Would you ever date someone who has no contact with his child?

[Baldricksslug]

I have NCed for this and it is quite outing so I will be vague, but I will try and answer questions as best I can.

The relationship between him and his ex broke down very early in the pregnancy (before the first scan) as he lost his job and she asked him to leave. He was not allowed to the scans and has not seen the child since he was a baby (now almost 3). A mediation appointment was set up which she did not attend. She did not put him on the birth certificate, which I understand further complicates things. She then moved but did not tell him where to. He paid maintenance and then stopped it so she would have to pursue him through CSA (or whatever they are called now) and he could insist on a DNA test and get put on the birth certificate. She has never done this because she knows what would happen and she does not want him to have parental rights. He has sort legal advice but cannot afford the thousands in legal fees it will take to get a court ordered DNA test, get on the birth certificate and then sort out contact, and he would probably have to know where they are first. He is saving to do this, but feels it is a long way off and hopes the mother has a change of heart or that the child expresses a wish to see him. I don't know, but if I were a child and my father were not around I would feel extremely hurt and perhaps not want to see him.

They do not have contact as she will not let him have her phone number. She will sometimes unblock him on social media to berate him for not paying maintenance, and then block him again. I was initially very dubious about everything to be honest, but the subject has come up around his family members, not discussed in depth or anything and I didn't ask any questions about it, but I have heard bits and pieces that seem to verify his version of events.

It is a very new relationship, but I feel everyone has "baggage", for want of a better word (I know I do!) and I don't really feel like I want to run for the hills just yet (which I feel some posters may tell me to do as it's a lot to take in in a new relationship) as it is otherwise going extremely well, and if people were to write people off in the beginning for having struggles, well, I don't think anyone would be dating me!

I think the reason I am posting is because I feel like if it were my child I would be fighting tooth and nail, even if it meant borrowing, getting into debt, hiring a PI to find them, etc., etc. Is this ever not the case? Why wouldn't it be the case?

Awaywiththepixies to put an unmarried partner on the birth certificate, they have to attend the appointment with the mother, or the mother can bring the appropriate legal paperwork that shows parental responsibility. Neither seem to be the case here.

I would spend every penny I had to try and see my children, even if it risked leaving me broken and breaking up my relationship. I'd represent myself in court if I had to.

OP, the part that would worry me is the refusal to pay maintenance. The child exists and deserves the maintenance to be paid. I'd be more reassured if he was saving the maintenance money he wasn't paying in order to give it to his child at a later date. But he seems to have given up on it entirely.

No, it doesn't have to cost thousands to go to court.

My Ds doesn't see his father. Exs girlfriend, family and friends have been told I'm stopping him seeing him, when reality is that he was abusive to Ds.

You can't put a man on a BC if you're not married unless he is present. If he's not present you can't put his name down.

User her behaviour has been erratic, but I am not saying it is necessarily indicative of mental health issues. I would not be able to diagnose that. Yes, she fell pregnant, it wasn't planned, she didn't want an abortion or to have it adopted. These things happen. Happened to me, in fact!

My issue is not so much that I don't trust him, it is around whether he is doing enough to try and establish contact and how I feel about it. I have provided information and answered questions to allow others to help me by giving their opinion on how they would feel.

Honestly if it were me I'd run for the hills and not look back.

My friend met a 'lovely' man who had a daughter with his ex. He had no contact, it was all the ex's fault, he had spent thousands in court, his friends and family said that she (ex) treated him badly, refused to put him on birth certificate, refused contact even after he went to court - I could go on but I guess you get the picture.

She was with him for around 5yrs, supported and encouraged him to fight for his child, she got pregnant wedding arranged he walked away when his second daughter was days old. Wedding cancelled and he's not on the birth certificate.

I'm sure you can guess what's coming? Yep, all his family and friends say more or less word for word what they said about his previous ex. My friend actually received a message from (his now ex) girlfriend saying women like her give woman a bad name, repeating lots of the bull shit that had been spouted by him. My friend replied with screen shots of messages she's sent him and told her exactly what an arsehole he is.

