Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

At an impasse over finances and how to move forward

670 replies

Fraughtfinances · 10/08/2015 10:23

Name changed for privacy. Trying not to drip feed and apologies if this is long.

Background: DP and I have been together 18 months. I have a teenage DD whose father is not involved and does not contribute financially at all (never has). DP has no children.

DP owns his own house (not outright - there's another 15 years on the mortgage). I own my house (23 years left on mortgage). I have slightly more equity in my place that he does.

DP moved in to my place earlier this year. He rented his place out and currently has tenants living there. His place essentially pays for itself (technically it makes a profit as DP will have a small tax bill to pay on it each year). The idea is to think about having a baby next year.

Prior to moving into mine, we had some work done on my house. This comprised structural work and a new kitchen. The work had been on the cards for later in the year, but DP is a keen cook and loathed existing kitchen, so paid for the work which ran to more than envisaged (c. £25k rather than the original estimate of £15k). My plan had been to remortgage later in the year and use the money to do the kitchen then. As it is, I'm in the process of re-mortgaging in order to pay DP back the £25k.

Foolishly, we didn't sit down and thrash out how financials would work between us when DP moved in. I'd previously had lodgers in the spare room to help with living costs. When DP moved in, we agreed no more lodgers as it would make the place feel cramped. I'd assumed, wrongly, that when DP moved in, we'd split the household bills 50:50.

In terms of overall financials, I earn £52k and DP earns around £85k. I have no savings and a small amount of debt (around £3000 on credit card). DP has significant savings, shares and no debt. My monthly outgoings (in direct debits/standing orders alone) are around £2500 (not including food or petrol). A significant amount (around £600 per month) goes on school fees (although DD has an assisted place). I have very little disposable income.

DP's outgoings are only what he contributes towards the household which is currently £475 per month plus some money towards food (which is still not agreed). DP wants to split the food bill three ways as doesn't feel he should contribute towards the food costs of DD. He doesn't contribute towards the mortgage as feels that if he did, he would want a share of the property. I don't want to put him on deeds, as he already has a property which is being paid for by his tenants.

We've been arguing over this for the past few months and still have no resolution. I feel that he is profiting from the relationship (essentially he can save in excess of £4k per month, whereas I have about £100 per month disposable income and no hope of saving). I have lost my claim to child benefit since he moved in (although it would have been reduced partially owing to my salary). He feels I want to use him to subsidise my lifestyle and use him as a gravy train. He also feels I am emotionally blackmailing him by saying how it upsets me that he won't contribute towards DD's food costs.

I would really like some recognition that we're living as a family and that we share some of the burden (and I have no expectation that DP should pay towards things like school fees, school uniform or anything like that). Even if it was a gesture along the lines that DP would pay for meals out (if we go out for dinner or to the cinema) or holidays. Instead, I feel criticised for the choices I've made and the lifestyle I've lead. DP is fundamentally a saver; I am not. I accept that. I accept too, that I've put things on a credit card and paid if off later, rather than saved for it beforehand. I have an excellent credit score (have never defaulted on anything) but do have a lot of stress about finances and lack of money. DP has never once worried about money.

We spent all of yesterday arguing - the issue continues to crop up again and again when I am down to my last few pounds and worrying how to economise before payday, and DP is angry that I'm in the situation. At the moment, I have around £300 to cover food/petrol/going out/school uniform until the end of the month.

I was awake for hours in the night, as was DP, just getting more and more upset and stressed. I feel utterly drained. I don't know how to resolve this. My friends think DP is being unreasonable. His friends think I'm selfish and grasping. I'm trying to arrange to see a counsellor so that we can talk things through in a neutral environment. I just can't see how we move forward without one resenting the other. Nor do I know how on earth we'd manage finances if we have a baby.

Any comments or suggestions most welcome.

OP posts:
Twinklestein · 10/08/2015 12:08

Then you'll split up and he will get primary custody of the second child as he was the primary caregiver.

Corygal · 10/08/2015 12:08

He hates spending any money at all. He is making money out of you and it's a key life driver for him. He gets nasty if you point it out. Classy.

You can't live subsiding him. He wants things to continue (of course he does.) But mean with money, mean with love. Honestly, I think you'd be better off with someone else.

