At an impasse over finances and how to move forward

[Fraughtfinances]

Name changed for privacy. Trying not to drip feed and apologies if this is long.

Background: DP and I have been together 18 months. I have a teenage DD whose father is not involved and does not contribute financially at all (never has). DP has no children.

DP owns his own house (not outright - there's another 15 years on the mortgage). I own my house (23 years left on mortgage). I have slightly more equity in my place that he does.

DP moved in to my place earlier this year. He rented his place out and currently has tenants living there. His place essentially pays for itself (technically it makes a profit as DP will have a small tax bill to pay on it each year). The idea is to think about having a baby next year.

Prior to moving into mine, we had some work done on my house. This comprised structural work and a new kitchen. The work had been on the cards for later in the year, but DP is a keen cook and loathed existing kitchen, so paid for the work which ran to more than envisaged (c. £25k rather than the original estimate of £15k). My plan had been to remortgage later in the year and use the money to do the kitchen then. As it is, I'm in the process of re-mortgaging in order to pay DP back the £25k.

Foolishly, we didn't sit down and thrash out how financials would work between us when DP moved in. I'd previously had lodgers in the spare room to help with living costs. When DP moved in, we agreed no more lodgers as it would make the place feel cramped. I'd assumed, wrongly, that when DP moved in, we'd split the household bills 50:50.

In terms of overall financials, I earn £52k and DP earns around £85k. I have no savings and a small amount of debt (around £3000 on credit card). DP has significant savings, shares and no debt. My monthly outgoings (in direct debits/standing orders alone) are around £2500 (not including food or petrol). A significant amount (around £600 per month) goes on school fees (although DD has an assisted place). I have very little disposable income.

DP's outgoings are only what he contributes towards the household which is currently £475 per month plus some money towards food (which is still not agreed). DP wants to split the food bill three ways as doesn't feel he should contribute towards the food costs of DD. He doesn't contribute towards the mortgage as feels that if he did, he would want a share of the property. I don't want to put him on deeds, as he already has a property which is being paid for by his tenants.

We've been arguing over this for the past few months and still have no resolution. I feel that he is profiting from the relationship (essentially he can save in excess of £4k per month, whereas I have about £100 per month disposable income and no hope of saving). I have lost my claim to child benefit since he moved in (although it would have been reduced partially owing to my salary). He feels I want to use him to subsidise my lifestyle and use him as a gravy train. He also feels I am emotionally blackmailing him by saying how it upsets me that he won't contribute towards DD's food costs.

I would really like some recognition that we're living as a family and that we share some of the burden (and I have no expectation that DP should pay towards things like school fees, school uniform or anything like that). Even if it was a gesture along the lines that DP would pay for meals out (if we go out for dinner or to the cinema) or holidays. Instead, I feel criticised for the choices I've made and the lifestyle I've lead. DP is fundamentally a saver; I am not. I accept that. I accept too, that I've put things on a credit card and paid if off later, rather than saved for it beforehand. I have an excellent credit score (have never defaulted on anything) but do have a lot of stress about finances and lack of money. DP has never once worried about money.

We spent all of yesterday arguing - the issue continues to crop up again and again when I am down to my last few pounds and worrying how to economise before payday, and DP is angry that I'm in the situation. At the moment, I have around £300 to cover food/petrol/going out/school uniform until the end of the month.

I was awake for hours in the night, as was DP, just getting more and more upset and stressed. I feel utterly drained. I don't know how to resolve this. My friends think DP is being unreasonable. His friends think I'm selfish and grasping. I'm trying to arrange to see a counsellor so that we can talk things through in a neutral environment. I just can't see how we move forward without one resenting the other. Nor do I know how on earth we'd manage finances if we have a baby.

Any comments or suggestions most welcome.

I've just read lazylou's post. Very good summary.

I think if he genuinely can't put himself in your shoes and see your position that is like a personality disorder. he doesn't want to see it.

I have experience of life with a mean man. strangely he could never see my pov either. hmm... and him so intelligent! I now realise it was just a selfish case of 'this suits me and i'll cling to it for as long as i can'.

his biggest fear is being taken advantage of financially......but it's fine to take advantage of you?!

