silly childish in laws

[sphinxster]

I've posted about this previously: in laws "devastated" and ignoring us because dh and I gave ds my surname as well as his/theirs.
DS is now 4 months old and they're still giving us the silent treatment. DH messages them updates about ds and sends photos. They've recently decided they want to Skype once a week to see ds (we live overseas). So once a week we have these awful silent Skype sessions where they won't acknowledge dh ( I don't get involved).
Talking to dh today that I really didn't like it and how long was he going to allow it. He says he doesn't want to stop them seeing their grandchild and wants to be the bigger person. I think they're the ones that are stopping themselves from seeing their grandchild and they should only be allowed to see him if they are willing to show some respect to his parents/us.
I'm really pissed off about their behaviour and even though he's too young to know what's going on, I don't want him exposed to this ridiculous behaviour.
WWYD? AIBU?

Oh my... No useful advice but I feel so sorry for your DH having parents like this. How on earth do they justify their behaviour to themselves.

Well, as far as 'bullying' him into making the decision, does that really matter if it's the right decision?

There is a MNer (not linking or naming to protect her anonymity) who has been dealing with a horrible iL situation and a very FOG-ged DH. And there were times where she had to give him ultimatums or otherwise 'get stern' to protect their child. She insisted they get counseling, insisted that he support her rather than make excuses for his parent. It's been hard, but it appears to be working.

I've just read out some most of the responses to him. He says he sees it and he knows but it's not just as easy as it sounds. He is truly hoping they're not the people they seem to be and the situation will resolve. I asked him what will happen if it doesn't resolve and he said he can't think that he has parents like that right now.

Exactly what the aforementioned posters DH said. You and your DH should seriously consider getting counseling before there are serious fractures in your marriage. Since his parents are far away it's easier to manage now, since DS is a baby, but that won't always be so. Especially once DS gets old enough to pick up on things his parents will say about you (and they will say things) and once decisions start needing to be made about schooling, etc. Because his parents will use those decision to drive a wedge between you, I guarantee it.

OP the inlaws sound bloody ridiculous.
They are blessed to have a grandchild. All this because the child has your surname to. They need to grow up. Plus your DH needs to have a talk with them. My son has both mine and his fathers surname. Double barrelled.
For you

sphinxster, Fluffy will not always be a baby. Full NSA-sponsored surveillance will mean he can be tracked at nursery and later at school too. Plus they would probably be able to get a colleague to hack his records to change his name to the one they wish him to have. They could also reduce your salary at the same time. It's really win-win.

On a more serious note, I think AcrossThePond is right. Counselling now, as a preventative measure, will help to keep lines of communication open between you and DP. I really would try to get him to read Toxic InLaws/Toxic Parents even if he does so in order to understand your point of view, rather than in order to change his own. They clearly have a huge amount of power over him - can you imagine him allowing a friend to treat him this badly and still dutifully doing the Surreal Silent Webcam every week?

I remember your first post, can't believe this is still rumbling on, what twats they're being!!

I agree that it might be a solution for your DH to email them a video - pref of all 3 of you - rather than these torture Skype sessions

From what you've written, he is absolutely deep in the FOG and desperate to have normal parents.

He hasn't got them, sadly :(

Agreed he rreally needs some counselling/ therapy.

I also think that perhaps it would help a lot if you looked long and clear eyed at these parents of his. Right now you've done the best you can, a very thoughtful and decent best. But it hasn't worked and I suspect they think of you as weak, in that you and he will accept this treatment and still try to accommodate them. Extrapolating a way here but have quite a bit of experience with abusive parents, not only my own.

Really think you need to take a long step back and draw the line a lot earlier than you have been doing; they've been taking advantage of your lovely kind nature.

Why are you involved with these bizarre Skype calls? Surely if your dh is so keen to facilitate this insanity, he can do it himself? Step back, way way back. Let him get on with it.

Acrossthepond thank you for your responses I agree with you. I know I'm not helping matters by saying this but isn't being right a matter of perspective. I'm sure my dh thinks he's doing the right thing by facilitating contact and until he can see it differently, I'm not comfortable at all with issuing ultimatums.
I feel that I can really only operate a sort of advisory role and hope he gets the strength to stand up to them. I think the best thing for now is to get some literature online for dh to read, as tribpot says, if only so he can see my point of view.
I will also tell him that if he wants to attempt a resolution with his parents he needs to do it now because I won't have ds involved in this for much longer. If it's not sorted soon, then I won't allow it. Which I suppose is an ultimatum!
So, give him a short period of time to get the resolution he wants and then if/when it doesn't occur we (dh, me & ds) will not be available to them.

I'm so very grateful for all of the great advice and support. I am taking it all onboard but adapting it a little for our situation and personalities, which probably isn't the best.

