Women who "have it all"

[GetAGlance]

I've always been a bit "off centre". Led an unconventional, sometimes interesting life, you could say. But also quite a difficult one. Men have been occasionally interesting but zero support. The same with family.

Anyway, I am now living in a slightly different mileau (more middle class, suburban), and I am noticing for the first time, looking round, quite "sorted" women. By this I mean women who have married well to good men they love who are emotionally caring and financially responsible. Imagine! I am guessing they just they seemed to know what they wanted from an early age - marriage, children, etc. And then went about it the right way (rather than sadness, difficulty and drama). Sometimes it feels a bit strange being in their company, almost as if I am a black sheep (single mother etc), or at least feeling very different.

Anyway, these are new, sometimes uncomfortable, feelings to me, and I am wondering what to make of them. I feel hesitant to post this, but anyone comprendez?

There is ALWAYS luck involved

Luck to have been in the right place mentally and emotionally when you met a nice man.

Luck not to have been drawn in by a con artist who can fool even a careful sensible woman.

Acknowledging luck does not diminish the achievement of hard work or careful choices.

Failing to acknowledge that luck plays a part does make you seem naive or boastful.

It is human nature to wish that there was no luck involved, because then we can say that we will protect ourselves by always being clever and careful. It's just not true though.

Yep, I chose one of those too stumblmonkey , who decided then to have an emotional affair , problem is the things I like in him, other women do too of course. It's a bit luck of the draw, they can be perfect on paper and for many years and something comes along to bite you on the arse .

we'll have to disagree then Armani.

jeez.

Not sure why moomin is getting told off for being angry - her posts made sense to me and actually answered the question posed by the OP.

For those saying it's all luck, would you not advise your DDs on who to avoid?

Would you tell them to spin the wheel and hope for the best?

My original thought was that if Moomin's posts are enough to make you cry then perhaps you should talk to a friend and not post on a board where strangers will tell you what they think.

I don't think Moomin was out of order in any way, she just said something that was not what you were hoping to hear. She's wrong to think there was no luck involved, but what she's' said is not unusual or deliberately hurtful, it's her own experience and opinion.

It's not ALL luck.

It's a combination of luck and judgement.

But bad luck can befall even people who are very careful and clever.

Would you tell your DD that she must have done something wrong, if she ended up in an abusive relationship? Because there's no luck involved? Or would you acknowledge that bad luck can befall any of us?

I think Elspethand stumbly are on to something.
None of the 'sorted women with great husbands' I know got with them young or if they did, they didn't have to (pregnancy or society pressure)
Most of us had several relationships to learn from before we settled down. None of us were expected to marry well or early. We had jobs that could support us, even getting a mortgage alone so fuck knows what will happen to this generation

we'll have to disagree then Armani.

jeez

You're the one who is coming across as angry and slightly unhinged.

No. I would tell her to make the very best judgement she can in choosing a life partner.

And then if she gets even a sniff that they're a wrong 'in, run away and don't look back.

Trills lots of women do stay in abusive relationships because they are subject to the influences you mention in your last paragraph.

unhinged? not really. I just thought she sounded angry when she had everything to celebrate, which was a bit strange. whats your story?

Trills lots of women do stay in abusive relationships because they are subject to the influences you mention in your last paragraph.

And that's why people claiming that their achievements are all down to their efforts and luck has no influence whatsoever is damaging.

I'm a sort of have it all but only now because I'm older & wiser!
Did 14 years living with a bad boy cheat who wouldn't marry me, 3 years with a commitment phobe alcoholic and then a few years on my own!
Met my now husband, he is kind, financially secure and we have a great life & relationship and I love him very much but I was determined not to accept anything less than marriage.
Too late for children unfortunately so I don't have it all but I wish I had been less tolerant of crap behaviour when I was younger!
Life is good but it took me a long time to get here!

And Trills for that matter, whats your story? I assume if you post on a thread you have a point of view, rather than just attacking me (OP) for the sake of it. Otherwise its the usual AIBU bunfight.

Anyway, I'm logging out of this bunfight ... ridiculous people on here.

And am hiding the thread.

Hope its useful for others though!

When I met my ex I was very cautious and wanted to be sure I knew him before I commited.For 10 years he was great then a change of job, midlife or something caused him to change and he became aggressive.I am still shocked he is the person he has become.
I previously would have posted on here saying I had done it right.Didn't go for the cool boy, he was Mr Gentle..except when he wasn't.

Ah, sorry I'd missed that. But I still don't think it's completely random that some people end up in bad relationships. I think upbringing and judgement have a lot to do with it- that's not to say that no woman ever ends up completely blindsided, more that a young woman without experience of good relationships (her own or carers) with fewer options is more likely to.