You are not a family. You are his cash cow.

For the love of Christ, don't even think about giving him control of your finances. He will have your DD in a state school within a week and be expecting her to live on toast.

Just kick this free-loading fucker out with a simple "This isn't working for me and DD."

I've tried the above. He refuses to accept he makes money by renting out his place - he feels that he's in a far worse position because he's lost his space and freedom. He says it's akin to living in a shared house and that how do you put a price on having to share a bathroom and not have enough storage for your clothes (his place was a 3 bed flat; my place is a 3 bed house). He thinks if he pays anything towards the mortgage, he should go on the deeds. I don't want that as I want the security for DD to have the house if anything happens to me.

I feel indebted (owing to the kitchen) which I will pay back as soon as I re-mortgage. But I feel it's so unfair.

Part of me thinks I could be totally petty and totally separate finances. I would buy DD's and my food. I would cook for DD. I wouldn't go out anywhere with DP because I can't afford to. I wouldn't go on holiday with DP. I would put things on credit cards (rather than paying them off as I'm currently doing) if necessary. But it would be such a horrible way to live. I don't want to make DD feel awkward and say she can only eat food on a certain shelf of the kitchen. I don't want to live in a horrible atmosphere. DP can think of money in a detached, hypothetical situation. Meanwhile, I'm worrying about how I can afford to eat this month.

I notice his inability to spend money on anything that's 'not necessary' disappeared when it came to the kitchen. If he was such a 'simple frugal life' type he'd have put up with the one you had. Different when it's other people's money, eh?

If you continue this relationship and have a baby your are going to live a miserable and stressed life. Things are going to go from bad to worse. It's inevitable. Get out while you can

He is a horrible grasping individual. Get rid!

He refuses to accept he makes money by renting out his place - he feels that he's in a far worse position

He actually sounds delusional. It is a matter of fact that he is making money or he wouldn't have a tax bill - simple arithmetic

As for the other stuff about losing his privacy - words fail me. But, in any event, it's not for you to compensate him monetarily for that

I agree - do not give this man control of your finances and please think very long and hard about your future with him

Sally makes a good point - I would certainly suggest this to him to see what his response is (admittedly there is the problem of him 'owning' your kitchen but that will only make your place more rentable).

He doesn't want to form a family with you and your DD. Fair enough, it's not for everyone. But I think he has misled you about his intentions before he moved in. Given what you now know about his pathological stinginess, do you really think he didn't move in in order to save himself money?

I honestly can't see how having a child with this man is going to end well. Okay, he may be different towards the upkeep of his own offspring, but given what he's said so far I share other posters' concerns that he will simply view maternity leave and childcare costs as your further attempts to leech off him.

I would suggest if you want to continue a relationship, he moves back out. Once you remortgage, reimburse him for the kitchen unless you feel the costs escalated because of things he wanted, in which case reimburse him for a reasonable amount. If you have a child, share care 50:50 or some reasonable compromise thereof.

Incidentally, I don't think you can afford not to have lodgers. I would advertise the room again. Have you sat down and taken a good look at your budget? Not just monthly costs but also the less regular things like car repairs and Christmas?

I'm sorry, but I would not want to live with someone under those circumstances. It sounds awful.

In his desperation not to feel that you, his partner, is getting your mitts on any of his precious, it appears he'd rather live alone and not be in a relationship.

How does he treat you in other aspects of life?

I can see but Dd had 3 sausages, and i only had 2!, you owe me 50p...

I can't believe that he thinks that living in a three bed house with a partner and a teenager is worse than loving in a flat. He is a mean entitled cock lodger who thinks he is doing you a huge favour by breathing the same air as you. Tell him to move out get a new lodger and look for a new partner.

Do you really want to tie yourself to someone so mean? If you had a baby he would probably refuse to support you through your maternity leave and also not pay towards the childcare.

