Cultural differences UK Playdates Recipricol behaviour Generosity Sikh

[Rightgirlwrongplanet1]

Please can you either validate by sharing examples of your own, or disprove my conclusions, about the ungenerous, unwelcome cultural attitudes of British, white people.

My background is Punjabi Sikh and I was born and brought up in the UK. I grew up watching my parents receiving and themselves being visitors.

My take on Sikh people is they were from traditional, humble backgrounds with jolly, warm, generous backgrounds. Sikhs in particular are known for their overly generous nature with a visit never missing offers of quantities of food.

(As a child, I remember guests would be offered anything we had in the cupboards. They only had to mention the word and it was on the table in front of them. The guest was king. The gesture was equally reciprocated when visiting a similar background. The unspoken understanding was we didn’t have much, but we shared what little we had. And offering food showed you cared- I digress).

Trips back to the motherland extended that concept to a greater extent with the people sometimes having the least, offering the most. It made me feel warm, welcome and humble.

In my experience of the UK, it is polar opposite. Whenever I have visited people from British background in their home, I have always been offered nothing.

My daughter once went on a playdate for 2 hours and upon collection, before her host, whined she was hungry and thirsty. The guest didn’t respond by offering a glass of water. Instead he invited us for more playdates the next day (presumably for the same treatment? )
She later confirmed she had not been offered anything, not even a glass of water. The hosts were well within their means to offer a modest snack, let alone glass of water.

When I stayed for the first few minutes of the playdate, the host remained laying down on the sun lounger, drinking her own cup of tea ! This I could never do for fear of appearing rude.

As a mum, my natural nurturing instinct makes me offer a little girl who visited our house something to eat and drink. We had hosted 2 playdates previously and the mother saw for herself the generous amount of treats laid out, so it is sad this wasn’t reciprocated. I was not expecting equal but at least a (free) glass of water.

I visited someone from British background to pay condolences to someone who had died and I offered food, flowers and card. I stayed for an hour and not offered even a glass of water by relatives.

I have paid my British neighbours a visit and nothing, not even water. I paid three of my Gujrati neighbours a visit and offered home made food. My Turkish friends offered cake and home made food. At my party, the Arabs arrived flowing with food. I am so grateful and humbled that I reciprocate in good will feelings back to them.

Perhaps I am guilty of actively seeking out examples to reinforce my negative stereotype of white British English people. It is a small sample set but enough for me to make some generalisations.

Perhaps my comparison is unkind as the people who offer nothing have come from working class backgrounds and class plays a part in cultural manners.

I am moved to write this because the irony is that in the world where people are relatively wealthy compared to their third world counterparts, they display what I believe to be ungenerous, unwelcome (mean-spirited) behaviour.

We live in the south east of England - a region of disproportionate wealth in the UK. They have relatively much more in terms of disposable income yet cannot offer even a glass of water.

I know this is a controversial post and I expect it will upset the majority white British people who read this, interpreting racist connotations. It’s not- I’m only writing what I have experienced in real life.

(In gurdwaras, we serve langar which is blessed food for those who seek blessings from god- the giving and taking of food being so central to our lives- I digress).

I have never not offered anyone a drink when they enter my house. Not always food.

@Rightgirlwrongplanet1 there is a post from someone from the same culture as you who said she got fed up of distant relatives turning up and expecting to be hosted when she just wanted to grieve.
My best friend lost her fiance in his 20s it was unexpected and a terrible shock, there were other people there - i genuinely cannot tell you if any of her family offered me a cup of tea, i couldnt have taken one anyway, my concern was my friend who was sobbing in my arms. What would i have done with the tea? sit relaxed with it, cup and saucer and watch it all unfold like i was watching a soap opera?
I didnt for one minute want a drink, on the other hand i offered to make the relatives drinks before i left, quietly asked if they needed me to do anything. In the days and weeks that passed i dropped round with food parcels etc for her, i saw it should be me caring for her - none of it was about me or my needs. It would never ever occur to me to come away from a grieving family and be concerned that i'd not had a drink - i dont deem that to be a cultural difference, its empathy.

Would you likewise find it automatic to instantly adapt and not make a mental note of it somewhere in your mind?
I live as a foreigner in a country where there are small but niggly cultural differences. I do find it important to try to adapt when I notice I'm doing something "wrong" or, if I don't need to adapt, to accept that people here do it their way and I need to accept that or live my life in unhappiness.

Examples:

Here, you answer the phone with your surname. If you don't do that, people think you are being rude, so I answer the phone with my surname.

Here, people don't usually chat to strangers much in the street like they do in the UK. But they are not bothered if I chat to them; some even like it. So I chat to strangers in the street, but I don't sit around moping that people don't chat to me in the street and think of them as unfriendly. It took me many years to adopt this attitude, though: I know that it's tempting to wrongly apply standards no-one else knows about. I gave up doing that, however, as I realised how unhappy it made me.

OP you are taking two personal experiences and making it a cultural thing

Yes there are differences the British way is a cup of tea and a biscuit or squash some people do more. Nothing is not the British culture just people you know

You lost me at ”the motherland” OP.

Not sure how some individuals act should be taken as all of British culture. As someone from a mixed American background where my equally mixed paternal side always had food out for guests and on my maternal side it was expected you would ask if you wanted something and then, if old and well enough, go get it yourself, I find the desire to smash everyone of a group in better or worse hosts absurd.

