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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

It's long, I'm so in the wrong, but I'm in a mess and need a place to talk...

424 replies

AnotherFineMess16 · 20/01/2016 15:34

... if you could see your way fit to let me and reach a hand into the flames that I suspect are about to engulf me. I'm ready.

Nobody knows any of this. Some people know some things, but nobody knows it all apart from me and him. I suppose I'm at the point now I need an outside, objective opinion from somebody who, yes, might judge, but will do so from a place of fairness and neutrality (I hope). I thank you in advance.

16 years ago, I embarked on an 2 year long affair. He was married, I was single. I was 24, he was 30. Yes, there were kids involved, I know it was wrong, but I did it. I have no excuses, unless love/infatuation/lust is one. There is no other. It was wrong, we were wrong, I knew it, he knew it, yet we did it. There is nothing I can do to change that now. Long story short, he left his then wife and we were together. About a year afterwards, he dumped me from a great height. Completely out of the blue and it devastated me. "Karma" I hear you cry? Maybe so, I don't believe in it particularly, but this was certainly payback. A couple of months later, he came to me to tell me that he had gotten another girl pregnant. The dates suggest that she was impregnated either very close to the end of our relationship or just before. I have never had the stomach to ask too many questions, we were over anyway and I was already in a very, very dark place and physically and mentally could not cope with any more at this point. I'm not exaggerating when I tell you that I was in pieces. He wanted me back several times thereafter, but I couldn't and wouldn't. And, as it does, life moved on and so did I eventually. We stayed in touch throughout the years. The odd text, mail or (drunken) phone call. Ashamed to say there were a few nights together in there too. He would always tell me he made the biggest mistake of his life letting me go. I agreed with him. There is huge back story about his now ex wife and family and their (justified) hatred of me that also led to him dumping me, but the buck stopped with him and he just didn't love me enough, no matter what he says. I, however, sap that I am, always loved him, but the damage was so done and so was I. The whole thing really scarred me.

9 years ago I met a man. A lovely, kind, responsible man who I respected and had a deep fondness for. I knew I didn't love him passionately but I knew he would never let me down. Our sex life was never very good, but being in whatever dillusional frame of mind I was at that time, I thought I could live without it and that there was much more to life than sex. I was 31. We eventually married. We did not have sex on our honeymoon. In fact, we very rarely had sex at all. I would never tell anyone or disaparage my husband IRL, but he was unable to perform most of the times we tried. We eventually stopped even trying nearly 4 years ago. We haven't been intimate since. We both decided we'd like a child together, so as I had my own 'wimmins' problems, we used that as our excuse to go for IVF. We were very lucky and successful and we now have one child. It doesn't take a genius to work out the next bit...

Enter original MM. We got back in touch, we met, we slept together 4 months ago. We have now met 9 more times (it would be more but we live a distance apart) and have spoken/text/mailed eachother every day since. And here comes the cliche and I can hear myself, I know what I sound like, a fuckin' stupid idiot, but I love him. And I believe he loves me. We want to be together, properly and just do it right this time. Although, I accept it's been a very shitty start. Shortly after this first meeting, I finally sat with my husband and told him what I should have done months if not years previously, that the marriage was over. I did not tell him about the OM. We are now separated, although we continue to live together until we can find a suitable place for him to move into. We will co-parent our child and we are amicable right now. Probably due, in no small part to the fact that he doesn't know about OM. I know that we would have separated soon, regardless of the OM entering my life again. I was a fool to think otherwise.

OM is in a LTR, however, they are also in separate bedrooms, he tells me. I do believe him, as gullible as that makes me sound. He has told me he will leave in the next 6 months but he wants to make the break as 'gentle' as possible. They have no children together, but she has 2, one of which is a teenager and lives with them. He feels responsibility towards this child as well as wanting to spare his partner as much as possible. I do not agree with his strategy, but it is his plan so I will leave him to do it. We have agreed to have no more meetings and very reduced contact for the coming months until such time as we are free to pursue a legitmate relationship.

God, I do love him but I don't know if I'll ever be able to fully trust him and I'm so worried I'm going to be hurt again. Yet, yet, yet, I can't seem to stop it. What am I even asking for here? From you? I don't know really. A big bucket of wake up and smell the coffee maybe? I'm a fucking mess. Are we completely selfish bastards? Are we wrong for wanting to be together and have some sort of happiness for the rest of our days? Can anyone out there, any of you, see any hope or happiness coming out of this? I'm not a fool, really. I know we're not some modern day Romeo and Juliette, I know there is no such thing as 'soul mates' but if there were, he seems to be mine. He's my lobster... Has anyone had anything similar happen? Maybe you could tell me how it turned out? OK. I'm braced. Thanks for reading.

OP posts:
AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:26

OK, I'm back. I had a very restless night, yes, poor me, I know. Your words rang in my ears all night. Some kind, lots harsh, some wrong, but most right.

