The ignoring.....not so gaaaaa (part 2)

[FV45]

So ex finally left the home yesterday.
Slept ok and atmosphere in home is much lighter.

Residency issues are ongoing. As it stands I don't know what's happening at the weekend.

I am collecting DS2 from after school club and taking him to school tomorrow. Ex collecting from school. Ex won't discuss timings for me to collect DS2 from him on Saturday morning. Suspect he plans to drop him here at his convenience.

Am seeing sol and going to meditation MIAM soon with view to court so not sure what I can do until then, aside from log everything.

If he can find someone to talk to it would be good. For us it was our amazing gp. The girls would tell her stuff that they couldn't tell me because they didn't want to hurt/worry me. And she would tell me if I needed to take it further or not. It was a great process. But it did take years to find a process/person that worked for us. They were just 2&3 at divorce. My eldest at 13 is very good at this now. She's really come into her own (she wants to be an international children's lawyer).

It is so difficult for you. Perhaps between now and then DS2 will realise that if he wants a change then it would help him if he were able to express his feelings.

I thought at the time that his saying about living at Dads was a knee jerk reaction to not liking the to and fro.

Interesting his Dad asking him if he’s happy, is he picking up on something or is he digging for dirt. Apart from ex not listening and being pushy to get his own way is there anything else ex does? Does he bad mouth you for example?

I hope you manage to organise Christmas, once you get started it will come together, do a list and tick off.

Hope DS2 is ok today.

for you FV. Hope DS2 is feeling better this morning. Any time you feel like a chat about work stuff to take your mind off, PM me. Would love to hear more about your new job.

Thanks all.

Difficult morning.

DS slept with me and then woke really early, worrying. He's only had about 7hrs sleep.
I just let the morning carry on w/o raising the issue and got on with my work while he played. Crunch time and he became very upset.
Said I can't physically force him in car, but we can't just not tell his Dad. I txt ex to tell him DS was refusing. He just said 'stick to arrangements'. Told him DS wouldn't get in car. Ex said he'd come and get him so have him ready.

Called loads of people to see if anyone was free to come over for support. No one was, though there are people about in my road so a yell would be responded to. Called WA (voice mail). Calmed myself down and sorted myself and DS out.

Ex arrived and I saw DS visibly tense and change. It was like a switch - he just accepted that it was happening. I feel numb now.

He's written some things down that he wanted to ask his Dad to change, but then backed down. I'll keep it as evidence:
Let him go to bed earlier, not make him watch scary films, not go on such long bike rides, not have the same meal every day.

I have told him that I understand why he tells his Dad he's happy there and then Dad tells me that's all fine.

Meanwhile I had a missed call at 4am from DS1 who was at an all night party. Wasn't unduly worried until about 10am when I couldn't contact him, but he did finally answer his phone and say he was OK.

cracks open the Twiglets and Babycham

Ok i think this does need you to step in. I'd ring him today and get it over with.

At this stage I rang my ex and said I know what the problem is but you have to promise there won't be a back lash. He did, so I told him. However he then smacked her and lost it so that blew what trust she had left in him. But it was a step in the process and she was 4ish at the time.

On another occasion I did it by email - it was about one of his mates who made them uncomfortable and that time he did listen. Initially very angry but did stop having friend round when they were there.

No guarantee it'll change anything. Possibly a bit of a box ticking exercise for you conscience but it is part of the process.

Was there any evidence to ex that DS2 was reluctant to go? Or does he still think it’s all you?

I agree that it’s worth trying to discuss it with ex. Personally I would choose via email. We can all help you with it as it is hard when your emotions are running wild.

Talk to DS2 and explain that unless you both try to explain to ex how DS2 is feeling then nothing will change and that everyone will end up miserable. He does still want to see his Dad so really expressing his feelings is the only way forward. Just need to find a method you can both cope with. If Dad is arsey with it then you will both know that you only have two choices, DS2 has to cope with it or you go to court.

If you were to write to ex then I suggest opening with how you are trying to help and hope that you can both discuss it like two caring parents.

But first just enjoy Christmas with your boys. When is DS1 home? Gosh you must have been worried when you couldn’t reach him. Does he have plans to see Dad?

I have no advice on how to deal with that horrid man but you did what you could for DS. I agree about emailing Ex with DS issues and keep a record for the next court case more

What DS2 wrote on a worksheet from a football coaching day. Wonder if his coach saw.

Going ok here. Ex being a twat changing plans but I can handle that as long as DSs are ok.

How was Christmas Day?

That’s quite funny and sad at the same time.

You should reply to ex, ‘stop making trouble, stick to the arrangements’ lol

Crikey...had an MN hoo haa. Had to delete my account for reasons I don't want to go into (independent of this thread) and now can't get FV45 back as a user name.

Anyway, I've had a very up and down time which is to be expected at this time of year I think.

A quieter day today and I plan to compose my email to ex detailing the concerns I have for DS2 and my suggestions.

Will you help me?

I always miss the hoo haa.

Yes of course we will. How has DS2 been?

It was an entirely self-imposed hoo haa - a note to self that unhinged people should stay away from social media. Luckily MNHQ used their Xmas spirit and sorted it out.

DS2 currently sitting next to me in bed playing some premier league fantasy thing on the iPad. We are having a pyjama day - until 10am! Was going to run first thing but it's pissing down so I shall run much later, when it's just dark and icy!

