Daughter returning to abusive ex. Advice please!

[punchintheguts]

24 yrs ago my dd married a narcissistic abuser.dd was first attacked on honeymoon, and went downhill from there.
*he refused to work, my dd was breadwinner.
*he had numerous affairs which he threw in her face, even one with a family member. he completely isolated dd, only "allowing" her to mix with his parents.
*he tormented me for money.
*dd arrived crying, saying her said he would kill her if she left him, which was what she wanted to do, just 4 years into the marriage.

• then he told me in person he would kill dd if she ever left him. *he deleted phone messages/emails/texts from me, isolating her further. *She lost her legal career due to his financial abuse. *I made a 4 page statement to the domestic violence unit, but when they contacted dd, she said she was "okay"(then proceeded to become angry with me for reporting it) *then they emigrated abroad, him on a work visa as dd was in the middle of a bankruptcy" *his "work" lasted just one week, my dd was reduced to being an illegal cleaner to get by to support the "family" home and children. *he eventually threw dd out by the throat (her ds tried to protect her but took a beating himself)and moved his new GF in. *dd rang me in desperation, I immediately went to support her, paid the deposit for a home for her and the children.(needless to say he paid not one penny in support/maintenance) *eventually dd managed to establish a successful business and support herself and the children. *we secured her house with locks and chains on doors as he was still threatening her for money and turning up with new gf.. *eventually it all became to much for dd, and she took the children, left her house and came back to the uk, and "hid" in a rented house where she thought she would be safe. *he would constantly ring me threatening to kill dd, but my GD heard him, contacted him on facebook to "leave nan alone ".he laughed at her, told her in writing he would come to her place of work and give her a good hiding, and to mind her own business. *he found her in the rented house, attacked her sibling who was trying to support her. *eventually she returned back abroad , and life carried on. he followed her, but was eventually deported back to the uk, and there was peace for dd. *he financially abused a widow he found on a dating site, she found my number on his phone and rang me in a terrified state. *he then managed to convince his ex gf to marry him and went back to the country, and the abuse began for my dd. *my dd/me and the children lived in fear of his next move, but dd did her best, supported the family home and children. *eventually dd met a lovely divorced man, who adores her. he is the totally opposite of her monstrous abusive ex. *I had a police marker on my home, I was terrified he would turn up and cause turmoil. *through the middle of this I suffered a stroke, the constant worry and fear of what would happen next. *he has a son by his first marriage who is virtually nc with him. his father died recently, his dm is elderly, basically he is alone now. *his dsis in nc, she suffered for years at his hands. *he has a gf of 3 years. why am I explaining what He is doing?

I was so happy last night .She told me she was returning to the uk after all the years away

I am in my mid 70's now, and miss her and the grandchildren so much.
Then she dropped the bombshell.
SHE IS COMING BACK TO THE UK, TO BE WITH THE EX HUSBAND TO LIVE TOGETHER AS A FAMILY.
I felt my stomach in the old familiar churning.
I told her she is going back in the lions den.
A leopard doesn't change it's spots.
Why, after the years of misery, fear, and turmoil?
She "explained" that even though her partner, who would "do anything for her", the adult children won't have the same relationship with him as they would with their real(abusive dangerous) father.
I tried to remind her about the cunning/manipulative devious violent verbal and physical events over the last two decades, but her reply was
"He Has Changed Mum".
I said even though he tried to destroy our relationship he never managed to completely break it, but be sure I don't ever want any contact with him again.
She said it will be lovely to have Christmas's together as a family.
I replied "count me out" I can't go through the disastrous events again.
She replied, if it all starts up again she will leave straightaway.

Am I wrong?
Forgive and forget?
I can't do that.
advice please.

just need a bit of support today.
more chemotherapy today, but last night was terrible.
hardly slept, I kept re living the onslaught from dd and her toxic abusive partner on probably the worst day of my life while waiting to hear how bad the cancer is.
the abuse we received not only from dd's boyfriend but that she actually supported him, shouting in my face when I was in such a terrible place, and both of them storming out together, not even a "goodbye mum" from her.

it keeps coming into my head.
they had only been here for 72 hours, yet the explosion is still a recurring nightmare of disbelief.
there has been no contact, true to form dd is getting on with her life, totally unaware, or care, of the chaos she leaves behind her.
I am tired today, so maybe a bit vulnerable.
guess I just want her to say, i'm sorry mum, or something similar, but all through the decades she has created so much trouble, yet no remorse for the trail of misery she leaves behind.
I know this is a wobble, and tomorrow will be better.

just to say, thinking of you heardit. She betrayed you.

