Am I just the 'OW' and don't realise it?

[kathymyskies]

I'm a first time poster and could do with some advice. From reading MN I think I'm opening myself up to a lot of criticism, but maybe I need that, I don't know.

I'm 29. I've been seeing a man who is 52 for the last 10 months. We meet every lunch time (work in different places but same city). We go home together, sometimes meet for breakfast, have dinner or coffee every evening. We've never had sex but have been intimate. We love each other. He's married but hasn't been intimate with his wife for 7 years and sleep in different parts to the house on his wife's request. I'm a secret because of his two kids. In a year, his youngest goes to university and him and his wife have already discussed splitting at that point and are together for the kids.

I have had a blunt conversation with him about 'us.' What we are etc. He said he'd marry me but couldn't give me what I wanted, and that if I was happy with having maybe 15 'good' years with him, then he'd be with me. He also says if I ever want to stop meeting and spending time together, he will accept that instantly but will always be there for me.

I feel so confused. He claims to not want to be open about us because of his kids and that his wife wouldnt obviously stay living with him if she knew he was seeing me..which would then disrupt the kids. He says in a year it will change. I then ask why would she care if you both say the marriage has been over for 7 years anyway? I've said to him that anyone would tell me that he was taking me for a ride. He then shows me texts and so on that prove his points (they could be fake but i don't believe they are as the first time we had the chat he got his phone out to show me so couldnt have prepared them).

I also feel confused because i would hands down marry him in weeks were the situation different and he was younger. I've been on dates since I started seeing him, mainly because there's no real future with him. But I love this man and it sounds like such a cliche I know.

Feel confused as to how to handle the whole thing and it;s come to a head this morning when I just knew I needed some advice. Please help me get my head together on this...I'm such a strong, decisive person in other areas of life!

Because he is of the generation where when the family is complete, men often have a vasectomy

Have you asked him ? Do you want children yourself ?

Yes he'd be heartbroken if you left, who would he have breakfast with and how would he fill his evenings? But, he's married, he's got kids, he didn't spend his 30s eating the scraps from someone else's table did he? Which is what he is asking from you.

Ditch him, and live a full life of your own. Find a man who is available and can devote himself to you in the same way that you devote yourself to him. Have kids if you want. Don't waste any more time stroking this man's ego and fulfilling his desire to have his cake and eat it. You deserve more.

He said if I wanted him and to be with him he would leave. And will leave when his youngest goes to university.

Oh he's good , putting all the guilt of splitting up his children's family onto you, but at the same time making you feel you have the control if you were mean enough to split his family up.

The only way his family is going to split up is if his wife finds out or comes to her senses.

At 29 you really should know better, so do what your conscience allows you to but what ever decision you make, make it assuming his wife doesn't know their marriage is over and also assume he wont leave when the youngest goes to uni as this is likely to be more factual.

I know you're saying that his age has nothing to do with this, OP, but I wondered how old your father is. Could you imagine introducing this man to your family and friends?

They've not had sex for years and his wife complains about

the wife allegedly knows the marriage has been over for 7 years , she is being very unreasonable

People asking why I'm doing it. The circumstances of my job mean that I have virtually no social life in the week (hours that I work). When I see this man it's fitting into the working day and if after work it's brief and waiting for transport home etc. I am moving closer to work next Wednesday, and so I will have more time then and I will be focusing on forming a proper social group again.

I'm not lonely and I have friends who I can talk to. The only way I can explain how this happened is there was a huge huge spark between us. I've never laughed like I have with him and I do love him. It doesn't make it right or ok and doesn't excuse him if he's been lying. But that is what happened and I didn't seek it out. I'm just an average 29 year old, starting to question what's been happening. I appreciate all the posts.

He's never been 'after sex.' So I don't think that's what he's looking for, and if it is he's waited 10 months and surely he would have looked elsewhere if that's what he wanted?

I hate to ask, but what makes you think you're the only OW? Why couldn't he be having carefully timed, "quiet" conversations with others too - all the while keeping it secret so as not to "insult" his supposedly uncaring wife, of course?

For god's sake, he's even preparing a future escape route by telling you "sometimes he thinks they would try to make it work after the kids leave" - and that's without all the other potential excuses: my wife's seriously ill / kids are struggling at Uni / finances have changed so I can't afford a divorce and all the rest?

In all honesty, why would you do this to yourself?

He'll be feeding you the exact same lines my OH was spouting to his (much younger) mistress. He dropped her like a stone when I discovered their affair. Unfortunately he has damaged his relationship with our children (in their 20's now) beyond repair and deeply regrets the affair ever happened. I don't love him and would move out at the drop of a hat if finances allowed.
Value yourself and get rid of the sad, old fool!

Have you ever read the threads on the Relationships board, OP, where a poster discovers her husband's been unfaithful? Have you seen the absolute devastation that's caused?

And have you read the posts where women have had to tell their children, whatever age, that their dad is involved with someone else and will be leaving?

And have you read the threads from regular posters whose parents have split up and they've had to divide their time and their loyalties between them?

Would you like some links?

I also suspect that op isn't the first, or even the only, love struck woman hanging on his every star crossed word

I do really feel for you. You need to be very strong and end things for good because YOU deserve better - not only because of his messy situation but because the life you could have with him is nowhere near as good as the life you deserve.

