Unrealistic expectations of 10 year relationship?

[Penguin82]

Considering ending my 10 year relationship but feeling a bit like I don't have the right to as he isn't abusive, or like I could be over reacting? My parents had an unhappy marriage so not sure that I always know what's normal..
Dp does have lots of good points:

• made sacrifices and moved country to be with me when we met.
• lovely with dd (4) and when he's home he does everything with her. Leaves the hard stuff to me if he can but if I'm not there he does it all.
• happy for me to pursue my own interests. Took care of dd for 2 weeks when I went away a couple years ago
• doesn't cheat, drink heavily, gamble etc

But.... We've (not just me, I know he has too, but maybe mostly me) been unhappy for monthe, perhaps more. This is why I think it is:
*I had a full time but easy job for a couple years so managed to do all cooking cleaning etc easily. Changed jobs 9 months ago to one with more money but more responsibility and so expect him to chip in more. We have a weekly cleaner but I also expect him to do his share of tidying, cooking (it's him that wants the big meals every night), laundry etc. He does pull his weight mostly when he's here but he isn't here much.

• dp has several very time consuming hobbies. 2 team sports and 1 moto sport. Moto sport officially takes 1 day a onto but there is lots of time and money spent on 'tinkering'. Other sports take 3 evenings a week, 1 morning and 1 afternoon eachieve weekend. He also has 2 worm at least 1 evening a week

I feel that the time and money spent on his hobbies means that we have no family life. It's not too bad in the winter but every summer Im home alone most nights, and often my own interests (and even my paid job at times) are expected to come 2nd to his hobbies. We never haduch in common on paper, but always had fun together. The last year or so it's felt like I'm just a housekeeper most of the time and that he only spends time with me and dd when it fits round his hobbies.
I've told him how unhappy I am before, eve wrote him a letter once, and things improve a little but I think it just comes down to the fact that he doesn't want to prioritise time with me over anything g else.

I think you need to question some of the language he uses. So, for example, if he says "I'm giving up two hobbies for you." Then you would question "Are you giving the up for me, or are you stopping your hobbies because you actually prefer to spend the time with me and our child?"

It may seem like a small thing, but if you make him verbalise why he is making changes it can stop resentment and misunderstandings. Obviously if he says he's stopping his hobbies just to keep you from leaving then that's a huge problem as eventually the lure of the thing he prefers (his hobbies) will draw him away from you again. However if he has actually taken stock and thought "why on earth am I spending time on these daft hobbies when I could be spending time with my wife and child, I can't believe I've wasted all thee years." Then you're in a much more positive place and will potentially be able to move forward together.

Good luck.

Yes I was dead set on leaving but saw a flash of the old him/ old us yesterday, and need to see if that's still there. How he worded dropping the hobbies was dropping them so we could spent more time together and get back on track, not as a bargaining chip.
I'm still uncertain. Not sure he quite understands yet how much it's going to take for me to stay. We do need the extra time together but I'm still a bit worried about the money and credit cards he built up (not much he can do about that now apart from not add to them of course). I'm also concerned that it could be too late to get the sort of love and affection, and fun, that we used to have, back.
I don't honestly know if I'm expecting us to work or not. However I'm going to open myself up to the possibility it might, and if not, I'll know I tried.
As for holiday, it's a big trip back to my mums country where we've never been. It needs to happen mid this year for various reasons. Am leaving flight bookings as long as possible to reduce pressure on myself. If things don't work out with us j will go without him.

It may be helpful to find a couple's therapist to help you both discuss things open and honestly. It's an outside perspective that will help validate your feelings until he does get it.

I honestly think you need to give it 12 months at least, change and forgiveness take time. I would book your trip - it's something you can do together both planning and going.

Staying and making things genuinely work isn't weak, it's a challenge and takes probably as much strength as leaving.

I think it's fine to give him some time. He may step up he may not. You seem quite realistic about it. I would try and stick to your time frame.

