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Cultural differences UK Playdates Recipricol behaviour Generosity Sikh

374 replies

Rightgirlwrongplanet1 · 03/06/2018 18:00

Please can you either validate by sharing examples of your own, or disprove my conclusions, about the ungenerous, unwelcome cultural attitudes of British, white people.

My background is Punjabi Sikh and I was born and brought up in the UK. I grew up watching my parents receiving and themselves being visitors.

My take on Sikh people is they were from traditional, humble backgrounds with jolly, warm, generous backgrounds. Sikhs in particular are known for their overly generous nature with a visit never missing offers of quantities of food.

(As a child, I remember guests would be offered anything we had in the cupboards. They only had to mention the word and it was on the table in front of them. The guest was king. The gesture was equally reciprocated when visiting a similar background. The unspoken understanding was we didn’t have much, but we shared what little we had. And offering food showed you cared- I digress).

Trips back to the motherland extended that concept to a greater extent with the people sometimes having the least, offering the most. It made me feel warm, welcome and humble.

In my experience of the UK, it is polar opposite. Whenever I have visited people from British background in their home, I have always been offered nothing.

My daughter once went on a playdate for 2 hours and upon collection, before her host, whined she was hungry and thirsty. The guest didn’t respond by offering a glass of water. Instead he invited us for more playdates the next day (presumably for the same treatment? Angry)
She later confirmed she had not been offered anything, not even a glass of water. The hosts were well within their means to offer a modest snack, let alone glass of water.

When I stayed for the first few minutes of the playdate, the host remained laying down on the sun lounger, drinking her own cup of tea Brew! This I could never do for fear of appearing rude.

As a mum, my natural nurturing instinct makes me offer a little girl who visited our house something to eat and drink. We had hosted 2 playdates previously and the mother saw for herself the generous amount of treats laid out, so it is sad this wasn’t reciprocated. I was not expecting equal but at least a (free) glass of water.

I visited someone from British background to pay condolences to someone who had died and I offered food, flowers Flowers and card. I stayed for an hour and not offered even a glass of water by relatives.

I have paid my British neighbours a visit and nothing, not even water. I paid three of my Gujrati neighbours a visit and offered home made food. My Turkish friends offered cake and home made food. At my party, the Arabs arrived flowing with food. I am so grateful and humbled that I reciprocate in good will feelings back to them.

Perhaps I am guilty of actively seeking out examples to reinforce my negative stereotype of white British English people. It is a small sample set but enough for me to make some generalisations.

Perhaps my comparison is unkind as the people who offer nothing have come from working class backgrounds and class plays a part in cultural manners.

I am moved to write this because the irony is that in the world where people are relatively wealthy compared to their third world counterparts, they display what I believe to be ungenerous, unwelcome (mean-spirited) behaviour.

We live in the south east of England - a region of disproportionate wealth in the UK. They have relatively much more in terms of disposable income yet cannot offer even a glass of water.

I know this is a controversial post and I expect it will upset the majority white British people who read this, interpreting racist connotations. It’s not- I’m only writing what I have experienced in real life.

(In gurdwaras, we serve langar which is blessed food for those who seek blessings from god- the giving and taking of food being so central to our lives- I digress).

OP posts:
Rainydaydog · 05/06/2018 19:46

Its very interesting to compare cultures and its even fine to say you prefer some aspects of your own culture as long as you admit others may have their own good reasons for their way of doing things so your way is not superior its just what suits you and probably what you have got used to.

Its a shame this thread has such a negative OP as it would actually be an interesting topic to chat about and get people's experience and thoughts of their own cultures way of doing things.

SluttyButty · 05/06/2018 19:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

findingmyfeet12 · 05/06/2018 19:59

Do people have an issue with the term "white British"?

If so, how would you describe Brits who are not second or third generation immigrants?

AsAProfessionalFekko · 05/06/2018 20:06

No slutty she is wrong.

I assume she is young and hasn't experienced it yet. Or is she someone who will brush off being racially abused with sympathy for the abuser?

findingmyfeet12 · 05/06/2018 20:07

It's an interesting debate.

Thinking about it, in terms of superiority, I'm happy to admit feeling superior to cultures where, for example, animal cruelty is the norm. I only feel superior in relation to that specific part of the culture though. I guess that makes me bigoted in that regard.

The op's superiority was limited to hosting and I guess she's entitled to her opinion, unpalatable though it may be.

JingsMahBucket · 05/06/2018 21:27

Brava to your daughter @SluttyButty. She's spot on and I'm glad she's starting to have that kind of discourse now.

Mof3K · 05/06/2018 21:52

Of course you can be racist to white people! What utter bull

AcrossTheOcean · 05/06/2018 22:13

I had a boy over for s playdate who I plied with food but he wouldn't eat any of it, then when his parents came, he complained how hungry he was 😳 That said, with so many kids in and out everyday, I don't particularly lay out food or drink for shorter visits as most are comfortable enough to ask. However, if it someone not over often, I would offer.....

PandaPieForTea · 05/06/2018 22:28

*Do people have an issue with the term "white British"?

If so, how would you describe Brits who are not second or third generation immigrants?*

It is quite possible to be white, British and second or third generation immigrants. White people migrate too.

I think that does matter because there are assumptions around the cultural heritage of people who appear to be “white British” which can be at odds with their actual cultural heritage.

findingmyfeet12 · 05/06/2018 22:39

I'm stumped then for a way to describe that majority group in that case that won't cause offence.

Myleftfeet · 05/06/2018 22:41

SluttyButty, bless her but I don't think your daughter understands racism at all. She has nice writing though, assuming she's very young.