I hope you have been able to look after yourself.

is there anyone irl you can talk to about this?

how are you physically?

thank you seaeagle.
I spoke to my ds yesterday, he understands completely as he lived with her for 3 years.
he asked if dd said she was "sorry" about the hell she put us through would it bring closure?
But I would never trust/believe her ever again.

So I accept that my dd, of 53 years old must be put away from my heart, which is so hard, but she promised she would never put me thorough this hell again, but with combined forces of her latest toxic partner it only took less than 72 hours.
She is repeating her pattern of behaviour over the years with her previous ex.
the fact that I have had major surgery, with the cancer spreading to liver/lungs, didn't make her support me, beyond belief!

ds has been so kind and supportive, along with dh.
physically am reasonable today, exhausted but still standing!

I was always there for dd, through all her disastrous lifestyle choices, never asking for anything back, yet the one time I could have appreciated her kindness, it never came.

dd has no support system here in the uk to come back to.

my dsis,/ friends/ her aunt and cousins are disgusted with her abuse of me at a time like this, they have turned their backs on her, which oddly makes me sad, but her choices I guess.

please keep me strong today.
The last few weeks have been very difficult, both physically and emotionally.
but, my dh and ds have provided a calm and peaceful environment for me.
I am coping well with treatment, good days and not so good days.
but.
this is the but I need support for.
yesterday we had an appointment with the surgeon, waiting to hear which way our future lies.
it was inconclusive, and there will be another meeting Thursday, where possible future treatment/surgery or nothing, will be decided upon.
of course it spent our heads spinning, the uncertainty of it, but we dealt well.
as I closed down my internet last night, there was an email from (d)d.
saying, "she loves me, and how did my appointment go?
Just seeing her email address shook me physically.
it is as though the recent onslaught and abuse never happened.
I don't want to hear from her.
I don't want to see her.
the last 30 years have been hell from her, one drama to crisis ongoing.
how can I tell my ds not to tell her re the appts and my health situation?
she bullies him, and maybe can't find a way to tell her to back off.
I am panicking as apparently her, and the toxic boyfriend are returning to the uk next week, and the last thing I want/need is them turning up on the doorstep.
I have quite clearly told them in march, not to contact me, but leave me in peace, but as bullies I know they will take no notice of my needs.
I don't want to put my ds under pressure but we just can't take another onslaught at this difficult time.
how can I deal with this please

I'm so sorry you are still going through all of this.
I would ask your DS to tell her and dick-head of a partner to not visit you.
Not contact you at all.
If they do, you will call the police.
I'd give the police a call on 101 and just get some advice from them before they arrive so you are prepared.
How long are they in the UK for?
Could you go and have a week away somewhere?

well, once they left in march, after the awful threats etc, I told them both I didn't want any future contact as I am so frail.
but simply received further abuse via email fro her aggressive "friend" even to calling me lower than a creepy beetle!

but since then they have both kept quiet, until last night.
s I spent a very distressing night, when I heard they are back in the uk next week.

I am not trying to "punish" dd,for not wanting contact, but for so many decades she has behaved in the most fearful way towards me, yet each time I picked up the pieces, but this time I am too poorly.

(she was even prepared for me to go to prison on her behalf when she was accused of a massive fraud)

there is no way I could go away, I have a picc line and further appts this week.

but I fear ds is caught in the middle as dd keeps emailing him for information.
ds was a witness to the abuse in march and is totally aware of his siblings bullying and aggression over the years.

I just don't feel it is "right" to say to him I don't want him to respond when dd contacts him for information.

I did consider speaking to the police, as I couldn't bear to see them both at the front door , despite being told not to attempt further contact, ever.

historically dd has caused great distress to us, over 30 years, then after a short time, she puts it in it's compartment and it's "back to normal".
how do I tell her again, just leave us alone?

I think you need to tell your son to pass no or the minimum info on. heardit, this is such a difficult time for you and I think you need to lean on him and ask for him to support you. It's clear it will be hard for him so maybe he won't be able to keep everything quiet, but you can legitimately ask.

I also think that you can legitimately ask your husband to deal with them from now on. Set up automatic mail forwarding to him. Block her from your phone. This is harsh, but I do not think she leaves you any choice. You need rest and peace now, not her partner and her.

It may be a good idea to speak to the police too. It's obviously not an emergency now but you can get advice from them. If you have told her clearly to leave you alone and she -still- gets in contact it is harassment and the police can step in. Hopefully in this situation they'd do that sooner rather than later.

If they do turn up on your doorstep the best thing is to let your husband deal with them. Given the sound of him, could he resort to pushing / shoving? If so then think ahead of time about ringing the police on 999 if they do come.

Sadly I don't think the mental stress can completely go away :( But if you plan how to handle them it might lessen the sense of powerlessness.

I do hope they stay away and wishing you strength.

Oh my poor love.

