Would you ever date someone who has no contact with his child?

[Baldricksslug]

I have NCed for this and it is quite outing so I will be vague, but I will try and answer questions as best I can.

The relationship between him and his ex broke down very early in the pregnancy (before the first scan) as he lost his job and she asked him to leave. He was not allowed to the scans and has not seen the child since he was a baby (now almost 3). A mediation appointment was set up which she did not attend. She did not put him on the birth certificate, which I understand further complicates things. She then moved but did not tell him where to. He paid maintenance and then stopped it so she would have to pursue him through CSA (or whatever they are called now) and he could insist on a DNA test and get put on the birth certificate. She has never done this because she knows what would happen and she does not want him to have parental rights. He has sort legal advice but cannot afford the thousands in legal fees it will take to get a court ordered DNA test, get on the birth certificate and then sort out contact, and he would probably have to know where they are first. He is saving to do this, but feels it is a long way off and hopes the mother has a change of heart or that the child expresses a wish to see him. I don't know, but if I were a child and my father were not around I would feel extremely hurt and perhaps not want to see him.

They do not have contact as she will not let him have her phone number. She will sometimes unblock him on social media to berate him for not paying maintenance, and then block him again. I was initially very dubious about everything to be honest, but the subject has come up around his family members, not discussed in depth or anything and I didn't ask any questions about it, but I have heard bits and pieces that seem to verify his version of events.

It is a very new relationship, but I feel everyone has "baggage", for want of a better word (I know I do!) and I don't really feel like I want to run for the hills just yet (which I feel some posters may tell me to do as it's a lot to take in in a new relationship) as it is otherwise going extremely well, and if people were to write people off in the beginning for having struggles, well, I don't think anyone would be dating me!

I think the reason I am posting is because I feel like if it were my child I would be fighting tooth and nail, even if it meant borrowing, getting into debt, hiring a PI to find them, etc., etc. Is this ever not the case? Why wouldn't it be the case?

I don't WANT to contact his ex. It was put forward as a suggestion and I considered it. I also have not diagnosed mental health problems, I said I thought it could be a possibility when I was asked.

she said if he saw him, his parents weren't allowed to, and then his siblings weren't allowed to, and he had to travel a long way to where they were only (he would have been relying on his family for travel/support etc., and this would have made things very difficult), but wasn't allowed to bring him back for overnights, etc. I think it got to be unworkable.

I'm sorry, but none of those conditions are 'unworkable'. I think about getting into this (obviously horrible and difficult) situation with my own child, and, to a resident parent, his actions seem alien. I can only see DD if I restrict her contact with my siblings and parents? Then that's what happens. I have to travel a long way? Then that's what I do. I don't have my own transport? I sort it out, no matter the cost and inconvenience, because that's the only way to see my kid.

I also disagree with stopping maintenance as a negotiating/practical tactic to getting more contact or your name on the birth certificate. I appreciate it is fucking infuriating to keep paying support for a child you want to see, and from whom you are constantly blocked. But, whatever the parental situation, the child still exists, and must be supported. Again, I can't even imagine devolving all financial responsibility for my own DD, and relying on someone else to manage it.

It sounds like he's had a very rough time (and who knows whose fault it ever was), but also that he's lapsed into regretful passivity. I agree with the others that 'saving for a DNA test/court' is a way to slowly give up without ever really stating that. Pre-kids, I would've been able to deal with this. Now I have DC, it would be a total red flag.

*No because this is always the story and it's very rarely the truth. Usually, he's been abusive. Sometimes he's insisted she needed to have an abortion and walked out. Sometimes he's just a lazy tool who couldn't be arsed to be a father and she's ended the relationship before winding up with two children.

It doesn't cost thousands of pounds to demand a DNA test or apply for a access. It is quite possible to make an appointment at CAB to ask for support filing court papers.

But the real test, the one that proves whether or not he truly wants to support his child is maintenance. Has he been putting money aside every month into an account for the child? He doesn't need contact details to start making arrangements for the child.*

This has really bugged me, despite the poster saying it's rarely the truth. My nephew did all of the above. He complied with every demand the mother made of him. He drove three hours to where she had moved to once a month (the only access she would allow him) only to find that she'd gone out, or would answer the door but not let him see his daughter and slam the door in his face.

He paid a fortune in legal fees, did everything possible, STILL pays maintenance, but hasn't seen his daughter for over four years now.