Mostly DS has been OK. It's been better having DS1 here as they were over at ex's on Boxing Day together. We've had some lovely days with family (mine and ex's, who ex doesn't see at all - our relationship with ex's family has strengthen now that ex doesn't stand in the way).

Alongside that though he's had his struggles getting to sleep the evening before he goes off to his Dad's. Worrying about cycling in this awful weather, worrying about telling his Dad as much and getting told off etc. He's been sad on a couple of days when family have been over here and he's had to go to ex's and ex has refused to show any flexibility.

I just told DS I was going to email his Dad and he got very worried, saying Dad will tell him off. I explained that the courts need to see that his parents are working together and putting his needs first (ha ha ha) and that the courts will listen if Dad tells him off. Maybe I'm telling him too much? I guess I don't want him to think I'm going against his wishes and that some of this is out of my hands as well.

He's off to his Dad's later and I'm helping at the food bank, then I'll come back and start the email, then go for a run. I am looking forward to a more calm day. As you can imagine, my ED has been a big struggle for me over Xmas.

I do think you need to tell DS this sort of thing, he needs to know you will do everything you can to help but your hands are tied by the courts and his refusal to speak up

Just a hand hold, I'm shit at advice.

I agree, you need to be up front with DS2.

I suggest you don’t send the email whilst DS2 is with his Dad but you can certainly work on a draft.

I know this will be stressful and unpleasant for you but it is the right way to go about it, I wouldn’t hold my breath that he will take anything on board but at least you tried... the courts will see that you have tried.

I certainly would encourage DS to say, if he wishes, "I'm not going cycling., it's too far, it's too cold, I know you love it but I don't."
He is being forced to do it, because his father wants to do it. His father can do it when DS is not there.
DS IS ALLOWED TO BE HEARD, in reality, what is this man going to do, if boy won't pedal, is he going to hurt him ?

I know they don't want to make him angry, but they are being bullied & it makes my heart break.
Could he say "they have been told at school, that no one should be forced or coerced, its bullying"......

I think your need to be a bit more clear about it. If DD1 hadn't been brave enough to speak up to the police Andy's judge nothing would have changed. DD2 refused to allow any record of what she said.

Explain the reality of the situation. Say how you feel. What you would like. What are limitations for you. Then he is making an informed choice.

mix it's really not that straight forward. DS2 is scared to stand up to his dad (as was I, a grown woman). I have advised him to tell his dad how he feels, and he's told me he tries but Dad doesn't listen or gets angry or ignores him. He's only 8 years old.

I didn't start the email yesterday and now I feel bad and like I'm letting DS down. I am such a terrible procrastinator.

No, I said you should take your time anyway. Did DS2 go off to his Dads ok? How is DS1?

I agree you should be open with DS2 without alarming him, explain that you will do your best to resolve this for him but that you do need to repeat what he has said in order to explain why a change is needed. Remind him that if it comes to court that he won’t have to go there (you know how kids minds work).

Is DS1 aware? Has he witnessed anything?

Thanks.
He was ok going to ex's on Friday. And they didn't cycle that day....gasp!
He's with me now (tucked up in premier inn!).

I have told DS1 certain things but haven't asked him directly, I think that would put him in a difficult position. I will think though. He's seeing the manifestation of me being low on tolerance/resistance at the moment; so a frank talk might be useful.

Oh and thanks for suggesting I point out to DS he won't need to go to court!!

He hasn't talked about me sending/not sending email this past couple of days. He's been extra cuddly with me though.

They didn’t cycle? Wow! Perhaps even though he wouldn’t acknowledge it with you he has taken on board whether DS2 is happy. Am I hoping for a Christmas miracle here?

It’s probably hard to find a balance between DS1 understanding and bad mouthing his Dad. You must do what feels right for you, personally I think I would want to explain the struggles with DS2 and how difficult it is to communicate with their Dad. I don’t know if Dad would ever ask DS1 but if he did at least he could answer that he was aware. Or I guess you could simply ask DS1 if DS2 has said anything to him.

They didn't cycle Tuesday just gone either.
Their house mates have been away abroad for a few weeks and this seems to make quite a difference to DS2's happiness.
He did get very anxious when I said something about collecting times (can't remember now) and I had to reassure him many times. My sister noticed how snuggly (not clingy, but very close) he was with me over our mini break. That's OK, I can give him that if he needs it.

I haven't talked to DS1 at all about it- I don't know, we have such a good relationship and I don't want to change that. I know he's an adult but he's still my son.

Ex took DS to school on a non-pupil day....the irony!

I have not started the email. I am scared. Not so much of what I want to say, but how it puts me right back in the position of him playing games with replying/ignoring/replying but not really (e.g. "maybe" or "I can't think about that now").

I think I acknowledged this today as I heard (well, actually I called them up and said waiting until end of Jan was making things worse) that I've been assigned someone for CBT and this has allowed me to open my mind a bit again and let the bad thoughts/memories in, rather than just bury them as I have been since my last crappy psych appt.

I haven't done this sort of communication with him since I first proposed contact arrangements in summer 2016, which he agreed to and then completely disregarded..and then we went to court.
It's also reminiscent of how I delayed and delayed sending the divorce papers to him.

I have no idea how long I will need to wait for the CBT to start.

It's been so lovely having DS1 back from uni, but he's ready to head back now and while I will miss him, I think me and DS2 do benefit from it being just the two of us at the moment.