going to stop him seeing them. Where are people getting this from?!?

He just can't win with you can he? Whatever he does is wrong in your eyes. If you're so unhappy in this relationship why don't you just leave?

Whilst I do not condone shouting and swearing in front of children, your little one is a baby. He/she will hardly pick up rude words and whilst babies do get upset at loud noises etc , they do calm down pretty quickly, they're not emotionally scarred if it doesn't happen regularly (IMO)

He won’t be living with them, because you are deciding to separate because of abuse.

The sad thing is, you don’t see that it is you who is the abuser.

Are you looking for things because you’re just not happy anymore?
Ifyou don’t want to be in a relationship anymore you don’t need to be, or need a reason.

OK OP - your description of what was said / not said is quite difficult to follow and I don't think you come out of it very well - you do seem to be haranguing him too and also sulking (i.e. not talking about things if it doesn't suit you).

However, I was wondering if what you are trying to say is that you would like to have more 'adult' discussions - that this is what is missing from your relationship. At present one person gets his/her way or the other one does. It all sounds very 'zero sum' and you are right that relationships based on being a winner/loser are exhausting. I think you are also not unusual in wanting your DH to be happy to see you after a break and it is not a good sign to feel this disheartened and upset when you return from time away from each other.

Maybe if you could give some other examples - why you went to couple's counselling, it might help?

It sounds like you wind each other up constantly ... did this only start after your second pregnancy?

You don't have to prove who's the baddy and who's the goody to split up. If anything it's good if you can avoid the blame game, especially if you want to have the children moving between 2 homes.

It seems to be me like your mind is made up and you want to leave- have I got that right? If so, that would explain why none of the posts on here have been well received by yourself

Totally agree with others that if you want to leave - then leave.

But you don't have to have the "awful abusive never discusses things or makes me feel special" partner to do it.

It's fine to just want our for your personal gain. In fact creating a rift to do it will create the exact atmosphere you want to protect your child from.

It's clearly been difficult for a while if you've been having counselling .

How did the conversation about the bag go?

He asked if he could get X for me. I said that would be great it's in the blue suitcase in the car. 10 mins later he was rooting through bags in the hallway calling upstairs to me 'wheres my Y' I say in the blue bag. Come down a bit later asked for me x, he launched into a tirade about how there were two blue bags and he had gone to the car but his y wasn't there so he had assumed it wasn't the bag my X was in either and came in without it, so now he would have to go outside again and it was all my fault for being unclear and I said sorry (it was my fault, of course. But I hadn't done it maliciously).

His head sounds as if it’s been minced.

Curiously, when you apologised did you expect that to be the end of it? With no further discussion?

He shouted and swore at you, in front of your child. He is the abuser.

From reading this, I feel sorry for the guy. You do sound like you want to argue and he can't win.

Have the pros and cons of finding out the sex changed since last time?

Yes. A large part of why he wanted to last time was to do with it being the first baby on his side if the family and wanting to be able to make a big announcement. Also I didn't want to find out as I didn't want a load of very gendered baby things so they could be used for future siblings, but obviously as we did find out we have a lot of very gendered stuff now, so knowing would help with buying stuff, I guess. There may be other stuff I haven't thought it through yet.

He shouted and swore at you, in front of your child. He is the abuser.

How did you reach that conclusion?

OP, I have has discussions with my hubby which sound a bit like this. I ask him "when should we go shopping". He will say "today". I'll say "but I have chores to do today". He says "ok tomorrow". Then I say "but if its better today you can go today". He asks "ok, either today or tomorrow. You decide". I say "well let's discuss". He runs out the room pulling his remaining 5 hairs out in frustration.

I have put this down to male/female differences. IMHO men are very black and white, yes or no. Whereas I am a ponderer, a let's weigh up the pros and cons, he is a more decisive, much more decide one way or another.

I get that you wanted a discussion to weigh up the pros and cons of finding out and come to a joint decision, he seemed to want to know one way or another and anything else is indecision and probably frustrating for him. I also am presuming you wanted a joint decision because you wanted to have his input and not be selfish. However in the process it was probably confusing for him.

Ive learnt to understand such differences and agree one or another and that in my attempt to be inclusive and nice I was actually being indecisive and thus more frustrating for hubby.

The swearing was wrong and he was right to apologise for that.

I hope this makes sense!

@ravenmum spot on with how the conversation went, poor bloke can't do right for doing wrong by the sounds of it

I think people are reading a very different thread to me. Why the hell are you all blaming the OP? She's not gaslighting him, ffs. She's trying to have a conversation and he's yelling.

Clearly you had, otherwise you wouldn’t have kicked off an argument about it!

I don't feel I did 'kick off an argument'. I just tried to chat about something, and then got told what I wanted lots. But I don't think there is much point trying to convince you, so I accept you see it differently.

So what’s your problem?
My problem is living in a house where I constantly get shouted and sworn at, and where our child is exposed to that.

My problem is living in a house where I constantly get shouted and sworn at, and where our child is exposed to that

Massive drip feed OP.

I don't feel I did 'kick off an argument'

Read your OP back, exactly as you’ve written it. Because it writes like you did.

In fact, all your posts write like he has to jump to attention constantly and is walking on eggshells and is emotionally exhausted.

So you’ll forgive me if I’m dubious of your drip feed about him shouting. Because you sound exactly like my XH when he’s trying to justify himself.

From the OP. She said he shouts at her, and swears. That isn't justified even if you think a person is annoying.