That´s a good plan Sphinxster It´s not an ultimatum as such, but you are putting your foot down about the use of your son in this ludicrous situation. You have to step in or it´ll just go on and on.

What do you think would happen if your OH and you tell them ¨Right, this will be the last Skype sesh as we are not prepared to abide by your pathetic and ridiculous rules in this, frankly creepy and childish game! You will be having ANY contact with our son from now onwards, but we will send you some pics occasionally......¨ blah blah, words to that effect!? Seriously, give THEM the ultimatum! BUt your husband has to be onboard obv. If he is not on board and wants to carry on with this weirdness, he´s undermining you and not taking your feelings into account.

So I hope you have some progress with your OH, even if you do have to toughen up and throw your weight around a bit, who cares?? But I would love to be a fly on the wall when you give them an ultimatum But seriously, that´s what it´s gonna take cos no way are they just gonna stop behaving like weirdos as long as you and your husband are playing the roles they´ve assigned you. You need to empower yourselves instead of allowing them to have all the power and control over you. But don´t wait for him to read a book for things to change....what sort of time span are you thinking of giving so that he can quit these mental Skype sessions?

oops ¨ you will NOT be having any contact with our son....¨"fat fingers I am

So you're allowing your Ds to be cooed and oohed over by two dysfunctional weirdos who have zilch respect for his ma & pa? Hmm. You know this is wrong. Your dh isn't being the bigger person. He's being a doormat. My marriage was on the line over toxic mil and only by making it clear I would leave him did dh step up, emerge from the fog and stop scape goating our ds. I'm not saying your dh is doing this but he seems to be offering your ds up on a silver Skype platter! It's beyond dysfunctional. They're shit parents to your dh first and foremost. Stop exposing your ds to this weirdness.

P.S You said in your OP your husband doesn´t want to stop them from seeing their Grandson......well by quitting Skype and sending them pics instead it´s win win; They get to ¨see their Grandson¨ and you both get to stop the excrutiating skypes. You wouldn´t be ¨stopping¨ them seeing your son then would you?
PLus it´d give them something to think about wouldn´t it? If they wanna see your son in Real Time and have any sort of relationship, they need to change their ways and reflect on their behaviour. Remember, it´s all about catching them on the back foot and putting the ball back in their court. That´s how the power is taken back to you both and from them!
Then you will soon see how badly they want to be a part of your son´s life and play their role of ¨normal¨ Grandparents! Though, I doubt this will ever happen in reality cos they sound like they are anything but Normal. They will accept no blame and never admit they are out of order, I´m pretty sure of that, from what you describe. But they forfeit their right to have any input in your son´s life, it´s that simple.

I personally think you´d be doing your son a huge favour not having these 2 loonies in his life. Keep him well away from their toxicity, I would. Creepy and screwy as fook!

I have experience of this and will share in case it helps you OP. Our children have no contact with their paternal grandparents because my fil refused to be 'decent'; even criticising me to my dh and encouraging him to see me as unreasonable just before I had a c section. Eg he was invited to lunch at my parents home on the day after c section, then the plan was that all grandparents would go to the hospital to meet their first grandchild together. He accepted the week before but subsequently scheduled a client at that time, cancelled the lunch, announced he was going to send his MIL in his place, and demanded to come in the evening of that same week. When DH explained that we weren't planning anything further for that week (partly because I was in a wheelchair with excruciating spd and partly he has been so abusive in the past that it would cause me great anxiety to have him in the home) he explained to dh how 'unreasonable' I was being. It actually worked to the point that dh was cold and angry even as I was waiting to go to theatre-but at the time I felt I had offered all I could for that rather hellish week and the priority was dd's welfare and then mine. I could never offer enough, or offer it quickly enough, and everything was always more evidence of my so-called selfishness. It went on like that for weeks with similar things (PIL got aggressive because DH wouldn't do a hundred mile round trip with dd when she was two weeks old, despite knowing that Ihadn't been able to go downstairs since returning from hospital and was completely dependent on DH for help with everything, not to mention DH's utter exhaustion). At that time we weren't denying access, just refusing to turn up here there and everywhere with dd to be shown off. MIL had an open invitation to visit and get to know the baby one on one, but she didn't except once to bring a foster child to meet DD.

We tried to discuss it with them as DH saw our marriage wouldn't work if things went on and, like you, I wasn't prepared to have dd caught up in it all indefinitely. FIL wouldn't acknowledge me except to rant about grandparents rights. He was livid. We offered limited access, eg the visits a year, but he turned that down. I wanted dd to know her grandparents but not at the cost of a stable home and not if it meant being around people who would criticise her parents and encourage her not to trust us.

Eventually decided life was too short and we were getting nowhere. That was fine years ago. It was a very painful decision although it's a huge relief to no longer fear I'm walking into a war zone without warning. DH has obviously found it harder. My PIL are well respected Christian leaders and it's impossible for anyone to imagine them behaving like this, do others sometimes assume we've been very cruel. That probably hurts most.