Loraline · 10/08/2015 12:09

Leaving the money issues aside for a moment I'm worried about these two statements:

He refuses to accept he makes money by renting out his place - he feels that he's in a far worse position because he's lost his space and freedom. He says it's akin to living in a shared house and that how do you put a price on having to share a bathroom and not have enough storage for your clothes

He would, I'm sure, happily move back to his house with us. He misses his house. He misses his way of life. Part of me wonders why the hell he moved in if he wants solitude so badly

When partners move in together it's supposed to make them both happier. He feels he's in a 'worse position' and would happily move back out? Does he want to live with you? This isn't just about the money, I wonder about his emotional commitment to you.

CatsandCrumble · 10/08/2015 12:10

He hates spending any money at all.

He hates spending any of HIS money at all. He has happily spent more than you intended on the kitchen sooner than you intended spending it.

firebladeklover · 10/08/2015 12:11

Yes, how dare he tell you to budget?!
You have your own house, a well-paid job, you have made sacrifices for your daughter but not sacrifices that you couldn't afford to make. YOu still have your own house and you were managing OK.

Then he came along and changed all the goal posts. Now you have a 25k kitchen that is nice I'm sure but it wasn't your plan. Your priorities.

Georgethesecond · 10/08/2015 12:12

The disparity has come about because he is receiving rent on his house, but not paying any rent in respect of living in yours. Presumably his tenant pays rent as well as utility bills, why does he not think he should do the same?

Sallyhasleftthebuilding · 10/08/2015 12:15

I would put together a list of essential baby items, cot £200 pram £300, child are £1000, lost earnings, yours 12 months, his part time £40k.., and see how he feels then. Also I can not see batchelor boy being happy to give his time and money to a very demanding baby. Hes selfish.

badtime · 10/08/2015 12:15

OP, was he always like this?
Did you know, before he moved in, that he didn't want to pay for your daughter's food etc?
If so, why did you accept this?
Why do you not think that you, and your daughter, deserve more?

The expectation is that when a partner moves in with someone, they will contribute to the household costs; that is why benefits are reduced. You are not living as a single household. It will only get worse.

(TBH, I will be surprised if this is all there is to this. The OP has such low expectations, I think there is a good chance that he is being unpleasant and unfair in other ways.)

LumpySpacedPrincess · 10/08/2015 12:20

Do not start a family with this man, you would put yourself in a very vulnerable position. The fact that he will not pay half for food shows how deep down he views your dd, this does not bode well for the future. Will she receive a different amount of christmas presents as he will only contribute towards his own child?

What about if you fall ill, or lose your job, imagine what he would be like then. He is living rent free yet accuses you of scrounging off him, projection much!

Personally I would step away from the relationship. I know people who are really suffering financially at the moment but they would never be so mean.

WitchofScots · 10/08/2015 12:20

Lots of people had say useful stuff, not sure if anybody has mentioned this but even if he is not on the deeds he could have a claim on the house because of having spent his money on improving it. It's irrelevant whether or not he is on the deeds. I'd get legal advice if I were you.

Heels99 · 10/08/2015 12:22

Who will pay for your dds school fees, uniform, food etc when you are on maternity leave?

Heels99 · 10/08/2015 12:22

Or If you had a reduced income from working part time?

WaltzingWithHeiferlumps · 10/08/2015 12:24

Or if you two have a child, will he/she go to private or state school? If private he'd expect you to fund that by the sounds of it.

theconstantvacuumer · 10/08/2015 12:25

Please don't have a baby with this man. He sounds extremely selfish even if he does have redeeming qualities. Having a baby will only exacerbate that. And no doubt, any child of your relationship will end up massively financially advantaged to your DD. How is she going to cope with that? what about when she's older? Will there be money for university or a wedding? It will ALWAYS have to come out of your pocket. Whilst her younger sibling is funded by you and your DP (no doubt split 50/50). And if you are going to have to run rings around yourself to keep up with him financially then you will be forever miserable.

You are doing your DD a huge disservice by staying with this tightwad who won't contribute £30 a week towards her food.

Viviennemary · 10/08/2015 12:28

But how can you both go part-time if you are near broke now and can't pay off your credit card debt. You'd be relying on hiim even more for cash. Please think and do the sums before you make any decisions.

