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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

WWYD - my daughter wants to live with me all the time - exDH wants 50/50

205 replies

Tigerbear · 19/12/2017 10:55

My daughter is 6, and her dad and I separated when she was one. We agreed then - and thought it was the best way - to have shared custody, where she's with me half the week, him half the week.
This has worked relatively well until recently. For the past 2-3 months, she's been extremely upset at the prospect of going back to her dad's, to the point of being distraught. She's said on many occasions that she no longer wants to continue living in two houses and that it's upsetting for her. When asked what she would like to happen, she first says that she wants us all to live together, and when I explain that that's not going to happen, she says she just wants to live with me and that she'd just visit daddy.

Several key things have happened to change the dynamic since exDH and I split: he met someone else, she has a daughter the same age as my DD (they're in the same class at school too), he moved in with her, and they then had a baby who is a year old. Her DD is quite a strong character, and although my DD loves her and they call each other sisters, I know my DD sometimes feels anxious by the other girl.
DD has also expressed jealousy of the new baby.

When asked why she wants to stay with me more, she says because there are 5 people at daddy's house, and only two of us at mine. She is quite sensitive, likes her own space and a certain calmness, and she obviously doesn't get that at her dad's (all three of the children share a room there, in a small flat), and she doesn't get any one to one time with her dad.

ExDH doesn't see that there's an issue - he says she's fine when she's actually at their house, and that it's more the anxiety/the prospect of missing me that's the issue, and that we just need to find a way of managing DD's anxiety and sympathising that it's hard living between two houses.
He brings up petty things like saying of course she prefers being at mine as you give her sweets and chocolate and let her watch more TV, which we don't do at ours (he made a big point of bringing this up during a meeting we had with teachers recently, trying to make himself look like the better parent).

DD was distraught the other day, begging me to ask exDH if she could live at mine. What do I do, when he sees no problem? He's saying she doesn't really understand what she wants at such a young age - his analogy: well, she says she wants to eat loads of biscuits, but we don't let her just go ahead with it, we can't change everything just because she wants to, it's disruptive for everyone.

The thing about exDH is that he's subtly controlling, smug, arrogant, pretty much despised at his work because of this (I found out from a friend who worked with him that a young trainee had left because of him gas lighting her). He has a way of making people feel like they're in the wrong, and I don't know how to fight it.
His solution is that we need to take DD to see a child psychologist to find out what's wrong.
All I see is my little DD totally crushed these days - she's always been such a joyful and happy child, and the light has gone from her eyes, she's fretful, always says she feels ill, doesn't want to do anything.

Sorry for the long post. Any suggestions much appreciated.

OP posts:
RidingWindhorses · 10/01/2018 20:30

Apart from anything else, if this issus not dealt with sensitively and intelligently now, DD could end up with mental health problems later on.

ColonelJackONeil · 10/01/2018 20:53

I agree with a pp who said the ex is right in saying they need to get to the root of the problem but he doesn't seem to be interested in hearing what the problem is or doing something about it, preferring to put the blame on the OP and saying the dd seems fine when she is there etc. Doesn't it bother him that she is really upset and anxious?
I can see quite a few things that need changing. There needs to be an awareness that dd is going through a hard time, she is moving between parents always missing one of them. She has a new family to deal with who don't sound easy at all. Her step sister seems to live with her parents all the time and of course the baby does. So she shouldn't be treated the same as them all the time. She needs extra reassurance, one to one time with her dad and to feel comfortable in her dad's home, her siblings should be managed so they don't bully her or break her things often and she should have her own room so she feels she belongs there.
Maybe the OP could cut back a small amount on the Disney stuff but only as much as she would if she were looking after dd full time and maybe had a family to take into account. I'm assuming she would not marry and start another family without thinking carefully how it would affect her dd. I don't think she'd be squeezing 3 kids into one room and not doing any activities at all, but she might scale back a bit and have to split her time and attention. I'm not saying OP would have another family or not, but this is just a way of making the dds life more balanced which will be easier on her. So basically OP should just make sure she is having a normal family life but still keep on being fun and giving lots of attention as usual.

RidingWindhorses · 10/01/2018 20:57

The root of the problem is bleedin' obvious.