It's not only men who can be cruel and abusive.

OP I wouldn't be as quick as many on here to condemn him. But I would warn you that he's got a lot of shit ahead of him, caused by his ex, if he wants to maintain contact. And that could put a lot of strain on the relationship. make sure you do the right thing for YOU.

No I wouldn't and I think if you really think about it then you wouldn't either.

Going to court can be done for only a couple of hundred quid or even for free if income dictates it.

He stopped financially supporting his child for what ever reason that is despicable his actions are made worse by the fact that his ridiculous reason for doing so has not even had any action from him.

Ok, so from a male perspective I think you're all jumping to a huge bunch of pretty damning conclusions with very little real evidence one way or the other.

He wasn't allowed to go to the scans, be with her during the pregnancy, be at the birth or see his child afterwards. She moved after a year and basically just seems to have wanted him as a walking wallet.

At what frigging point is he supposed to have been able to bond with his child? To the point where he's going to bankrupt himself to pursue some very expensive legal actions? At the end of which he's likely to get very limited (if any) contact time, which she could thwart just by refusing him his time with dc (leading to absolutely FA consequences for her and getting him no further forward... and broke with it).

I've seen what "Family" court likes to do to dads first hand. Even hands-on ones who've got established relationships and a history of 50:50.

Hint: they shit all over them.

Why would he continue to withhold money for his child? Maintenance and access are completely separate issues and although its unfair and upsetting if she is not allowing him to see his child, he should be paying towards his child's upkeep regardless - kids aren't pay-per-view

No, they're not, but given that FC will do sweet FA about enforcing the pitifully limited contact they begrudgingly dole out in a lot of CAOs, I'm not surprised he's chosen to try and force the issue in this way. Of a very limited range of options open to him, this is his best shot.

Now yes, this guy may be bad news but the evidence you've seen to date, OP would suggest otherwise. Some people (men and women) can fake it for a while, but most will give out warning signs of one sort or another. If this is the only thing that has you worried then I would carry on and see where the relationship goes.

I spent over 10k on court fees and it got me absolutely nowhere in keeping my kids near me and in decent contact. If your DP were to ask me in RL whether he should chuck money at the FC process I'd tell him it's a complete waste of his time and money and that the feeling of complete injustice you'll walk away with won't be worth the stress you'll go through in pursuing it.

It'll leave him broke, broken, and with nothing more than he has right now.

it's obvious isn't it, decent blokes don't accept not seeing their own children until they've exhausted every possible means.

This. It's exactly this that is bothering me.

Bluntness - she didn't tell him until after she's been. They were in different cities at this point as he'd had to move back home. Again, this is what he has told me.

Sorry if I'm missing replying to some people. I am just going home and will come back then. Thank you to everyone.

Thank you for your post especially Pater. I am so sorry for you.

It's not only men who can be cruel and abusive.

Blimey he's been well and truly hung, drawn and quartered by the MN lynch mob hasn't he??

Bluntness and others have decided he must be an abuser, err based on what???? ABSOLUTELY NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER!

Please don't make the mistake OP of letting things become 'real' just because some people keep saying them.

Personally I see nothing alarming in his account of events and his family seem to have confirmed it all. The ExGF would hardly be the first woman to simply want a baby out of a man and then nothing else, no contact, no involvement, 'my baby, no-one else's'.

Whether you continue the relationship or not is, obvs, up to you OP but please don't ditch him because of bizarre,hysterical, reactionary and totally unwarranted accusations.

Some of what he is telling you is not true.
She can not put a fathers name on the birth certificate unless they are married. He would have had to be present when the birth was registered and put it on himself.
Stopping maintenance would never force contact. CSA is concerned with getting maintenance, not contact.
He should never have stopped paying maintenance.
And the fact she blocks him on face book suggests he has been abusive to her at least there.

fathers dont tend to have the same attatchment to children as mothers, can sometimes be a case of out of sight out of mind"

I'm not sure I agree entirely with this. My Ex and I have been separated six years. He adores his children, has them as often as he can when he's not working and even attends with me to hospital visits. He's still a total arsr though sometimes, he's just a total arse that still puts his kids as a priority. If I was to move out of the city, even hundreds of miles away and start being 'difficult' for want of a better word. He'd still move heaven and earth to try and see his kids.