If my daughter played at a Sikhs house and didn't get offered food or water, I would assume the guests were just ungenerous, unthinking twats. I wouldn't start to think 'Sikhs are all like this'. FFS, OP Hmm

I'm white British and always offer my DC's friends snacks and drinks. Some will, some won't. I don't think race comes into it here Hmm

findingmyfeet12 · 05/06/2018 22:55

If "white British" isn't appropriate I guess "black (insert country)" isn't appropriate either?

Myleftfeet, the op was giving extreme examples and using them to conclude that Brits are mean spirited. I think it's safe to say that generally Brits offer less in the way of refreshments than those who adopt some eastern customs.

Maybe race shouldn't be brought into it but certainly nationality can be brought into it in relation to Brits where there's no influence from for example immigrant parents or grandparents.

ittakes2 · 05/06/2018 23:05

Although I would offer food and drink to guests - I think it’s a cultural thing that you or your daughter don’t feel comfortable asking for water etc.

SluttyButty · 05/06/2018 23:16

My daughter is young yes, almost 19, highly intelligent and well read and about to start a law degree. She’s also passionate about understanding and learning about race and equality and a feverent feminist. On a side note her brothers are ‘brown’ (I’m their mother btw) so she is well versed on racial discrimination thanks but I’ll pass on the ‘bless her’ in which she’ll likely just steam gently with such condescending words.

The post and subsequent comments (as I stated many pages ago) are not racist, prejudicial maybe though more misguided and seems to have offended many. I’m white as said and I’m not remotely offended by any of this but I am interested in cultural differences.

ghostpepper · 05/06/2018 23:45

Slutty I am hindu (as said above), and one can easily be racist against white people. Why not? Judging people by the race is what makes racism.

She may be highly intelligent, but certainly not humble (as the signature indicates). I remember thinking I knew everything at that age too.

kitcatdog · 05/06/2018 23:54

OP I'm sorry but you sound quite awful and your generosity hollow.

Never give to recieve. The joy is in being kind to others surely? Those were the manners I was always taught.

Also you seem to be ignoring the posts that say the always offer tea snacks which is the majority of this thread to pursue your own narrative. I'm sorry to offend but you are coming accross as quite racist. Cultures are different as soon as we all start to understand and accept this WITHOUT JUDGEMENT, (you come accross as very judgemental), the world might start to be a better place for everyone.

GothMummy · 05/06/2018 23:56

Good grief. I'm white, British and brought up in Norfolk and always have home made cake in the tin and tea in the pot for visitors! I'm like Mrs Doyle in that respect ;) OP, I think you just had bad experiences!

kitcatdog · 06/06/2018 00:38

How would you feel if the situation reversed? You not offering a thing to a visitor in a land where grieving is long drawn out? Would you likewise find it automatic to instantly adapt and not make a mental note of it somewhere in your mind? Because that's what you are expecting of others, would you expect that of yourself?

It's not about you! The people you visited were experiencing a loss
You are there for them. No strings. You're visit is for their benefit not yours. Judging people you apperently care about who are experiencing loss is awful. Your empathy (or lack there of), needs work. Acts of genuine selflessness are good for the soul, you should try it!

kitcatdog · 06/06/2018 01:28

Apologies for the one big paragraph. There were spaces but the app has garbled everything.

nightwispa · 07/06/2018 15:00

When I first read the original post, it seemed like it was a Sikh religion promotional attempt (which is a well known phenomenon that takes place through dedicated pro-Sikh online groups). I still feel that way. PP have asked the poster genuine questions to engage in a productive two-way dialogue but she chooses to handpick a few people to reply to only. Shame.

RedLily84 · 07/06/2018 22:39

Really?! I’ve never heard of these pro Sikh online groups?! And so what if they are pro Sikh? What do you know about Sikhism @nightwispa?

French2019 · 08/06/2018 08:16

Sikhism is not a proselytising religion, so I'm not sure why they would need to "promote" their faith.Confused

scottishdiem · 08/06/2018 12:30

More as an FYI but here is how the demographic question was put in the census. White English is at the very top. Although I do like it when the majority get all freaked out at being categorised.:

16 What is your ethnic group?
A. White
 English / Welsh / Scottish / Northern Irish / British
 Irish
 Gypsy or Irish Traveller
 Any other White background, write in
B. Mixed / multiple ethnic groups
 White and Black Caribbean
 White and Black African
 White and Asian
 Any other Mixed / multiple ethnic background, write in
C. Asian / Asian British
 Indian
 Pakistani
 Bangladeshi
 Chinese
 Any other Asian background, write in
D. Black / African / Caribbean / Black British
 African
 Caribbean
 Any other Black / African / Caribbean background, write in
E. Other ethnic group
 Arab
 Any other ethnic group, write in

spontaneousgiventime · 08/06/2018 16:38

Cultural differences are just that. What is a societal norm in one place is not the same in another. As a white Brit who has to be very careful what I eat, I feel very, very uncomfortable being presented with plates and plates of food as in some instances I don't know what's in them and they could render me unwell.

Anyone who comes here is offered a cuppa but no cakes biscuits or sandwiches as I can't eat them so don't have them in the house (my children have grown up and left home). The only exception to this would be an arranged meal, then obviously I would cook.

Play dates weren't really a 'thing' when my children were small. We would have other children round but usually just calling on one of ours and waiting until they were ready. I would offer a glass of juice while they waited and usually a piece of fruit. I didn't encourage snacks between meals for my own so wouldn't do it with someone else's.

OP, I think you just have to accept this country is a patchwork of all different customs and traditions and no one family is going to match your ideals exactly. When my husband died, people came to visit but would just go and make themselves a cuppa, one guest had to pop to the shop as I ran out of milk. These things happen. I was in no state to jump up and down and make refreshments.

It might be an idea to just accept there are some parts of British life you like and some you don't. There is nothing wrong with that and it would make you sound a lot less judgemental.

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