Am I just the 'OW' and don't realise it?

[kathymyskies]

I'm a first time poster and could do with some advice. From reading MN I think I'm opening myself up to a lot of criticism, but maybe I need that, I don't know.

I'm 29. I've been seeing a man who is 52 for the last 10 months. We meet every lunch time (work in different places but same city). We go home together, sometimes meet for breakfast, have dinner or coffee every evening. We've never had sex but have been intimate. We love each other. He's married but hasn't been intimate with his wife for 7 years and sleep in different parts to the house on his wife's request. I'm a secret because of his two kids. In a year, his youngest goes to university and him and his wife have already discussed splitting at that point and are together for the kids.

I have had a blunt conversation with him about 'us.' What we are etc. He said he'd marry me but couldn't give me what I wanted, and that if I was happy with having maybe 15 'good' years with him, then he'd be with me. He also says if I ever want to stop meeting and spending time together, he will accept that instantly but will always be there for me.

I feel so confused. He claims to not want to be open about us because of his kids and that his wife wouldnt obviously stay living with him if she knew he was seeing me..which would then disrupt the kids. He says in a year it will change. I then ask why would she care if you both say the marriage has been over for 7 years anyway? I've said to him that anyone would tell me that he was taking me for a ride. He then shows me texts and so on that prove his points (they could be fake but i don't believe they are as the first time we had the chat he got his phone out to show me so couldnt have prepared them).

I also feel confused because i would hands down marry him in weeks were the situation different and he was younger. I've been on dates since I started seeing him, mainly because there's no real future with him. But I love this man and it sounds like such a cliche I know.

Feel confused as to how to handle the whole thing and it;s come to a head this morning when I just knew I needed some advice. Please help me get my head together on this...I'm such a strong, decisive person in other areas of life!

Look and listen very carefully at the discrepancies between his words and his actions, and sum up for yourself. Sorry, but words are cheap and in my experience, actual actions mean more. The more you pay attention, the more you will realise that the 2 are not in sync, which is at the very least confusing and disorientating.

Also...I haven't met very many men (knowingly) who haven't had sex in 7 years and would then willingly hold off so long with someone they professed to love forever and beyond all doubt and reasoning. A bit crude maybe, but still.

Reach out to your friends OP. Organise some nights out. Take up something new, skydiving? running? book/poetry club? whatever you fancy... just get out there and start new things.

But you have to be absolutely rigid and firm about no contact. NONE. Otherwise he'll wheedle his way back, he is an arch manipulator.

And, I think you should do some counselling to improve your self confidence and self esteem. It's very worrying that you have accepted such a bullshitting, selfish, manipulative, liar in your life. You deserve soooo much better. You really do.

Whenever a man tells you he is separated, your next question should be, "Does your wife know you are separated?" If they answer, "Yes" then ask him for her number so you can call the wife to confirm.

You will be amazed how many married men represent themselves as "separated" when they are nothing of the sort. Confirm this at the very beginning, right after you've bumped into them, had the coffee, started flirting. Because it's these married guys telling you they are "separated" that gives you a green light to move forward and get attached - but really they were lying from the get-go.

OP, just read this thread and came across your final decision. Let me share with you how a good friend of mine got over her married man (similarly he'd told her that he didn't sleep with his wife anymore and then it turned out his wife was pregnant). Anyway she throw herself into every form of physical activity she could find. Swimming and dance classes in her case. It really worked. She was over him in a month and they'd been together for years.

You are going to need to block his number as soon as you've told him though.At the moment he can only keep this affair going while he has access to you via phone. Make sure you do it immediately or he will call you and you will weaken.

Or you will find the change of routine hard and end up calling him.

This - "Whenever a man tells you he is separated, your next question should be, "Does your wife know you are separated?" If they answer, "Yes" then ask him for her number so you can call the wife to confirm".
I remember one online emailing with a man on a dating site.... oh yes definitely separated... he said. Turns out still living in the house wit his wife and not surprisingly when I studied when he sent his emails always when she was out at work - never evenings. He worked from home! Always check early on. I always do.

There are lots of uncomplicated single men out there who don't have ex wives and don't have children.

One thing that always irritates me on threads like this. People saying "you deserve better than this". Actually I think the OW doesn't deserve better. The OW is a shit, she deserves a shit. She's participating is wrecking someone else's relationship, she deserves a rubbish half relationship with a cheating using arsehole herself.

The person who "deserves better" in all of this is the wife.

OP, if you want better, you don't deserve it, you earn it. You earn it by making better choices. By having a conscience. So - I hope you stick to your decision.

I don't really get what's in it for you. Is your social life just breakfasts and coffees and almost sex?

Do you have normal days or nights out eg meals, cinema, weekends away? Does he stay over at yours? Have you met each other's friends and family? It's been 10 months after all.

It's an odd set-up going by your op. Nothing resembling a normal relationship so why you are asking if you're the ow or not I don't know.

Was he texting you last night? While you were posting on here?

You're the other woman.

After 10 months you've not had sex?

If you're looking for space from him, tell him you're going to tell his wife if he doesn't stop contacting you.

You'll soon see how quickly he disappears.