You may find that once he drops his hobbies you don't have much in common any more.. that's ok.

Seems like a good decision to me too, either way you need to be absolutely sure and whilst it's still possible it could work out one last chance with a small timeframe sounds very reasonable.

No judgement here, you have to try to do what's right for you and hopefully he will change.

I just feel sad as we seem to see such levels of entitlement and selfishness that make marriages hard and our culture seems to encourage people to achieve at solo pursuits irrespective of the impact on family life.I wish society valued family men more than the value placed on keeping fit or achieving this cycle or run time.

Hi I think you are doing the right thing, giving yourself time and also the relationship time.

It's good to reserve judgment and see if it can be worked on, the fact there was/is a spark between you is good (I didn't feel a spark with my ex... I just found him annoying).

Anyway, one thing my ex-husband has said to me is that I don't ask for help, I didn't say no whenever he asked to go anywhere. This always annoyed me, because I suppose I am the type of person to just know it is inappropriate to expect to go to everything, it is inappropriate to want to go to everything, so it would not occur to me to lean on other people to shoulder my responsibilities while I indulged in whatever night out I was invited along to. BUT some people are a little self absorbed and maybe need more guidance....and I suppose if I am to assess my role in our split, then perhaps I went down the nuclear option without too much chat (because I felt as an adult, he should just know, the same way I know my responsibilities as an adult). Anyway I suppose what I am trying to get at is: I think it is good that you are taking your time and not being hasty. You need to be 100% certain that whatever decision you make is the right one for you.

Well, after a good past 4 days where we spent time together, had fun, I let my guard down and relaxed, all was good....
Things aren't great tonight. Dp brought up the trip away for one of his sports, apparently he's not keen to give that 2 week trip up after all, even though he offered to and I accepted as it would mean a shorter trip to my mums country (haven't seen her in 8 years and really want to spend 6 weeks+ in her country as have loads of people to visit). So now dp says he wants to go on a different overseas trip with sport number 2 which would be for 1 week. He cant understand why I would want him to just forget about sports trips and focus on us and our family holiday for once (we've not been on holiday together for 8 years!).
For completion, despite all our arguments/conversations about the £5k credit card debts mainly due to engine rebuilds, dp still wants to get a £1k loan later this year to get his current prole to back on road, he hadn't even considered not doing that.
Basically what I'd feared has happened, dp thinks a couple extra nights at home per week is enough and that he can just carry on making big decisions which affect us all based on what he wants. Meanwhile I'm the nagging shrew just trying to ruin his fun
Fuck this. I'm not interested in playing that role or being put second best. Unfortunately when we were arguing last week and looked into places for him to stay there wasn't either anything cheap to rent or a mate with a spare room available. I do live in the worst place ever to find accommodation so things are going to be difficult.
I feel rejected all over again. He's at a sports practise now (of course! ) but can't imagine what he could say or do when he gets home to make things ok. Shame. The last few days were nice.

Quelle fucking surprise.
I'm sorry he hasn't changed as you were hoping but at least you know now rather than limping along for another few months or even years.
He needs to move out, and tbh where he moves to is his bloody problem.
I hope you're sleeping in separate rooms now?
He is such a twat btw. You deserve better than him.

The only chance of salvaging it would through decent couples therapy. However, it seems on the surface he doesn't get it and fundamentally doesn't want to prioritise his family.

Sorry to hear that Penguin. I know how disappointing that feels. Just keep observing and working towards a decision when you're ready.

Dd (4years old) has been really clingy recentre. Think things are affecting her now. If she's going to have more upheaval I'd like to get it over with quickly

Just read your whole thread penguin, sorry it didn't work out the way you had hoped. It does just seem as if he was throwing you some tidbits to keep his easy life . Wasn't it funny though that it was only when you actively said you were moving out of the bedroom that he decided to give you some tidbits at all

I completely recognise your feelings of being left out. Ex-p and I separated a couple of years ago after 20yrs together, in no small part due to him just seeing me as his facilitator. It makes you feel like shit and so unimportant, it totally grinds away at any feelings of partnership. I knew that it was time to end things when I started fantasising about him having an affair just so I could throw him out!