I'm not saying that it's the same in your situation but if it was me I wouldn't take the chance.

Adora10 lucky you're the mother then, cos it's a whole lot harder for the father where an RP mother is deliberately stopping contact.

Those "coals" you'd be walking on, as an NRP father, are the "Family" Court. You could end up in the situation my ex next door neighbour was in with his ex. He'd go to Court and get an Order. She'd flutter her eyes at the judge or mag's and promise to be good and then she'd tell him to piss off when he came for his pickup. That went on for years and years.

He had to spend multiple thousands every time she broke the order. When I last spoke to him he'd been to Court something like 20 times, with 5 Orders - all of which she'd broken. Nothing was done by the court to force the issue. No punishment for her, no switching residency etc. In fact, by year 4 or 5 she was arguing that his previous lack of contact (caused by her!) meant there was no bloody relationship and therefore he shouldn't be getting contact! Pick the logic out of that one!

So yes, to pp's previous questions, I would still advise people in this situation not to spend the money and no, I wouldn't feel less of them in those circumstances, particularly when they'd been denied from even establishing a bond.

It's also very easily googleqble on the government website that by paying 365 pounds he can apply to the court to make a declaration of parentage if she refuses a DNA test, and the court can order one if they wish.

www.gov.uk/get-dna-test

My husband is the most gentle bloke but has an almost grown up daughter he not seen in almost 20 years. When we met many years back, I felt similar to you OP, I had my reservations, but over time he proved himself time and time again to be true to his word.

There could be a million and one reasons OP, literally. I wouldn't write him off if he seems a decent guy. Just keep your eyes open

All you will get on here, is people casting aspersions - and they are strangers - you know your partner, but these people on MN, they do not know him at all and it seems you have got backed into a corner of having to defend him on this thread

BarbarianMum I have to agree with you

It needn't cost £1000's to get PR and contact for the child if he was willing to do the research and represent himself. It's not all that difficult.

I'd be concerned.

I'm not sure what he could do. If someone is determined not to let you see the child and goes to that length then you're onto a lost cause without literally thousands of pounds free to pay legal fees.
Reasons why. Some women don't want an ex in their life. They don't care about the child's well being it's all about what they want. Even if he won she may still make it impossible for him to see the child.
Some men are abusive. If your level headed and understand the signs you'll know if he seems that way.
I think if your relationship is good you may give him the emotional strength to try to gain access.

I think you are getting too involved with things which are none of your business. He says, she says, I heard from a friend etc. analysing his ex, his contact, his maintenance, birth certificates, csa etc, etc.

None of us know our partners when we first get together. We do not consider getting in contact with ex's etc. You trust what they say

If you view men with children as 'baggage' just don't get involved in the first place.

I would run a mile.

Either he has got fatigued with the hurdles his ex has put up and she is a nightmare or he is a crap father (and why has she behaved so drastically?!).

I wouldn't be willing to risk him turning out to be an abusive partner and deadbeat father so I'd rather walk out now than take the chance.

The absolute best case scenario is that he can't be bothered to actually go down the avenues available to attempt to see his child...

Eh no, I'd not be interested in him.

actually i think op's gut is telling her there is something wrong here, and she should listen to it. As I said, I'd want the court history even if it was unsuccessful to prove to my kids that I'd tried and been blocked. It isn't just about the immediate outcome, it's about demonstrating you tried everything.

All the people saying they would spend every penny going through the courts have clearly never done so. The reality is that if a parent refuses to comply with the order nothing is done. Nothing. And it takes MONTHS to go back, again and again and again. By then the child has been told you can't be bothered with them and trained to hate you. It's not unheard of for the child to be encouraged to lie about some mistreatment that occurred during contact.

It's well known that abusive parents interfere in the parent child relationship. Just as many women are abusive and disordered as men. Never mind all this mothers must have a good reason. Abuse isn't a gender issue.