I agree with the others, you absolutely do need someone else to take this horrendous pair out of your life.
Your DS will be ok with dealing with this.

Yes you can ask him not to pass on any info about you, your H

You do have to block all ways she has of poisoning your world.

i have endured 11 sessions of chemotherapy, but it has been stopped until january as it has made me very poorly and frail.
but fortunately the cancer in my lungs has been considerably reduced, so it has been worth it.

DS told me today that dd is returning to the uk next week with the abusive partner.
he also said that dd emailed him, to ask me if i will talk to her?
i am afraid to bring dd back into my life as i am still so vulnerable.

It is often said on here that "No" is a complete sentence. You have done so well with your health. Please don't jeopardise your future recovery by bringing back the poisonous pair into your life. She has bullied ypu for too long. She will never be the daughter you long for. Cut her out. Look after you.

PM'd you, heard

yes, it is true, dd has always bullied/manipulated me most of her adult life.
my boundaries haven't been strong enough, that's for sure.
my dh and ds are caring for me completely, for that i am grateful for.

but it is so hard to refuse contact with dd, when she is pleading for it.

i know i would be a total idiot to allow even any verbal contact, especially after the horrendous threats and abuse from the "partner" at the worst time of my life, which dd went along with and made no effort to protect neither myself or dh.

in some strange way i actually feel sadness for dd, as she constantly makes mess after mess of her life, despite having a good brain, but totally lacking common sense.

when ds said dd emailed him yesterday asking him to ask me if i will talk to her, immediately i replied no, that i have to attempt to regain my strength after the last year of serious health issues.

i guess i already know the answer , i must protect myself from becoming embroiled in this again, i hardly slept last night with the events spinning round my head.
i must remain in my bubble.

No, do not meet/talk with your dd. She has behaved abominably towards you, especially the last time she set foot in your home (your sanctuary) with the boyfriend. She is in her fifties, old enough and intelligent enough to realise what she has done/is doing to you. She has to realise that there are consequences to behaving like this. This has gone on for years - no more!!

Can your health, heart and mind afford to talk to her, and to be crushed again when you see that she has not changed at all? You have too much on your plate at the moment to be dealing with dd and possibly the "beetle" boyfriend. Look at how you felt when you saw an email from her. I really don't think it is a good idea to speak to her right now. I can guarantee that she has not become all heart and love, there will be an ulterior motive to wanting contact with you. I hope both your and your dh's wills are as watertight as a duck's behind!

You are a bloody strong woman to have put up with what you have. Please, please focus on yourself now, with your lovely dh by your side.

thank you, your replies have strengthened my resolve.

today i had the picc line removed, as the chemotherapy will begin again in december.
i will protect myself from dd and any poison that will attempt to infiltrate our bubble.

sadly, dd has chosen/replicated her abusive relationship with one exactly identical to her ex.

last night it kept me awake, wondering if refusing to have any contact was selfish , but i imagined the scenario if i met dd face to face.

she would cry for sure.

the abuse dh endured for decades, from not only her ,but also the ex and current abuser has finally caused dh to say , never again, i never want to see her again.

for decades ,at each drama/crisis, dh was by my side to pick up her pieces, yet she turns nasty within a second .

(but without a manipulative, cunning abuser behind her, she is loving!?)
why, just why is she so weak that she needs/ wants a man to take over her life?

in my opening post i wrote that " dd met a lovely divorced man who adores her, who is the totally the opposite of her monstrous abusive ex," how wrong i was, he is even worse.

it only took a couple of days once they arrived in the uk, before the threats and abuse began.

last night it kept me awake, wondering if refusing to have any contact was selfish

I'm not sure it helps in your situation to think in terms of selfish or unselfish.

However there's being selfish and then there is taking right and proper, legitimate care of yourself. At this point it's very clear that you are taking right and proper care of yourself.

Sometimes, when things become extreme, it becomes a choice of withdrawing somewhat to legitimately protect yourself or bleeding your energy and life out giving to someone who will soak it all up and not actually benefit from it anyway.

even though dd is/has always been "strong", to the point of ruthless, underneath she is inadequate and totally lives on her nerves, and has been on anti depressants for years.
a couple of days ago, DS, who has been amazing through the last difficult months.
incidents spring to mind (when i had an accidenttly pranged dd's car with mine.
the next minute i heard an odd sound and dd was attacking her car with a hammer, because her boyfriend at the time told her to, so they could get a full respray via the insurers.
all her adult life she has behaved as she was instructed to by a boyfriend/husband/partner.
it is a destructive pattern repeating itself constantly.

but a couple of days ago, DS was very quiet and withdrawn.
he said he was okay, but i thought perhaps it was due to my ill health.

but yesterday he said, out of earshot of dh, that his sister has contacted him, asking why i won't talk to her, she doesn't understand why!!!!!
i explained that dh was mortified at their behaviour .

the physical threats, the inheritance issues,on probably literally the worst day of my life, (the appt with oncology after the result of the last scan which would finally be conclusive how far the cancer had spread)
ending with dd and her latest abuser storming out of our home, and leaving the uk.
but dd has told DS she is moving back to the uk with abuser2, and is putting pressure on DS to meet/talk with me.
i have been completely transparent with dd, explaining why i refuse contact since march, but it won't sink in.

i have been with dh for 30 years, trust him completely, he has never caused any issues, ever, is loyal, supportive and always stood by me when family problems mainly to do with dd arose.