Best of luck with whatever transpires from here on in. Ex-p and I remain on good terms, we have the children 50/50 and ex-p has had his eyes opened to how much I was propping up his lifestyle.

It was inevitable OP. You knew, we all knew how it would turn out.

You gave it one last shot. You can move on with a clarity.

DH and has work on the basis of thirds in terms of time.

1/3 is his time, 1/3 is my time, 1/3 family/us time. We don't tend to use up our own 1/3 so that gives more family/us time.

If either of us didn't want to divide in this way so we had equality with each other as well as good investment in us as a couple and family then there would be something very wrong, as there is with your relationship/family. You and the kids aren't as valued by him as his hobbies and friends.

We have equal disposable income in seperate individual current accounts so that money is ours to spend/save as we see fit with no need for discussion. If it's not in our account, we don't spend it and we certainly don't get loans or run up credit cards, I don't have one (although fucked up re expenses for work costing him interest which I made very clear my feelings on!).

Yeah this is it for me now. I just feel deflated and emotionally a bit feeble tonight! Don't have the strength for a dramatic showdown this evening, especially as there is nowhere for him to go right now anyway.

In which case you need to work out how to separate fully whilst remaining in your home. You do no chores or meals for him, both go halves on running the house and both go halves on being lead parent 50% of the time.

You don't need a show down. Just a quiet 'that's it'. And to leave the room if he goes off on one.

Do you think the hobbies are a cover for another woman? His response to breaking up was very calm but I suspect he knew he could 'drop' a few hobbies for a few weeks and you'd be back on track. His attitude to these hobbies is just plain weird for a grown man with responsibilities. It's so much more than the time together, which is so important but the money and lack of family holidays, he SO selfish. Let him figure out where he's going to live and stay in the spare room. He probably put some effort in as he soon realised that if you split up he'd actually have to drop his hobbies to look after his child, his priorities are elsewhere its time to separate. Good luck.

Given that he's running up debts and intends to keep doing so, would it be prudent to inform your banks etc that you have officially separated ASAP, so that his future debts don't suddently become yours?

He's not changed his spots, and nor is he ever likely to. A quick separation seems to be the best option for you and your DC. The sooner it happens, the sooner you can all start to heal and move on with your lives.

it doesn't sound as though he gets it at all, sad for you that this has happened, he seems to be trying to manage you by giving you just enough attention. I suppose he fundamentally doesn't get that there is anything wrong with your relationship. I don't know whether it's worth trying some last ditch counselling to try and get your point across? It must feel like pushing sand uphill though.

Thanks everyone I feel like I have some real allies here. Also have some real life friends who know what's going on and support me. I hate what he's trying to turn me into - I'm not the nagging woman who doesn't want partner to have fun! I've supported him in so much including several overseas trips. I won't have him portray me like this. If I was with any other man they would find me pretty easy going and keen on having separate interests, can't imagine dp moving on to find a woman who would put up with his crap.
Anyway, I'm currently working on actively extracting myself from this situation. I am logical and a planner, also have a demanding career as well as dd so cannot cope with the drama of a big showdown and turfing him out knowing he has nowhere.
I need to do things my way. Am currently looking into housing options for one of us (probably him) for a few months while house sells. I am also getting the balances of various loans etc that we have from bank so I can plan how best to organise finances. Dp will do what I say on that score, he's used to me organising his life after all! I will find things easier to deal with if it's all done this way. Next job is making it all happen as quickly as possible.
I will update.

Let's up that he doesn't go on to have another child he doesn't want to make time for

Just ridiculous isn't it that he isn't even responsible enough to not increase the debt for his bl**dy hobbies!

You sound determined and on the case, OP, which is great. Stay strong and remember we're cheering you on!