As for the assumption that he's abusive, if that's true presumably she would be frightened of him, not sending him abusive messages. I certainly wouldn't send abusive messages to my abusive ex. He would jump at the opportunity to to abuse me.

Op look at the facts. If she wants maintenance she can approach the csa. Why WOULDNT she do this? Because she's clearly resistant to the dna test., which speaks for itself doesn't it.

He paid maintenance and then stopped it so she would have to pursue him through CSA (or whatever they are called now) and he could insist on a DNA test and get put on the birth certificate. She has never done this because she knows what would happen and she does not want him to have parental rights

This is the bit that makes me wonder. If he goes through the CMS he has to pay for the DNA test then take it to court so he wouldn't save anything so why not just go the court route.

My kids have friends who go off for contact with parents who have been physically/sexually abusive to resident parent but who have secured contact through the courts. Because most RP's comply with court orders, even in such circumstances. Sure, there must be some out there who don't, but in that case the NRP would have filing cabinets bulging with court paperwork. This guy hasn't even tried to take it to court, once.

yeah, i hear all the people saying court is appalling etc. that's experience. this person has not had the experience. Don't you think it'd be useful to show your children you tried? For the sake of your adult relationship with them.

I utterly agree with Thedevilmademedoit, paterpower and bipbippadotta. A few years ago I would have made an instant, unfavourable judgement on a father who had no contact with his child(ren). But now, having seen someone close go through it, there was a point I remember thinking to myself "I can see why some Dads give up".

There are some bad parents out there unfortunately. I have had experience of a mother trying to stop contact between a father and his children. This absolutely included false accusations on her part, refusal to agree to something as simple as a phone call, attempted blackmail, and it took a lot of stress, time and effort, including mediation and court, to get a decent level of contact for the children. Unless you have gone through it, you can't know the toll it takes.

For a young father; possible someone who was abused in the relationship himself; someone with not much self-esteem, motivation, intelligence dare I say? I could see why they give up. I don't agree with it, but having seen how much torment it can put a person through and nearly destroy them without the right support, I can see how it happens.

To your original question OP. I don't know what your partner's circumstances were but I think it may say something about his personality. I think you need him to tell you exactly what happened in his own words, and make a judgement on that. It is possible that his circumstances may not be a dealbreaker for you. However, I caution you to think long and hard about the relationship going forwards - do you want to deal with this stress which may only get worse? Because it is hard to deal with the presence of a (difficult) ex; a stepchild; it brings stress into a relationship for sure.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

I know of a similar situation. Casual relationship, she wanted more, but he didn't so broke up with her. Then she revealed she was pregnant, but he could only be involved with the child if he got back together with her. He wasn't allowed any involvement at all. There was a contact order that she ignored. He pays maintenance still despite never having seen his child.

You could ask whether he should do more, but as others have pointed out if you are dealing with someone who has no intention of allowing contact it is exceedingly difficult. And he's never been able to bond with his child. It's very easy to apply how you think about your own children to the situation, but if you've never spent any time with them how do you acquire these feelings?

He's now gone on to get married and has two kids with his wife.

There is a big difference between having made real efforts to see an support your child and doing nothing but complain it's impossible though. He's done nothing to make this happen, which makes him incredibly weak and passive at best.

Deranger he has said similar, that he wants to be able to show him he tried. I'm starting to think I've missed something that he has in fact done. I will be seeing him later and will ask.

What Barbara says, he's not even entered the court system or any other system for that matter to even find out his rights and what he can do and as has been said, it doesn't cost thousands, that's rubbish:

It's also very easily googleqble on the government website that by paying 365 pounds he can apply to the court to make a declaration of parentage if she refuses a DNA test, and the court can order one if they wish.

I will never understand any parent who doesn't go over coals to see their child and if as above the child is now 20 what's stopping the contact then? Sorry but they are not trying hard enough, and I hope they have all put money away to give to their child seeing as they've paid fuck all for their upbringing.