I have been in a similar situation in terms of the age gap. I think I kept putting the realities of the situation out of my mind because I thought I was in love. However, a few months after ending things I couldn't quite understand how I had been able to be in that relationship, when it just wasn't going to give me the things that I really wanted. For various reasons, it also took me that long to see that my ex was actually quite weak and not somebody who I really wanted to tie my life to. I promise that you will cope and will probably even feel relieved that you are not in the situation any more.

Imperial, I know the point you are trying to make.

I posted her because I questioned what this man was saying and feel like my head is a mess when I replay things he's told me.

So yes, I'm aware of all the things you list and that's why I'm not carrying on without considering his sincerity and instead im posting here

I have just yesterday had a conversation with my SIL who is 48 and has not had sex with her husband since 2009. She s just waiting it out until the last child leaves to call it a day. My best friend is also in a marriage that has been sexless for many years although they are at least still happy.

I'd love to know how some posters on here feel so damned sure about what's going on in the sexl lives of people they have never even met, in relationships they know nothing about, that they feel so confident in calling bullshit when a man says he's in a sexless marriage.

Whether they still shag is not the point. Whether they are or are not unhappy together is not even the point. Whether he truly intends to leave after the children are older is also not the point. The fact that he is still married, they are living together and you are a secret from his wife and children is the point. You are the OW. Until he can be honest with his wife you are the OW. Until they are separated in the eyes of their friends and family you are the OW.

He is right though, he cannot give you what you want. He's highly unlikely to want children with you for a start and even if he tells his wife about you I imagine you'll stay a secret from his kids for a few more years yet. That's no way to live, at 29 years old. Plus you don't even know whether or not you are compatible in bed and he is likely to be slowing right down on that score just as you are in your prime.

Do the sensible thing and listen to him. Move on.

Andintothefire thanks for sharing. I think you are right that I will feel relieved. I certainly don't want this, how it is now. And for the 4 months I was single before I met this man, I was very happy alone.

They've not had sex for years and his wife complains about it but he says he can't do it until things are better between them. Apparently they never got better and she complains in arguments now and then and calls him gay but doesn't initiate it and he obviously doesn't either. The last two years apparently hadn't even been a topic that's mentioned it just doesn't happen.

What an absolute wanker. His ego clearly couldn't allow him to spin a yarn where they no longer had sex and were both happy with that arrangement. Gagging for it, the wife is! What a pillock. What could she have done, I wonder, to make things better enough for him to shag her again? OP, please see him for what he is.

Pelvicslly, he says there's too much hurt from all the arguments for him to want sex.

op it doesn't sound good.

Years ago i started seeing a married man who told me he was separated & sharing a house with his wife for now for financial reasons. I was young and naive and it could have easily been bs. The difference was, within about two months i had been to his house and met his wife, who clearly didn't give a shit because they were living separate lives.

You are a secret because he hasn't separated from his wife, and you can do better.

Oh love, you know the truth don't you.

You say you 'speak' every night - but you don't. You text, and that's really not the same. He could be texting you while he's sitting next to his wife on the sofa. Lots of people manage that.

He has told you he might get back together with his wife when his kids fly the nest... why on earth are his children being at home preventing him from being with his wife? I don't get that, and I don't get why he would tell you that either.

This relationship is doomed. Take care of yourself, and picture a relationship where you can be with a person, sleep with them, call them whenever you want to, be seen out with them wherever you please - sounds nice doesn't it? Go and find that.

I smell bullshit too!

And it doesn't make sense "try again when the kids leave". A couple are more likely to try again before that happens.

He's probably at the other end of the house or out of he house when he calls you.

Do yourself a favour. End it. You want kids eventually, and not with him.

That's no way to live, at 29 years old.

You should be out there living your life.
Ditch the old git before it's too late.

based on what he has said they are not really even a couple apart from practicality

It doesn't matter if they have never had sex, never talk to each other and live in separate wings of the house. Until they have had the conversation in which they agree that they are no longer a couple then they are a couple
So what if it's not a fulfilling or healthy relationship? So what if it doesn't include sex? So what if it doesn't sound like a relationship you would want to be in? It is a relationship until they are both aware that it is no longer a relationship. It doesn't matter what he says about it, he's still in a relationship with her until he tells her otherwise. And you are the affair partner.

Oh and just because a man can get an erection it doesn't mean he can have sex. I bet you £1000000 he couldn't sustain an erection with a condom on and there is a good chance he wouldn't sustain it for long even without.

Also - his account of withholding sex from his wife doesn't cover him in glory either.

And of course he wants sex with her!

No none of it makes sense. I believe bits of it but not all of it.

Especially don't understand the part where he says it's over but they will see what happens when the kids both have left, at which point he thinks it will be him moving out.

Then when I say why live in limbo, addressing it now is better. He tells me it's for the kids.

Have you ever read the threads on the Relationships board, OP, where a poster discovers her husband's been unfaithful? Have you seen the absolute devastation that's caused?

I do understand this point. But the problem is that (a) not everyone actually believes in blaming the OW to the extent that some posters on here do (and personally I think too much vitriol is automatically directed at other women rather than the men who are usually deceiving two frequently vulnerable women) and (b) there are also plenty of threads on here where people talk about their dead or unfulfilling marriages in ways that seem to make affairs almost justifiable.

Of course affairs can cause devastation and I don't really understand why people stay in relationships where they might arise. There are also situations where women are very cruel to their partners' exes. However, I don't think it helps to treat every situation the same way, and it seems to me as though the OP is very aware of the potential fallout for everybody and is trying to come to terms with the apparent lies she has been told.