I get how you feel GetAGlance because I've felt the same. I distinctly remember a University reunion a decade ago that left me feeling really on the outside and somehow failing (even though I recognised that to some people I might appear to be doing ok).

I don't feel like that anymore.

Some of those married women may well be looking at you - living in the same neighbourhood but doing it as a single parent on one salary - and thinking 'Wow. That GetAGlance is so sorted. Managed all this completely on her own and led such an interesting life whereas I stopped work and travel really young to have DC...'

It's all a matter of perspective.

I'm in the best relationship of my life now. With a man who is every part my equal and who treats me the same. We share the chores, the childcare, the careers, etc. I didn't meet him until I was 36 though, after two failed relationships and a 6-year-stint of being a single parent (which was the making of me and when I trained in a new career).

My first LTR was with a man similar in temperament, but vastly different in ability. It was a relationship that ended when I realised that I didn't want to mother another human adult, however respectful, lovely and otherwise helpful he was. I felt so old before my time after this relationship that when it ended I 'fell' into my next relationship with a charming bad boy who turned out to be an abuser (but not until I'd had children with him). I met him when I was at a low point in life, easily capable of having my head turned. I wouldn't have looked twice at him before or after.

I don't like the sneering at women who like 'bad boys'. Truth is that society throws constant messages at women to put up with these types and minimise their behaviour. And women who can't see them for what they are have often been brought up in households where it's normal, accepted behaviour or at low points in their lives when they are especially vulnerable to the MO of being treated like a princess at the beginning. If a man treats a woman like shit, let's blame him for doing that rather than her for not recognising it sooner.

I've turned my massive error of judgment into a positive and as part of my new career I am able to use the experience empathetically with great results.

Having a less conventional life with mistakes thrown in along the path can result in a lot of human warmth and learning. As long as you can turn them into something positive, set yourself on a path to a life you do want, and appreciate what you have - I'd say these things can make you feel like you have far more than those who may appear to have it all. That's how I feel about my life anyway.

Hope you feel more positive about your own life soon. Celebrate your differences. They are what make you you.

Nope. No luck involved.I chose the quiet nerdy bloke other women weren't interested in. The sweet, supportive bloke who loves me to my bones.My DP doesn't want to be the life and soul of the party, he doesn't want to earn millions, he wanted to be home to put the kids to bed. He has gone from boring to hero according to other women. They made their choices, I made mine

Right. So in your opinion, women who made bad choices are to blame for their choices? They could never have been tricked, deceived, lied to? How can it be possible to know today what might happen in 25 years time?

I did everything right - educated, well travelled, lived abroad, career, good money, entirely independent when I met my ex. Knew him for 3 years before marriage, 6 years before having children. He was the the same man you describe. Except he wasn't. Nothing in my background, my ex's background, history, experience, could have predicted how he would behave. It's all luck.

I think I learned a lesson from my Mum. My dad - great bloke, we're very close, but not the most stable. Prone to impulsivity, which often resulted in lost / quit jobs. As a result mum had to work very hard, including cutting her mat leaves short, in order to support us. She drummed home the importance of stability and dependability, which I definitely took to heart.

DH is first proper boyfriend. Like other PPs he's probably not the glamorous, cool option but he is funny, kind and a wonderful father. He, like me, is aware of his responsibilities and we live quite sensibly. Boring to some, perhaps, but perfect for us; he is my soul mate.

I think there was a fair bit of luck in it too though. I was lucky enough to meet him at 16 and therefore protected myself from spending my late teens / twenties dating and therefore reduced the opportunity to make bad decisions.

While people don't think it is their good luck that lands them with the right partner I rather think a lot of it is.

Here was where I got lucky: good intellect, largely inherited with some early parental support and nurture; no abuse in my birth family; got into my twenties in a boom time (90s, v early 2000s) so got established professionally despite some fuck ups on my part (material security); a naturally reflective, tenacious personality tempered by good people skills (good sincere friends, has also helped at work). Good fertility, two lovely kids.

Where I got unlucky: poor relationship modelling in birth family (have had some awful relationships where I've have taken more shit than I should've) and poor mental health (poor coping skills taught to me, thinking anyone who takes me on is good enough...).

Of course some people make very wise choices despite their background but most of us are very heavily influenced by upbringing and genetics to a degree. Anyone who says their 'have it all' life is a result of sheer graft, well, unlikely in my view.

The result is

I think we need to be careful not to victim blame women who've unknowingly got drawn into relationships with abusive men who started out nice and ended up anything but. Sometimes what seems like a sensible choice turns out anything but.

I agree.

I have a family member like that. Their marriage from the outside would have seemed like a blueprint for marriage in so many ways.

Little did us outsiders know that the 'D'W was actually abusing my family member.

No one knows what goes on behind closed doors.