Affairs are ego massages for the needy - on both parts. You're hurting a lot of people. I'm sure he'll find someone else to have coffee with soon enough

Hi Kathymyskies.

I think you know you are the mistress, but what you are asking here is why and how you are in this and what is he thinking and doing and why is he behaving this way.
You have become emotionally involved and it is difficult to see what is happening here. This is what makes adultery so painful, unfortunately about 40% of people commit adultery and don't realise what they are getting into.
He is a man who has no self control, and who is not able to keep his promise and contract to his wife. Even if he left her and moved in with you he would stilll have the same character traits.

In a relationship where the two people are free we can explore and learn about the other person. When you are a mistress you are denied this freedom. He has put you in a box, and you have put yourself in a box.
He is using emotional blackmail when he cries, and he is starting to control you more as time passes.
Read Lundy Bancroft, he can explain a lot about men like this.

I think this is exactly what I wanted to say but didn't know how to say it without sounding mean. It's the truth. You need to develop a conscience and stop hurting people.
OP, if you want better, you don't deserve it, you earn it. You earn it by making better choices. By having a conscience. So - I hope you stick to your decision

Examine why you love him. Put yourself in his shoes - would you cheat because you are unhappy in a relationship? Or try to work it out and move on?
Also in many marriages the wife accepts her straying husband and continues to ignore him.
Do you really want to be treated badly like this. Living this way can be detrimental for your mind and body, and can even change your character.
He is an extremely controlling person.

Going for a married man is like having the money for a brand new car with full servicing and insurance and instead buying a clapped out old banger that everyday you think is going to get you to work, only for it to constantly let you down and isn't even a comfortable ride. There's no point, it doesn't make rational sense to go for the old banger. You have the cash, go for the new, shiny, reliable model.

You sound like an idiot. You'll find out how much he really cares for you if you could muster the balls to ring him and tell him it's over. That's when he'll finally admit you were nothing to him. But I doubt you will, because you sound like a pathetic character.

I don't agree you're pathetic - nor, indeed, a pathetic character.

You made a stupid choice waaay back. A choice of questionable morals. You've paid a very high price for the kaz-ing you felt when you literally bumped into him and then agreed to a coffee.

So has his wife paid a high price, incidentally.

Over time it will become clear to you how he got you all caught up in a maze of confusion and emotional agony. But you did walk into it. You won't do that again, I imagine

Married men usually tell the mistress:

1. Wife doesn't understand me
2. I need to keep you secret to protect the kids
3. We do not have sex
4. I'll leave when the youngest is 12/ leaves/ wife is more stable/ it's a full moon.

What makes your sordid affair more special? The fact you believe this shit? Many mistresses do. He's rubbing his hands with glee, patient and unaware wife, young and gullible mistress, kids are there with him. Are you the only OW in his life? Sounds like you make it so easy he could have several.

And you are right, leaving him is the only thing to do. Check the next guy is genuinely single.

I haven't read every single reply OP but I get the gist - yes you are absolutely the other woman. Sorry.

He's lying. About everything. If
You stay with him you will waste precious years with someone who will
Never leave their wife and who will doubtlessly cheat on you one day.

Find someone kind, trustworthy, single (!) who wants the same things you do.

This won't end well for you. I have seen this situation occur in my working life more times than I would have liked.

Yes it's textbook 'my wife doesn't understand me'

Men who are 'separated' whilst still living with their wives are a best- avoided bunch.

Either they're lying.

Or they're pathetic and need someone new to leave for (these men will always need endless looking after and will require rocket up their arse to effect any changes in their lives).

Sorry but you're no better than him, there's plenty of single men out there instead of stealing someone else's

I understand why people say this, but I have to say that it really irritates me! Perhaps when you have been single for the best part of a decade, watching friends get married and have babies, while there seems to be a notable lack of eligible single men in their thirties and forties, you will have a little more understanding of why it is not a great thing to say to anybody!

Not condoning affairs, but it just simply isn't true to say there are plenty of single men for everyone. It does make me a little bit more understanding of why somebody might fall for a married man (although I still don't understand why somebody would take the scraps and condone the multiple deceits that come with being the OW).

Whenever a man tells you he is separated, your next question should be, "Does your wife know you are separated?" If they answer, "Yes" then ask him for her number so you can call the wife to confirm.

Erm. Seriously? You would come across as really weird if you did that.

I don't understand why so much emphasis is placed on MN on women needing to "check up" that the men they are involved with are actually separated or not lying to them. If he is lying, then he is in the wrong and being cruel to two different women at the same time. Yes, wilfully shutting your eyes to obvious lies is one thing. But not believing men when they say they are separated and expecting to be able to call their wives to check up on them is just a step too far! Why keep blaming and putting the onus on the woman (who frankly hasn't made any vows to the wife) instead of putting the blame squarely where it belongs on the lying man?

Yes, I say that and no it isn't weird. Most of these men are lying when they say they are separated. I am 52 years old and never married and have had so many married men hit on me I lost count - yes, even in my 50s. I have never had to call one wife because they immediately start tap dancing as they try to explain what they meant by "separated" and the bottom line is - they are not really separated. They are bored lying sacks of shit. I also check court records.