Ilovecrapcrafts · 10/08/2015 12:32

I think the reason so much of this is happening in 18 months (baby etc) is that DD won't need school fees paid then? So Op can take on a higher mortgage, maternity leave etc

Heels99 · 10/08/2015 12:32

Th nice thing about a reasonable income is you can enjoy life, go out for dinner, have a holiday, that the children etc. none of that applies though because he won't spend a penny on you or your dd yet incurs you massive extra costs eg £25k new kitchen!

butterflygirl15 · 10/08/2015 12:33

he can afford to go part time because the op is subsidising him. Then he can be a part time SAHD, when you split he will go for at least 50/50 contact or more and will claim to be the RP.

You say he pays the same as your lodger, but surely what your lodger paid was rent only and didn't include food - so your argument that he pays the same is invalid.

sherbetpips · 10/08/2015 12:34

As a lot of people have said early on 18 months is pretty early on into a relationship. the fact that the clock is ticking is not a reason to have a baby. its a terrible reason to have a baby and it will potentially impact massively on your daughter.

Regarding 'he would feel massively angry if he felt he had been taken financial advantage of' does he recognise at all that he is taking financial advantage of you?

I wouldnt beat about the bush to be honest. I would add up the money you have lost by him moving in and tell him that he will be charged rent to that amount. If you are lucky that will match up with what he is gaining from his current renter and you will be on an even keel. He is currently profiting from living with you but he fails to recognise your right to that money.

I really would consider why you are with this man as his behaviour really doesnt sound lovely at all.

Heels99 · 10/08/2015 12:34

I would be very surprised if he actually agreed to go part time!
But who will support the op and her dd whilst she is on mat leave or working part time? He won't!

FanOfHermione · 10/08/2015 12:36

I agree with loraline

Both of those statements (about the fact he misses his 'freedom' and the fact he refuses to see he is making money out of the house) is ringing alarm bells to me too.

I would suggest that you all move to his house, you pay no rent at all (how coud you if you are not on the morgage??), only utilities and rent your own home. See if he is happy with that arrangement. (Note: I doubt he will be or will arge that bills shouldn't be split 50/50 bu 1/3 to 2/3 as your dd would be moving in with you too....).
Somehow, I'm pretty sure you will end up better off.

I still can't get passed the fact he sort of bullied you into redoing the kitchen at your own cost when you wanted to do that later on and then is having a go at you for living above your means!!! If living beyond your means was such an issue surely he woud never ever have asked you to do that!!

Fraughtfinances · 10/08/2015 12:38

I didn't know, prior to him moving in, that the finances would be like this. I'd asked to discuss finances, it hadn't happened. I made the assumption that things would be split fairly.

The kitchen is something I had planned to do. It was on my list of things to do this year, once I'd re-mortgaged. The existing kitchen wasn't great and I had said to DP that I'd had a quote already. He said he would pay for it. He said too, he doesn't want me to pay him back. We drew up a Declaration of Trust at the time (we're both lawyers), saying if we split up, I'd pay him back. I want to pay him back now, so as not to feel indebted or beholden in any way. The kitchen costs spiralled and ended up costing more than planned. No doubt it would have been the same if I was paying. In a way, the kitchen is a red herring as the bottom line is still how the daily outgoings get shared.

OP posts:
FanOfHermione · 10/08/2015 12:38

Which I agree about the legal advice but surely he cant argue he is improvoimg the hoouse when it's the OP who has paid for the new kitchen and he is paying only half of the utility bills (and no food I suspect)?

Costacoffeeplease · 10/08/2015 12:41

He sounds pretty unpleasant, and I'm afraid I wouldn't be having a relationship with him, never mind a baby and all that that entails financially and emotionally, I just don't see how this is ever going to work out between you, sorry

FanOfHermione · 10/08/2015 12:42

xpost

Fraught I don't think they are red herrings. The fact you don't want to feel indebted at all is telling a LOT imho.
As so is the fact he doesn't want to accept he is making money from his house but has an issue with paying to have a roof over his heaad and is already thinking being on the deeds of the house etc...
Especially from a lawyer (I would suppose it's your field to both of you and you both know what paying split bills etc... actually means or not to the ownership of your house)

Swipe left for the next trending thread