I hope you have better luck than we did in finding a resolution.

I think that's a very good plan! Educate, reinforce, then if all else fails, insist. But I think part of the 'insist', if it comes to that, should be counseling.

Thank you for the advice, I truly appreciate you all taking time to reply. I will put an end to this but I need to do it sensitively so dh can accept he tried everything and then accept they're toxic to our family.

Lost thank you for sharing your experience. It must still be hard. Can I ask if you children have enquired about their missing grandparents?
Similar to your PILs, these weirdos are martyrs to other family members (take elderly relatives shopping etc) but it seems it's all done to control people (I.e. Only taking great aunt x shopping at 10am on Tuesday) but on the face of it people think they're good people... They are not.

MIL'a brother is an alcoholic and she confiscated his bank card to stop him buying booze and would take him shopping. When he insisted on having his bank card back, he cut him off. Lose control = no contact.

btw, MIL's brother's alcoholism wasn't affecting anyone else but him. He wasn't stealing, commuting crimes, turning up pissed and abusive. He's quite a passive alcoholic who is able to hold down a job to fund his addiction. Her controlling tactics were never going to cure his addiction. That's a whole other thread though.

Understandable you don't want to issue ultimatums to your DH, but this does need to be stopped somehow. If they don't even talk to DH, what happens if your baby is not in the mood for skyping, having a bath/crying/feeding or whatever, how do they rearrange time slots etc? It is hard to imagine how this works.

If you appeared on screen saying hi! How's the weather over there etc (basically ignoring their sulk) would they actually not respond? If that's the case, try it. Perhaps DH will get fed up with this behaviour of his own accord if they are actually rude to his wife in front of him?

Could you make sure you, DH and baby are all genuinely out doing something nice together when next skype is due, then send a message saying, sorry we missed you here's a video of dgc to be going on with.

I think you need to give them an arena in which to cock-up time and again, so he starts to see.

I'd just keep popping up on their screen in the way of their view of dgc breezily saying things like O good you're speaking to DH again, thank goodness for that? Oh you aren't? Well this is a bit silly isn't it? How childish. Oh well, never mind. Just going go take baby off for his nappy change. Let us know when you feel like a proper chat, bye bye!

My DD hasn't twigged that everyone has two sets of grandparents yet. It will come and I know we'll have to feel our way then. I fully expect she will meet them when she's old enough to make her own decision - but by then she'll be old enough to do it on her own terms and she'll have had the stable childhood we wanted for her. We're lucky in having two unmarried aunts who adore their great nieces, so she isn't short of spoiling! I don't think there would ever have been much relationship between her and her grandparents anyway - more of an expectation to turn up at family gatherings in a pretty dress and play the piano.

Op, is your husband the eldest son in his family?

OP - I just want to pick up on the surname thing. My sister and I both had children before my brother. In my father's eyes, this third grandchild was far more important, because he would carry the family name. And told us so. He had no relationship with any of his grandchildren - unbearably incapable of anything resembling normal human behaviours - but he was enamoured of the idea that the family name would live on. It's a control thing.
Your particular circumstances are concerning. What is remotely normal about a silent Skype. Your ILs are seeing your little one as an object to be manipulated according to their peculiar world view. And it seems that your DH is not yet able to see that their behaviour is not normal. I too recommend the Toxic books. For both your sakes and especially if, as seems likely, your DH is mired in FOG.

whitehandled that is awful.

sphinxster, I've just thought of another way to disrupt the Skype thing - wander naked across the shot in the background. Do it a couple of times and then go 'oh god, is that on?!' scream and run out.

ROFL what a wonderful solution.

G'wan sphinxster!

I remember your first thread. This is still going on?! They are insane.

I noticed you wanted to get some literature. The books that are usually recommended on here are toxic parents/toxic inlaws by susan someone.

Just as white mentioned, it may very well have to do with carrying on the family name, that's why I asked if your husband is the eldest son (or only son but I think you said there are other brothers?)

They are being horrible, there is no doubt about that. Giving your son both names is the decision of you and your husband, not your inlaws! If that is the reason they're acting like this, then it is probably the family name being carried on is what they're highly angry about and your name added on "ruins" it.

I have to agree with you, if the inlaws don't treat you, the wife of their son, with genuine love and respect, they have no right, while ignoring and insulting you, to get to have a relationship with your child.

Love the ideas about walking past the Skype naked haha!!! Or, have ds wearing a monogrammed tee with both your names next time.

I 2nd the name on a T-Shirt LittleBeauty, wot a cool idea!! Just for laughs...or maybe a matching one for Daddy as he picks up and waves his son around and makes a right spectacle of him! I can see the crowd going wild!lol