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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

How do I handle this? Eldest daughter.

195 replies

Elendon · 20/02/2016 20:36

She is 23. Has a 2:1 degree and has been home now for over a year. I have two other children who are dependent and she is not looking for a job. Plus her boyfriend is living here as well, most of the time. My youngest is autistic and doing his GCSEs. I have to move soon because of a divorce after a long marriage. Their dad is currently expecting twins and lives a long way from us. He doesn't want to know about her. I've already said to her and him that they have to move on, but she has replied that she has mental health issues and he r boyfriend is enabling her on this too. I don't know how to move forward on this. I can afford a house for the three of us but not her and her boyfriend. But I don't want to kick her out. Help!

OP posts:
Owllady · 21/02/2016 10:16

She needs to see a counsellor but I would not ask her to move out.
My mum had to move out of our family home when I was just turned 18' she couldn't afford for me to live with her and my dad didn't want me (he still doesn't!) And I still feel those feelings of abandonment twenty years on. So I disagree that you just wash your hands of her.
I'd buy a house and let her room share as others have suggested, but bf needs to move out or they rent a place or whatever (might force the issue that she needs to get more support with her health needs)

Owllady · 21/02/2016 10:18

Sorry, I didn't see the bf was controlling. He needs to move out. Maybe it would help everything if he just did then?

FellOutOfBedTwice · 21/02/2016 10:33

This is tough but I have a couple of anecdotes.

My sister is 27 and still lives at home. She has some mental health issues and has mild ASD but by and large lives an independent life in terms of having a job, contributing etc. To a certain extent I do think that they mollicoddle her and I do roll my eyes at some things that go on in that house.

However...... I know that my mum is very influenced by what happened to her own sister. Her sister- my aunt- is very similar to my own sister, ASD and anxiety issues. She was still at home at a similar age and my nan- a quite different character to my mum and someone who believes very much in so called "tough love"- literally threw my aunt out. Told her she had to stand on her own two feet and gave her a deadline of a few months to leave home.

My aunt did but didn't cope well to be frank. She floundered and ended up very quickly marrying a man who initially seemed charming but who turned out to be abusive and controlling. My aunt was eventually left and fleeced to boot (my grandparents had given her and her husband a large sum of money to buy a home) and she had a nervous breakdown. Her mental health is now in even worse shape than it was.

So basically whilst I don't think you can or should coddle your DD, I don't think it's as simple as packing her bags either, as some PP have suggested.

I think you need to sit down and have a proper discussion about her staying, what that means in terms of division of money and labour in the house and how it can all be fairly shared.

Elendon · 21/02/2016 10:34

Good morning. Ok sleep and feeling a little better this morning. Texted her father last night. His reply was very defensive, and although he said he had had a chat about getting a job, I really don't believe him, as he lies all the time. Very difficult. I also asked if she could stay with him and help with the twins. He hasn't replied.

I will have a chat tomorrow morning. Will ask if she will go to the doctor and see if we can get some counciling. She did have this whilst in secondary school.

Need a long, hot shower. Thanks once again for your help.

OP posts:
theclick · 21/02/2016 10:36

She's 23? Jesus. You have to start putting your foot down/ultimatum/etc. I think you know the answer. When I was 23 I'd already been working two years, as had most of my friends.

goshnotme · 21/02/2016 10:47

Many of you are coming at this from British cultural conditioning - that children must leave the family home as soon as possible. In many other countries, it would be hard to understand this attitude - children are welcome to remain in the family home as long as they like - they are never forced out or made to feel like inconveniences. Families live together, large extended families, and move between each other frequently too. In some ways I think this is better than the model we are channelling here, which leads to feelings of rejection and inadequacy - both very British traits also.

Owllady · 21/02/2016 11:02

I agree with you gosh

itsbetterthanabox · 21/02/2016 11:23

Op do you yourself have any mental health issues?

itsbetterthanabox · 21/02/2016 11:27

Which mental health condition does she have?
Don't ask her to have assessment. Take her to the doctors. Take her to appointments. A lot of people suffering need someone to take charge for a while to get help then they get strong enough to do it themselves.
What happens when you ask the bf to get a job? What is his reply?
I'd make an appt at the job centre for them and take them down there.
If you do nothing then nothing will change.

Elendon · 21/02/2016 12:20

I agree with you gosh too.

I do have a long term cancer diagnosis (slow growing), which is now in my lymph nodes and no longer operable. I've lived with this throughout my marriage and post, so for about 30 years. So that's that.

I'm 55 and hope for another five good years. I've been bucket listing and ticking for the last five, selfish I know, but now I feel it's time to seriously consider the future of my children, can't say our any more, their dad has moved on too much physically and emotionally.

OP posts:
Elendon · 21/02/2016 12:22

I've no idea what mental health condition she has, she does suffer from anxiety, it obviously needs urgent attention.

OP posts:
Owllady · 21/02/2016 12:24

That sounds very hard Elendon :(
I really think it will help her if she has some counselling, especially with the boyfriend being a pita too.
Do you have anyone to talk to about this yourself?