As I explained yesterday, we had agreed on very limited contact for the next while. I never text him first, a poor attempt at some sort of control I suppose. Anyway, last night I texted him for some sort of clarification on the separate rooms things. He had contacted me last week to let me know he had moved into the spare room and the way he'd spun it was that he was on his way to being free, that it was a good thing, that it was off the back of some sort of conversation or event that had happened between him and his GF in relation to the state of their relationship, which he has always led me to believe was on its last legs. WRONG. Turns out his GF couldn't sleep so he offered to move into the spare room to allow her to sleep better. I have no doubt now that it's temporary, although he hasn't said that. I don't think he moved out for some sort of token move towards separation or anything like he wanted me to believe. I'm a gullible dick.

I can never trust this man, I know that. I guess I always knew that, but hoped that he would change or I'd be able to change him. I have built up this 'love' affair in my mind whereby, he'd be true to me because we were 'meant to be'. I was so full of shit, I see that now. He had his chance to be true to me years ago and proved he couldn't be. Why the fuck would it be any different now? And as some of you have said, if he loved me, really loved me, he'd be with me and out of there now. Not taking time to be 'gentle'. He was in no way fucking gentle with me when he dropped me, let me tell you. I am angry, very, very angry today. And ashamed. And hurt. And so many things I don't even know where to start.

He knows nothing about where I am. I didn't reply to his last text. I won't be texting him again. He'll, no doubt, be in touch in the next couple of days. Probably with alcohol on board, feeling sentimental and in need of an ego boost. So, where do I go from here? Do I tell him to fuck off now? Wait until he contacts me? Or just ignore his messages? Now I need strength. At this moment in time, I have it. But in a few days...

OP posts:
Fckup · 21/01/2016 08:29

Since when have honesty and faithfulness been the same? You can have one without the other.

AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:31

Beesandknees - thanks so much for those articles. I've read a couple. They are insightful and very, very useful right now. I appreciate you taking the time to link them for me.

OP posts:
TheStoic · 21/01/2016 08:32

The last time you contacted him...was the last time you will ever contact him.

What he does now is irrelevant. He could turn up with a marching band and a megaphone, and it wouldn't matter.

Because you've decided never to contact him again. The control is 100% yours.

Right?

That's all you need to know.

AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:37

I think what I'm finding most hurtful out of all the replies are those aimed at my mothering. That I'm a bad mother or an unfit mother. I can see why some might think that, but it is really, really not the case. I love her. I would never hurt her. I suppose I thought that this 'relationship' would make me happy and that me being happy could only be a good thing for her too. I'm not afraid of being single, I think I'd be very happy on my one with my daughter. I guess I just thought I could be happier in a loving relationship. Problem is, this doesn't seem to be that relationship. I really am seeing it now. Thank you.

OP posts:
AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:38

Thank you Stoic. That's very, erm, stoic ;) I want control. I'm taking it.

OP posts:
Shutthatdoor · 21/01/2016 08:39

There is a man caught up in this sordid tale - a man who (in OP's words) is a 'lovely, kind, responsible man' who would 'never let me down'.

This same man - who has done nothing wrong - is being mugged off by the OP to keep him 'amicable'. He has no clue that the wife who married him for all the wrong reasons, has been shagging her serial cheating former affair partner behind his back. Not a clue. Adding him, without his knowledge or permission, to the list of casualties that she and her lover have left in their wake.

He is being kept in the dark, lied to, deceived, as he has been deceived from the beginning, and she's doing it to keep things sweet for herself.

The man has the absolute right to know the truth, so he can make decisions about his own life and future based upon it. But the poor sod is being denied even that.

Well said.

hellsbellsmelons · 21/01/2016 08:40

Your best reaction is none at all.
No responding to texts, no telling him to fuck off.
He will get the message loud and clear when you don't respond to him at all.
I'm very glad you are seeing him for what he is.
Leave him to stay with his current GF.
I'm sure he'll move on from her once he has an 'in' with another gullible woman.
It's sad but unfortunately very true that you can never trust this dick head.
Block his number, block in from all social media.
I know the pull there is to see if he does contact you and what he says, but if you really mean this then just block him, ignore, delete.
Keep the anger and stay strong.

Funinthesun15 · 21/01/2016 08:42

Make sure that when your DD is with her DF which should be half of the time and you are alone that you don't contact him.

TheStoic · 21/01/2016 08:44

I want control. I'm taking it.

You've got it.

You don't need to 'wonder' what you will do if he does this, or says that.

You don't need to wait and worry how you will react to what happens next.

Decide now, and decide once. That decision stands no matter what he says or does, because YOU have decided what is happening with your future.

lalalonglegs · 21/01/2016 08:44

What happened to the child he had with the woman he started sleeping with while with the OP the first time Confused? Honestly, OP, he doesn't seem very good at remaining faithful which is fine if you don't mind that sort of thing but it sounds as if you do. I hope things work out for you but... Flowers

AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:45

I really don't know why some of you are still of the opinion that I should tell my stbxh about any of this. I accept I might well, in fact, am probably missing a morality chip somewhere... But, he doesn't need to know it. He won't feel better for knowing it. He'll feel worse. And believe it or not, I don't think he'd be as angry as you might think. I think he'd be of the opinion that his 'inabilities' had pushed me into someone else's bed... I don't know if I'm explaining this correctly, but I know him and I know how he'd react and, trust me, he would feel worse. I will not be telling him.