SandyY2K · 10/01/2018 20:59

ex has said to him that if I were to get sick again he wouldn’t be welcome to stay there.

Just shows what a bad parent he is the. No decent father would say that.

if this child is forced to go to her father's regardless of her distress, she may quite feasibly cut off contact completely as soon as she is able.

I agree. It's more harmful and she may decide to cut off both parents for not listening to her later on.

LoverOfCake · 10/01/2018 21:36

I don’t dispute at all that the DD needs to be listened to and that there probably need to be changes with regard to how contact happens in future. But this needs to happen most likely with professional input, possibly a mediator, not just on the unilateral decision/action of one parent. Because the reality is that there are parents who would unilaterally cut contact and tell the other parent the children didn’t want to go. And if the DD is genuinely not showing distress when she is at her dad’s then all of the reasoning does need to be looked at to be sure that it really is just the setup at her dad’s house and whether there is any element of anxiety that her mum is alone/that she’s doing things without the dd and the dd is missing out etc.

With regard to my ex, he genuinely does have it in him to be a decent parent, but he is absolutely blinded by his partner, added to which he tends to open his mouth first and think after. And it’s because of the partner that DS refuses to go there. Fortunately I have a decent support network now, and DS would have support from ex’s extended family as well if the worst were to happen, but we’re not going there atm.

tigerbear · 10/01/2018 21:44

Thanks again, I'm really appreciative of everyone on this thread, and I'm sorry I can't respond to everyone individually.
To update, today I was totally at breaking point, with DD upset all last night, and crying on the way to school since and since 6.30am.
Her headmistress called me this afternoon, and was utterly brilliant and supportive. I couldn't wish for a better school and staff.
Her opinion is that they've all seen a massive change in DD since the start of the Autumn term. They can see how distressed she is.
I told her everything very openly and candidly, and explained that none of us want this to get to court (but will obv do so if we can't agree, as a last resort), and she's settting up a meeting between me, ExDH and partner, her, the teachers and the pastoral care team, and they will tell ExDH that he needs to listen to DD.
I feel so relieved that they are on board and something constructive is happening at last.
She also said that if it goes to court, they WILL take her views into account, despite her age. Headmistress also said that DD is extremely bright and articulate for her age, and more than capable of being clear and expressing her desires.
I've also arranged for DD to see the GP next week, to assess her anxiety levels.

OP posts:
tigerbear · 10/01/2018 21:51

The headmistress has told DD that whenever she's feeling sad or misses me at school, she's allowed to go to the office and call me. The level of care is just brilliant.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 10/01/2018 21:54

Glad the headteacher is able to have impartial input.

I don't think anyone agrees that the op should cut contact - it's about short term changing things until her DD is calm and happy again and then working out how to increase contact so she remains happy.

Ironically had her Dad listened in the first place she could have been happy with 60:40 or similar by now.

tigerbear · 10/01/2018 21:56

I absolutely don't want to cut contact at all between him and DD, I just want her to feel settled and stable.

OP posts:
tigerbear · 10/01/2018 22:02

For those posters asking how I can even consider sending her - because my ex says he'll take legal action against me if I keep her with me and go against the agreement.
If it did then go to court, he'd then paint me as being unreasonable, obstructive of him seeing his DD, as acting impulsively, of being unstable etc.

OP posts:
ferando81 · 10/01/2018 22:46

I would video her when she's expressing how much she hates being at her dads. As evidence that you are not making it up and support if your ex tries to take you to court.
Leaving your daughter where she's unhappy can't be the answer

Locotion · 10/01/2018 22:47

Oh OP I am so sorry you and your daughter are in this situation. I really hope things look up. What a vile man , sounds similar to my exDH and so I know a what that feeling is like . I fiercly wanted to protect them and look after them & felt sick and powerless at how uncompromising ex was being. Its a horrible situation. Sending you and your DD many well wishes and magical powers...

tigerbear · 10/01/2018 22:48

Taking note of everyone saying I should video when she's upset.
Just to clarify though, she doesn't hate being there, she just doesn't want to live there.

OP posts:
tigerbear · 10/01/2018 22:48

Locomotion - thank you.

OP posts:
midnightmisssuki · 10/01/2018 23:00

Sorry for what you and your daughter are going through OP.

The situation is not ideal - but thats the nature of separations, your daughter is very young to understand that. Is there a way to convince her having two houses is so much better than one (my friends who are divorced spun the whole two lots of presents to open thing)? I understand it must be hard, but i think there needs to be a way that your daughter maintains a relationship with your ex - something middle of the road. I dont think her never staying there is a great idea, that would ruin whatever relationship they have.

I agree - staying with you does sound like more fun, more space etc, but i suppose your ex's situation (living wise) is not something that is easily changeable, plus with the extra children, i'm sure your DD is feeling out of place. I think seeing a counsellor is a great idea.

I dont have a solution for you OP - but i hope you come to the best solution for your daughter, because at the end of it all, she is all that matters. Good luck.

tigerbear · 10/01/2018 23:03

Midnight - thanks.
I did try to get her excited about the fact that she had another load of presents to open at his at Christmas, when she was reluctant to go, but she wasn't bothered. She just said, ok, I'll go and open my presents there, then I want to come back to your house mummy.

OP posts:
Bigbertha123 · 10/01/2018 23:26

Would it not be a good idea to make the playroom/spare room a bedroom for your DD? Somewhere she could have her own privacy and space since this seems to be a major issue for her?

BlackeyedSusan · 10/01/2018 23:32

I think you need to present her issues withthe visits too him, with some suggestions. eg she would like some time alone with dad, she would like her toys not broken up by the toddler, so perhaps sharing with the sister might be better... a range of solutions that are focussed round dd, that he could choose from

or maybe it would be best to ask him how he thinks he can make it easier for her at his house.

anyway the head teacher being impartial will help.

tigerbear · 10/01/2018 23:38

BigBertha and Blackeyed - it wouldn't be an option for DD to have her own room at their place, as there wouldn't be the option for the stepsister to have her own room too. Until recently DD and the stepsister shared, so no idea why they've put the baby in there too. ExDH says they all enjoy being in the room together...

I've asked them before if DD ever gets one to one time with DH and they laughed in my face and said no-one gets one to one time, that it's impossible with three of them.

OP posts:
IsabellaDMC · 11/01/2018 00:06

That is bollocks, Tiger. There were 5 of us but DM still managed one to one time. My time was going to Sainsbury's on a Saturday when DM did the food shopping and we always had a cake in the coffee shop.

Be aware that she may well be telling them she is happy. Me and DSis did (I was 8 and DSis was 10). We told DF we wanted to stay overnight and DM we didn't. He took it to court, won, and after about 6 months of begging DM to not make us go we had to tell him ourselves that we didn't want to stay. I don't have much memory of the time because I was so young, but I remember the stupid child psychologist and the conversation with DF.

GrooovyLass · 11/01/2018 00:25

I want to slap some sense into your ex, op, I really do. He needs to back off and let your DD settle for a while before gradually increasing her overnight stays again.

My ex similarly was so busy shouting me down and getting one over on me that he never looked at what's best for DD. She's now 18 and has been nc with him for 18 months.

SandyY2K · 11/01/2018 00:36

What a brilliant headteacher. I'm glad she'll call that meeting...great idea.

Your DD is incredibly articulate for her age from what you've put here. Many adults are unable to express themselves as well as that.

I have one on one time with my DCs ...your Ex doesnt get it at all.

SandyY2K · 11/01/2018 00:49

I'm assuming her step sister has no contact with her bio father? ...and is never away from the house.

From DDs perspective...she's the only one in this whole arrangement who has 2 homes her step sister doesn't .... so she realises it's possible to have parents separated and you still get to live with just one.

SleepingStandingUp · 11/01/2018 01:00

So glad school are helping.

No reason Dad can't take her out for cake on her own. The other two will be getting 121 time when she isn't there

Rainbowqueeen · 11/01/2018 05:11

Sleeping makes a really good point about the other 2 kids having one to one time when she isn't there.

Is that something your ex will have considered? At the very minimum things need to change to some extent. If its not the 50/50 arrangement it's how your DD spends time when she is in both houses.

Someone has already made the suggestion that your house becomes less of the "fun House". But it seems very clear that your ex needs to change what is happening in his house too. Has he come up with any ideas for this?