Not sure how to feel about this

[Confuddledmare]

Apologies in advance if this is tmi.

Last week DH and I had sex, well he had sex with me. I didn't tell him no or to stop but I gave him no outwardly sign that I was up for it, by this I mean I had turned my back on him and was trying to sleep.

So was was stroking me up and down and this would usually get me in the mood and I would give him some sign of this, but I had had a hard day and I really wasn't feeling it. Again I didn't tell him to stop I just lied there and he carried on. As I was lying on my front he came up behind me and had sex with me, all while I was just lying there not making a sound and not moving an inch at all. I don't understand how he could have got any indication that I was feeling up for it. I just left him to finish and then went to sleep.

He knows I've been off with him since so I explained to him that I had felt a bit violated and used tbh. He said if I had asked him to stop then he would have, yes he might have been grumpy about it, but he would rather I said something than just left him. So apparently it is all my own fault, but I can't understand what he got out of a partner just lying there doing nothing?

Both of us are really struggling with it tbh. He won't come near me in case I think he is taking advantage of me and I don't really feel like cuddling up with him so it feels very very awkward in our house right now.

I'm not sure what I'm asking, maybe is it okay to feel the way I did or was I overreacting?

OP if you love him and he loves you , you need to forgive each other for the misunderstanding, set out some clear boundaries for the future and move on. Life is too short.

Consent isn't always verbal in a long term relationship but it does always need to be there.

As people have said, simply moving towards someone, accepting their cuddles, snuggling up, etc, people have their own ways of showing it. Dp does sometimes ask 'do you fancy a bit of hanky panky' and sometimes I do. If I went to touch him intimately and he moved my hand away I would know that meant no ta. If I did and he then rolled towards me and reciprocated I'd be happy that was consent.

In the OP's case there was no consent either verbal or physical.

Her feelings are valid in the circumstances. I think they need to do a lot more talking and try to work this out between them.

Green, I'm positive we will be absolutely fine. We do love eachother but I think both of our boundaries have been crossed right now and we are probably feeling a bit embarrassed. I think he has lost trust in me now and is scared of initiating sex with me but the kisses and cuddles are coming back so I'm sure that will too.

In a nutshell he needs to know that all women are not permanently on heat and will have days when even David Beckham couldn't arouse you(not likely) and you need to learn to make your feelings clear.

None of us were there, we don't know what was said or indicated

The OP was there, and she knows she didn't consent.

I believe her.

So glad you are starting to work things out op. I hope your marriage grows stronger and more open as a result.

In what way did you cross his boundaries?

Does he have that "I get to rape you, but you don't get to complain" boundary?

It's a common one in rapey men.

But as long as he gets to trust that you won't call him out next time he rapes you, you'll be fine.

Giving your DH the benefit of the doubt OP, part of the problem here is that we live in a society in which the default position for women is one where they are assumed to consent to sex unless they actively make it clear they do not. Really, it should be the case that consent is assumed to not be given unless the woman has made it absolutely clear that she wants it. And personally I am bringing up my DS to interpret consent as enthusiastic consent.

I can see why, in the context of a relationship and in the society in which we live, the OP's DH could have interpreted her non response as less-than-enthusiastic consent, but consent nonetheless. I don't think his behaviour makes him a misogynist. However, it does make him guilty of lazy thinking and inconsiderate, disrespectful behaviour towards his wife. And I think that needs addressing.

If the DH has anything about him, he will have a long, hard think about how he was able to enjoy sex (i.e. climax) when there was a complete lack of enthusiasm from his wife. I think he needs to examine his thoughts and values on sex and relationships.

I love my DP, the idea of sex with him when he is so passively led there, not displaying any sort of enthusiasm whatsoever, would be a complete passion-killer for me because I would want him to be 'getting off' as much as I was.

I don't think the OP's H is a cold-hearted rapist. I do, however, think that he's internalised a lot of our cultural messages about sex and women's level of consent that as a society we still have a long way to go to overturn. I'd also say that men who can't see past that are condemning themselves - and their partners - to have a relationship that is so much less than one in which there is equal respect, consideration and enthusiasm.

From your latest posts, OP, sounds like your DH has form for not taking no for an answer. It's ok to not be in the mood and should not result in him wingeing, questioning your love or loyalty etc.

You didn't say no because you knew he would turn on the emotional bullying. You knew that if you said no there would be consequences, so you didn't, and he went ahead and used you. That is rape, and it's been building up for a long time. He primed you not to say no by making it clear you would be punished for it. Now he's 'refusing to go near you' as a way of punishing you for objecting to being raped. He is setting you up to accept this again in future.

Only you can decide if that's ok. Good luck. You will always find someone on MN to talk to.

Now he's 'refusing to go near you' as a way of punishing you for objecting to being raped. He is setting you up to accept this again in future.

Yes.

Rather than apologising for what he did, he's acting all affronted and offended that you brought it up.

There is no doubt about what happened - he knows he had sex with you when you didn't want it. You know he had sex with you when you didn't want it.

But instead of being appalled at what he did, he's furious with you for pointing it out. You were meant to let him do it and never complain.

You are actually talking about crossing his boundaries FFS. What can that even mean in this context?

You are being asked to accept that what he did was fine and what you did (not consenting to sex and then complaining when the sex happened anyway) was the problem.

That means there is no remorse on his part, or any determination to make sure he stops trying to bully you into sex you don't want.

I agree with last two posters....if it was an honest mistake or misunderstanding then he would apologise.

I agree with last two posters....if it was an honest mistake or misunderstanding then he would apologise.

Or perhaps it's a defence mechanism following his wife basically accusing him of rape when she didn't say no to his advances nor ask him to stop.

He's got a trust issue with you, is he actually serious.

Unless your OH is deaf and dumb, he clearly took full advantage of you tht night, no matter how he wants to deflect from it and blame some other influence, Jesus, why on earth would he even enjoy or get hard with a woman that was lying like a corpse, it's clearly using you like a piece of meat, I know my own partner would never go further than a stroke if he got no response, he says he would lose his desire completely.

Your trying to excuse what is basically shit behaviour on his part, you did nothing wrong.

Basically op the witch hunters on here won't be happy until you string him up and flog him. They're not listening to the fact that you're on the road to fixing the issue, they are men haters. I'd think carefully before you post anything about your DH in future, they'll be round marking his door with a cross!

I don't hate men.

I just don't like to see a woman who has been raped by her husband encouraged to make it easy for him to do it again.

If he doesn't like being accused of rape, then he should stick his dick into unresponsive women.

Easy peasy!

shouldn't

shouldn't stick his dick in unresponsive women.

I like men...I don't like rape

I adore men (nice ones of course) so you are 100% incorrect there, idiot.

If you think it's alright for a man to take advantage then you jog on.

He's taking the huff with her cos he knows damn well he crossed a line.

Have I misunderstood MUMSNET? I though posters ask opinions, people respond, OP then does what they want with advice. You might all have different opinions, you don't have to force others to agree with you and frankly, resorting to insulting each other is so childish.

The OP doesn't think she had been raped, she felt uneasy but did nothing to stop it. They both now realise there is a problem with what they did, him for carrying on assuming consent and her for letting him and complaining after.

Thanks jan45

They both now realise there is a problem with what they did, him for carrying on assuming consent and her for letting him and complaining after.

Are you serious?

They are both to blame - him for raping her, and her for complaining about it afterwards rather than at the time??

Fucking hell. The rape apologies around here would make your hair stand on end.

If you had any, being a repulsive man-hating lesbian.

How is the OP on the road to fixing the problem, he's in denial cos admitting he took advantage would make him look a right wanker no?

The OP is also in denial cos the actual truth of the matter would be pretty hard to digest, I hate how women are made to feel they are to blame for something a man has done to them.

I never mentioned the word rape, I said advantage of, a selfish act to satisfy his own need, without a thought for his partner.

OP, if I was you, I'd make sure he got the message, next time, for sure, it's a deal breaker. Being married gives nobody the right to use your body.

But hey, I'm a witch hunter cos I expect respect in a relationship.

They are on the road to fixing it because they are talking about it. She feels used, he is mortified she felt that. Time to talk so that this doesn't happen again. That's what they are doing so leave them alone. Why push and push until she says "You know what? I think i WAS raped and it's all thanks to mum netters!" I don't think so.

"mumsnetters"