DS is coming today, hopefully he will be calmer once he has explained to his sibling the facts.
he experienced low level abuse himself from dd's abuser, and having heard/seen what we endured from him, doesn't want any contact again.
it is such a mess.
i am afraid it will drag me down again, i have further gruelling treatment again soon, and just wish everyone were happy and "normal"

heardit, I hope you are okay

Have you considered taking out some form of injunction to keep her away from you and not allowed to contact you?

realistically i don't think dd , or specifically her abuser will make contact, though they are back in the uk this week.

i guess it's basically accepting dd will never be the daughter i would want her to be.
even during her bankruptcy, she attempted to bully me into an action that could have led me to be imprisoned, but she still wanted me to do it (but i refused thankfully)
there is another thread today about an estranged daughter and i read the replies with interest.

i truthfully can say i spent decades picking up dd's pieces of the train wreck of her life.
dd would go nc for weeks or months,under the influence of a partner, but when the s...t hit the fan she would come running, so i guess i was an enabler.

she was an experienced lawyer with her own firm, yet allowed whatever partner she was with to destroy her, then came running back to me.
i walked on eggshells around her, advised her ( i had my own businesses)yet she only listened/acted to appease her partner who obviously had a hidden agenda.
this pattern has repeated her whole life, right to this day.

it's just so hard to erase her from my life,( which i have) but for my emotional and physical health it is the only protection i can think of.

i do feel so sad for her.

she promised she would never allow a partner to ever abuse me again, yet it happened quicker than i thought possible.

the type of man she is drawn towards obviously feels threatened by our relationship in the past, and their first objective was to break the relationship up.

i must remain strong, not least of all for further cancer treatment due soon.
just wish she was kind, caring, thoughtful and whatever else i would wish for

I know
I know
I know
what I must continue doing.

ds was very withdrawn yesterday.

eventually he said dd had contacted him, asking him to say, "she misses me and loves me"

dd is now living back in the uk with her latest abuser.
ds said it won't last for sure, but wanted to know how he should respond.

I replied I am actually afraid of contact as dd's pattern of behaviour for decades has always, without exception caused us distress.
I can't see it any different now, also she is still with the same person who abused us in march.
I know I must keep her away, but it is so difficult today.

ds said he will tell her that not to ask him to pass on any more messages regarding contact, but I am heart broken that our relationship has ended this way.
my chemotherapy has been temporarily stopped as it was taking it's toll on me, but will resume in December.

at the moment I am becoming stronger by the day, but just wish dd had protected and supported us at the worst day, literally of my life.
I thought about emailing her, simply to say maybe in the future we can talk.
dh who has been wonderful since the diagnosis, surgery and treatment since last year,is also afraid that allowing dd back in, would put me back healthwise.

I know I must prevent contact, but I am torn between protecting myself and trying to make dd understand I don't hate her, but hate her ruthless and manipulative behaviour over the decades.

also, I feel disloyal to dh as he bore the brunt of the abuse in march, the threats of violence and verbal abuse from dd's "partner" ( a stranger to us) and the way dd "joined in"

She does understand.
She KNOWS the issues she causes.
She chooses to do them.
She's been doing it for decades.
Nothing you say now will make her 'wake up' to this and you know it.
Keep gaining strength.
And keep yourself and your DH away from the drama and pressure and pure madness of your DD.
You need calm and peace and you will NOT get that if you allow DD back into your life.
You are doing the right thing.

thank you, so true hellsbellsmelons, I am just having a wobble today.

ds is of the opinion, as he experienced a dose of the abusers toxic attack while he was living with dd, that the relationship won't last and end up in yet another drama, which we can't be dragged into yet again.

so, I must strengthen our little bubble, keep as calm as I can, and just hope that dd will find peace somehow in her life.
I will focus on the good people in my life, dh, dsis, ds, and kind friends.

just sometimes need reassurance that I am not exaggerating or making a mountain out of a molehill where dd is concerned.

dh has always said dd is nothing like me in any way at all.

must put it to the back of my mind, lock the compartment and enjoy the beautiful day!