I think you should take his version with a pinch of salt personally OP and I'd be quite cautious. Yes, some mothers can be vindictive and use the child / children as a weapon but in my experience and most of my friends who are single parents, I don't think a Mother stops access without very good reason.
He can represent himself at court, he doesn't have to have legal rep, I once worked in a family court and many parents, both mothers and fathers would represent themselves.

Follow your instinct on this one OP. It's usually right.

Personally, I wouldn't message her either, if it is DV related, you could inadvertently become the 'third party' he's using l to gain access if that makes sense? Even though you would have done so completely innocently.

TheDevil, if this was your nephew though, he could point to all the things he has done to try and maintain contact, and it would be a lot clearer what the situation was for a future partner. I think most people would be sympathetic towards him in his situation.

you see Pater that's all well and good, but if someone was trying to deprive me of seeing my kids, I'd have to take my chances and spend the money, even if I ended up frustrated and brokenhearted at the end. Because I'd have to know I did everything I could, I'd want to be able to show them what I tried when they were adults if I couldn't see them before that. I would not accept advice telling me that on balance it wasn't worth trying. Pater wouldn't you think less of a dad that didn't try what they could even if you suspected they'd get the same outcome as you?

^Some of what he is telling you is not true.
She can not put a fathers name on the birth certificate unless they are married^

My Ex and I weren't married either (got married after). He is still on both the Children's birth certificates.

And I'd echo TheDevilMade in terms of watch out and be aware of what will come if he did go through Court.

My DP had to watch me go through that whole process whilst being even more helpless than I was. It was not easy on her, and I will be eternally grateful that she stuck it all out and supported me regardless.

But it's not something all relationships would survive, so be prepared for what it could do to yours with him.

My husband doesn't see his children, none of the extended family are allowed to either. It's a long story but he's done nothing wrong. It's not as simple as get a court order, they're not worth the paper they're written on. It's impossible to maintain contact with children when one parent is hostile.
If I met him now I don't think Id believe the story.

Perhaps I will suggest my talking to her and see what reaction I get.

That would be really inappropriate. You've seen the nasty messages. Just leave it alone, it's obvious she doesn't want contact.

No I wouldn't.

My ex has zero contact and that's his choice, how his girlfriend can stay with him is beyond me.

Hardly the sign of a decent person.

She can not put a fathers name on the birth certificate unless they are married^

Eh, utter BS.

brasty she went and registered the birth alone. He knew he would need to go with her but she did not tell him. He stopped paying maintenance so the CSA would get involved and he thought he would be able to get a DNA test that way (I guess they must get these things ordered when people are trying to say children aren't theirs?), then he would be able to prove he was the father and go to court.

Bluntness and others have decided he must be an abuser, err based on what??

I'd walk over hot coals to have contact with my child; any parent who doesn't is a failure in my eyes.

You implied the ex had mental health problems and her behaviour was erratic etc

You also said his relationship with her was fairly new and rocky...yet they had a baby together?

If you have doubts about him telling the truth, contacting his ex is not the answer. If you feel he can't be trusted, then don't date him!

No, but I've been the "mum" in this scenario. Another almost identical thread has popped up on here today. I'm unsure how many of these men that are desperate to see their kids actually exist. I'm sure my ex paints himself in exactly the same innocent light, so I'm somewhat jaded and as such can't give an unbiased opinion.

If I had no contact with my child I would be spending all my time working to earn enough to pursue contact through the courts, and pay maintenance and save for the child to show the court, and the child themselves in time, that I was a loving and responsible parent.

So anyone doing substantively less than that - nah. No way would I be interested in a relationship with them. I wouldn't even want to be their friend, TBH.

Quite apart from what it may or may not say about this man and/or his ex that he doesn't have contact with his child (and you may never get to the bottom of what the situation is - there are shitty parents & partners of both sexes), it's worth considering whether you want to be with someone whose previous life and relationships has such a hold over his present situation. Look at all the time and thought you've put into this already - thinking how you could help or advise him, etc. Do you really want to be sucked into this sort of drama if he were to pursue contact? If it does involve a long legal battle?

You're in the early days of a relationship and you already know an enormous amount about the ins and outs of this long-running conflict with his ex. Will your relationship be lived in the shadow of this last one?

Everyone has baggage, and everyone deserves a chance, I agree. But I think the question here may be how much of someone else's baggage you feel willing & able to take on, particularly when you're a parent yourself with your own responsibilities.