I'm a mix of both - I quite often get and bring out snacks and such for guests but in general, if you want I haven't brought out, you are welcome to ask and then go help yourself. I certainly wouldn't respond to a child old enough to whine that they are hungry and thirsty that wouldn't properly ask. I don't encourage that sort of behaviour and would be embarrassed if my child did that as a guest in another's home.

The most absurd is expecting grieving people to play host or acting like them not doing so shows how ungenerous their culture is. I can't wrap my mind around the idea that someone who has had a family member or someone close die should care for visitors rather than be cared for by visitors. It is quite nice that they kept a brew going and I know some who have done similar for a sense of normalcy and to take their mind off things, but I would feel guilty if someone felt they needed to do that for me and mine's comfort or because they didn't want to look like a bad host. If I wanted water, I would ask for it and ask if I could get them something while I was up. I don't understand why it should be expected that someone should offer it to a fully capable person.

I grew up among very different parts of my family which have very different ways of doing things and then had relearn that all again as an adult when I immigrated, but I never really expect people to offer me anything when I visit for whatever reason. To me, it is the opposite of a generous mindset to expect that (generous is in the freely giving, not in wanting others to give or in giving only out of expected behaviour). It's nice, sometimes, though sometimes those who push drinks and food can be more stressful than anything else, but I don't think it is strong evidence that they are more generous than someone else. Different people give differently.

I live in France where it's normal to say "bonjour" when entering a lift, a waiting room at the dentists or doctors etc.

When I first moved here I found it really difficult to get the hang of this and maybe some people (like the op) thought I was being rude. It's just not part of my culture but I've learned to adapt and do it their way.

I don't expect the French to not greet me because it's not in my culture to do so nor do I think they're being pushy by speaking to me because they don't know me.

I'm shocked at expecting tea from the bereaved.

In my experience most South Asians don't eat or drink at a bereavement as it's considered rude to expect to be catered for. I remember my mum, grandmother and their friends taking dinners to the homes of the bereaved so they wouldn't have to cook. They did this for up to a week after the death.

OP, if you are there to drop your child off for a play date and you are in the back garden staring at the mum drinking tea on the sun lounger, then you have definitely 'popped in'. Maybe for a reason... to say hello, or check what time to pick up etc, but popped in nonetheless.

You are right, some people can be very rude. I am from a Mediterranean background, my mum is Armenian born in Cyprus, I am British born, we are the same as you. When guests come, they are fed and watered with what we have, if children come in a play date I like Ito know that they are comfortable in terms of drink and food. Some children are shy in people's houses, so may not speak up, it's up to tge adult hosting to make them feel welcome. I am with you op!

If your not happy, I woukd not send my chikd on play dates to the house, bring a pack lunch with her with drinks and snacks. I do agree with you.

Findingmyfeet Same here in Germany. One of my neighbours was complaining that some new foreigners didn't "greet" her in the lift, and when I said that maybe they hadn't got the hang of it yet, she could hardly believe people didn't do that everywhere. To her it was "obviously" rude to ignore people :)

When visiting those who are grieving/recently bereaved the attention and focus should be on them. Not the guest and their refreshments. When my little niece died and we stayed at my sister’s for almost two weeks I did all the cooking and cleaning. I didn’t expect her to lift a finger for me - I was grieving too, but in nowhere near the same capacity and therefore I was there to help her. Not the other way round.
And, when people came round (and hundreds did) I rarely invited them in - just accepted their gifts/cards, thanked them, and said we hoped to see them soon/at the funeral. Our family was not in a fit state to host and neither did we want to.

Some children are shy in people's houses, so may not speak up, it's up to the adult hosting to make them feel welcome

Yes I totally agree with this. If my DC have friends over I'm always offering food and drinks. I'm very conscious of the fact that many children may feel shy to ask and I'd hate to think of a visiting child feeling hungry or thirsty.

I can't get past 'class plays a part in cultural manners' in a sentence which appears to condemn all WC people. Wow.

Class may very well play a part historically in the way we receive guests. It doesn't reflect on manners though as different classes would have had different norms. What's polite in one circle isn't necessarily so in another.

I'd say that class distinctions in these types of areas are not so noticeable now.

"ungenerous, unwelcome cultural attitudes of British, white people"

Just wow. That is breathtakingly Racist.
How dare you lump all White British into that category?
But that's ok, you can keep judging us and looking down your nose at us whilst patting yourself on the back for being a perfect human being.

I think the OP is mixing up her arguments, and generalising massively, which she seems to accept, in part.

@pissedonatrain she's not moved here she's born and raised here, she doesn't need to assimilate.
yes she needs to realise there's differences in cultures and accept it and adapt to a degree but she doesn't need to completely change herself.

I wouldn't t offer food on a 2 hour playdate. If she said she was thirsty I hope I would pick up on it and offer a drink.

I wouldn't t offer food on a 2 hour playdate. If she said she was thirsty I hope I would pick up on it and offer a drink

How rude. Why wouldn't you just automatically offer a drink rather than play some weird guessing game as to whether the visiting child is thirsty?!

Can you even begin to imagine the fall out if this was a 'white/British person labelling 'all brown Muslim people' 😠

Oh and I'm white/ British, and I always offer refreshments to people in my house, be it a guest, or a workman etc.

The UK has had loads of famines OP. Seriously, you're on a device with a connection to the internet. Google it. It's true that they stopped much more recently than the last big Indian one, the 1840s as opposed to the 1940s, but you specifically said you were talking about centuries.

Also, judging the hosting skills of people who were grieving is disgusting.

Can you even begin to imagine the fall out if this was a 'white/British person labelling 'all brown Muslim people'

It’s not though, is it?