Elendon · 21/02/2016 12:34

I do have support from family and friends. They all say get rid of him. But that's easier said than done. If I was earning more, I'd happily keep them, but that won't solve her problem. She is a delightful young woman.

OP posts:
TheWeeBabySeamus1 · 21/02/2016 12:45

God Elendon, just read the whole thread and can now understand why you're so torn as to what to do.

I think you need to be honest with your DD about your life expectancy, and how you need her to become independent as your not going to be here in 10 years time to keep supporting her. She needs to engage with mental health services and at least try and help herself or she's going to fall apart when you're gone. Let her know that you are doing it out of love not malice.

I can't imagine what you're going through and I'm so sorry you're in this situation. Flowers

Italiangreyhound · 21/02/2016 13:19

Elendon so sorry for your diagnosis.

flippinada · 21/02/2016 13:49

Oh Elendon so sorry to read that. I can't begin to understand how that must feel but I appreciate it must be really difficult for you.

Anxiety unchecked can be crippling - I'm an anxious person and have had treatment for it - CBT can be helpful.

I think your daughter does need to see someone - could you get a GP appointment and go along with her?

flippinada · 21/02/2016 14:14

Also,just thinking out loud here, but if you are acting as a carer for your daughter due to her MHI then there are sources of help and support available to you. I think just having someone to talk to who 'gets it' can be a great source of help and support.

BonitaFangita · 21/02/2016 14:52

Elendon, I'm so sorry about your diagnosis. But I'm glad you have the support of friends and family.

DigestiveBiscuit · 21/02/2016 17:41

I can't tell if the OP's daughter has MH problems or not.

However, if she has, it may be more complicated than depression. While there may be plenty of people with MH problems, living in their own home, equally if you look at a report say by Crisis, you will see that its estimated 2/3 of single homeless people on the streets have undiagnosed personality disorders; and the rate of psychosis is higher than in the normal population. Ditto, there are plenty of people in jail with mental health problems. It is estimated that 50% of male suicides are undiagnosed personality disorders.

We have one disabled daughter, with complex learning difficulties. Our other daughter had OCD and social anxiety at school - both aspects of a generalised anxiety disorder. This was not surprising in view of the family circumstances. She had CBT, which did nothing for her. As she was suicidal just before her A-levels, I made an emergency appointment for the GP, and got her reluctantly to a go. She got through her A-levels on anti-depressants and took a gap year. She seemed to have plenty of friends, a social life and got a bf. She started at uni, and just after the relationship with the bf broke up, for reasons beyond the control of either of them. More depression, until we found out she had spent 2 weeks researching on the internet how to commit suicide. I made another emergency appointment with the GP and got her to come with me.

She ended up being diagnosed by a psychiatrist with mixed personality disorder - elements of dependent personality disorder and borderline personality disorder. The three causes were:

  1. the trauma of seeing what went on with her disabled sister
  2. feeling neglected by us, as so much of our attention went on the sister
  3. sexual abuse by the bf - he had tried to force her to do everything. She put up with it, because she wanted someone of her own, to care for her

It is not for me to say that the OP's daughter has personality disorder, but it is more difficult to deal with than just depression. Our daughter went on to be taken by the emergency services either to A & E or an acute mental health unit for suicidal behaviour 15 times in the next 18 months.

I understand that if you have one child with special needs, there can be an intense desire for the other siblings to be "normal" - to leave home in their early 20s, get a job, married whatever, because you think "I have enough to do for the special needs one; I need the others to be normal!" Unfortunately, life is not always like that. If another one has significant mental health problems, they need just as much support from their parents - and telling them to stand on their on two feet, is a complete waste of breath! Abandonment can be a major trigger.

One example, we told our daughter who was being sent to an acute daily treatment unit, run by mental health services, where they had lectures. She did not like one of the lecturers and did not want to go the next day. We told her calmly, she wanted treatment for her condition, and should give it a good go, and then she could say that it did not work for her. It was only sitting in a lecture; not like being friends. At this, she went berserk, physically attacked me - husband had to restrain her. Then she stormed out of the house, to the railway station to attempt suicide - they had to do an emergency stop of a train, and the police took her to the local acute mental health unit. The police have had to jump down onto the tracks before to drag her off; or had to chase after her on the streets at midnight, while she is running around, in the process of taking an overdose, on top of neat vodka!

Even though people like her, do end up living in a flat, the reality is that often the family have to run their home for them - at uni, she was living on Weetabix or not eating at all; spending all her money on clothes and then couldn't pay the bills!

It really is not necessarily, just a case of depression; and saying things like "I had a job and my own house at 23". It is about as helpful, as telling someone in a wheelchair "Well, I can walk, so you should be able to!"

MajesticWhine · 21/02/2016 17:57

Hmm. But she got a 2:1 degree and presumably managed with independent living at university (we don't really know - OP?). This is quite a significant achievement if she has had a severe mental health problem, unless there has been a recent deterioration. And if there has been a deterioration then it could be that staying at home and not working is simply worsening the problem.

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