Living I mean

x-posted with you. I think this tells you everything you need to know: He says it's akin to living in a shared house and that how do you put a price on having to share a bathroom and not have enough storage for your clothes

He sees this as an uncomfortable and cramped houseshare compared to having the run of his own place before. I'm even more mystified about what persuaded him to move in (other than to save money). He thinks he's done you a favour just by being there and contributing to bills, I suspect. Whereas in reality if this was a house share he'd be paying rent.

By the way, I don't think £3000 is a small amount of debt. I would try to start seeing that for what it is, a millstone that is going to grow whilst your income is so compromised.

Yes, or want on the deeds of your house, and expect half if you split. Run OP...

He's not fundamentally a saver; he is fundamentally a tightwad.

Believe me, I know the difference. My father is a tightwad. He gave my mother the bare minimum 'housekeeping' money he could. My mother got into debt because my father was so stingy and wouldn't pay for necessities.

My partner is a saver. He is careful with money, but does not resent spending it, does not keep a running tally of who bought what, does not get his calculator out to split the bill. He is careful, but generous.

Your partner sounds like a dick. If you do have a baby with him, you'll be back here with a new thread about his financial abuse.

I don't really see a way forward financially as you both seem unwilling to share your assets. With all his money the point that he wants to split the food bill three ways is a massive red flag. At the moment he is the one who benefits most from this arrangement.

Imagine being on maternity leave with no or little income and him in full financial control. It would be a nightmare. I'd tell him to find alternative living arrangements for the forseeable future. And don't even think about having a baby.

As odd as it sounds, I don't think the motive for moving to mine had anything to do with saving money. He has stacks of cash, but doesn't really invest it and tends to ignore it. He just can't spend it so it builds up and up. He only just got an ISA in the last year. For the rest of the time, he had over £80k sitting in a current account.

The reason we decided to move to mine is that it was more practical if we start a family. It has a garden, it's in a family area. DD wouldn't be uprooted.

There are certain kind of men who are obsessed with the idea that women are trying to take financial advantage of them. They're generally selfish arseholes who don't like women very much.

Far from taking advantage of him, he is taking advantage of you. You have lost out financially by his moving in - lost lodgers and benefits - but despite having a higher salary, he has not compensated for this loss. Furthermore,he has strong-armed you into an expensive kitchen he likes but you have to pay for.

It's very easy to save money when you don't have a child, he doesn't seem to have the remotest idea of the costs involved childrearing, nor understand what being a parent is all about. He is not interested in being a stepfather, he is not a generous, warm-hearted soul. Do you really want your daughter to grow up in a house with a man who refuses to contribute a dime to her life, even her food, in addition to her bio dad who won't fork out either? What will this teach her about men, and about their view of her?

There are big red flags here. He is a tight mean little man with the potential to become financially abusive. This man does not want to be a family.

You and dd come as a package, if he doesn't want the BOGOF then he can bog off. Do not have a baby with him, ask him to move out ASAP. If you need counselling this early on - in this case essentially a mediator to sort out finances - there is something very wrong with the relationship.

Why do you want to have a baby with him?!

He refuses to accept he is making money renting out his old house?

That is hugely delusional, or a self serving lie that is doing as he intends, putting you in your place.

He has people paying his mortgage, but he won't put them on the deeds. Why would he, they are renting.

But he cannot apply this to himself whilst living in your home? He is trying and succeeding in conning you into supporting him, allowing hi to save his precious pennies. Read that back: his money means the most to him. It always will. Do you want to live like that, forever?

Please. Forget feeling indebted. Tell him he is right and that you feel you cannot keep him trapped any longer. Throw him out and offer up a payment plan you can afford, £50 per month perhaps. Get more lodgers and live happily without him.

He's not fundamentally a saver; he is fundamentally a tightwad

Absolutely. He's what used to be called 'a miser'.

I can't get past the fact that he begrudges paying a little towards your DD's food. I think you've been very fair and not grasping at all. He sounds terribly selfish. I'm sorry, OP, it sounds like an irredeemable situation to me.

And if he won't pay towards the mortgage, and he thinks he is in a houseshare, he should be paying rent. He is not living like your partner, he should accept that he is basically your new lodger.