OP posts:
AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:47

The other child is with its mother and her now husband. Their relationship didn't go past the pregnancy. It was never a relationship really, it was a fling that resulted in a baby. They didn't become a couple. He has contact and pays maintenance.

OP posts:
AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:48

STBXH and I will have shared custody of our wee one. That has been agreed.

OP posts:
Bubblesinthesummer · 21/01/2016 08:48

I don't think he'd be as angry as you might think. I think he'd be of the opinion that his 'inabilities' had pushed me into someone else's bed

Great, now blaming the person who is being cheated on.

You don't get to chose how people do or will feel.

You better hope others don't know about your sordid affair and tell him.

Ruthiesj · 21/01/2016 08:48

Glad you've managed to put everything into perspective to see the truth about this man and the relationship you have had with him over the past 16 years.

I would advise not informing him of your new thoughts/feelings on the matter as that offers him the opportunity to twist and minimise your rational objections. You already know you have a weakness for this man, so the last thing you want to do is provide him any further power over you.

Good luck with everything. I know it's not easy letting go of something that felt so significant to you. For now concentrate on ending your marriage in the least damaging way possible for yourself, husband and daughter and establishing a life for yourself that will allow you to be happy.

Nottodaythankyouorever · 21/01/2016 08:50

STBXH and I will have shared custody of our wee one. That has been agreed

So when you are on your own for 50% of the time what are you going to do?

AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:52

Bubbles... There is nothing, not one thing I can say to you that will change your opinion on me. And that is fine. But the simple fact is that you do not know him. You do not know how he'd react. I have a bit more insight on that one. I know I'm doing the 'right' thing in not telling him. You're probably pissing yourself now...

Thank you Ruthiesj. 16 years... WTF is wrong with me...

OP posts:
AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 08:54

Nottodaythankyou... Not sure I understand the question. What am I going to do? Eh, work, clean the house, take up a hobby? I don't know. What do people do?

OP posts:
FantasticButtocks · 21/01/2016 08:56

I don't understand why people are saying STBXH should be told the facts so he can make decisions about his life and future based on these facts. What sort of decisions? Confused

Bubblesinthesummer · 21/01/2016 08:57

You're probably pissing yourself now

No I'm not.

You however need to grow up and stop throwing insults about.

As for you doing through 'right' thing.....

Funinthesun15 · 21/01/2016 09:01

I don't understand why people are saying STBXH should be told the facts so he can make decisions about his life and future based on these facts. What sort of decisions?

Choosing to divorce on the grounds of adultery.

Maybe wanting to be primary carer of DD.

Maybe not thinking the breakdown of the marriage is his fault.

Maybe wanting the actual truth rather than the OP version of the truth which misses out the fact she is an adulterer that has at least had an EA for a lot if their marriage?

AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 09:03

Thanks Bubbles... I'm trying to 'grow up'. And I'm not throwing insults around. And it was exactly the 'right' I made the pissing yourself comment about. Well spotted.

FantasticButtocks... Exactly that. What decisions? The decision is made. We are no longer together. We are moving forward. We are going to raise our daughter together. We will be in eachother's lives forever through her. I want us to be friends. And yes, maybe friends don't do what I've done to him. But I did. I have to live with that. Me. He doesn't need any more shit thrown at him.

OP posts:
CauliflowerBalti · 21/01/2016 09:06

I have form when it comes to falling in love with total barstewards. I wasted years on one. I know how hard it is to cut them out of your life. For what it's worth, I couldn't ignore his texts and emails. But I did manage to free myself. I replied every time saying, I can't do this. You can't give me what I want or need, I can't see you, I can't plan a future while you're trying to drag me back, please leave me alone. I sent variants of this dozens of times. His last message apologised for how he had treated me and asked if we could be friends. I said there was no need to apologise, we both behaved badly, but friends wouldn't work.

I have a son. What helped me was imagining him growing up to be like this man. Jesus no. Imagine your daughter with a man like that. Imagine him treating her the way he has treated his wives and you.

I've now met a man who treats me wonderfully. There is a future for you if you choose it. A great one. Be strong.

AnotherFineMess16 · 21/01/2016 09:07

I did not have an EA for a lot of my marriage. I did not. I married him, naively thinking that I could 'make do' with the lack of sex. I really tried. I couldn't. You see, sex isn't just sex, it's representative of so much more. It's the glue, it's what distinguishes between a marriage and a friendship imo. What we have is a friendship. I want to maintain that. He does not see the marriage breakdown as 'his fault'. It is not his fault. It's my fault for not being able to live in a marriage without intimacy.

OP posts: