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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Just found evidence

298 replies

ExitStrategyHelp · 28/05/2015 21:43

Now what?

It's too late for a conversation - long day in the office for both of us.

Unfortunately his loved-up texts (and sex talk) went to DS2's iPad. He is confused. I am angry although not as hurt as you might expect as I am not surprised.

Sigh. I don't have the energy for this….

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 30/05/2015 16:21

"affair by default" ?

classic victim-blaming stuff

BitOutOfPractice · 30/05/2015 16:23

Op I don't know what kind of wife you were or are. Frankly I don't care. What you have to understand is that it was his decision to fuck someone else. Not yours. Not anyone else's. His and his alone. And there is NO excuse for it. None at all. Despite kitten's attempts to justify and excuse it.

AnyFucker · 30/05/2015 16:24

I think kitten may have an agenda of her own

Original poster
ExitStrategyHelp · 30/05/2015 16:48

I said that to him: "You chose to stick your cock in somebody else, not I."

Seeking an explanation as to why something went wrong is not excusing it IMO but is often seen as such.

I think I was a good wife and am a good mother, not perfect, but I work at it really hard. I always felt said effort was one-sided thought, and that's what has to change going forward if we are going to go forward together.
You know that stupid 'leaning in' phrase wrt women at the workplace? Well, I expected him to 'lean in' to fatherhood and he just didn't. He loves our children, but in a sentimental slightly mawkish manner and on his terms only in terms of what he will do with them. He is generous with money and presents with them and mean with listening and actually hearing what they are saying - as least he's consistent Hmm.

He was a late, unplanned and unwanted baby and, boy, did his mother let him know that. I am not excusing him and his communication disability (I really think he's stunted in that regard), but I think late MiL could explain a lot.

He's still not talking to me or making much eye contact, just weekend as usual, now off to get some stuff for DS1's school residential.

I think I'll walk the dog - the sun is shining.

OP posts:
JohnFarleysRuskin · 30/05/2015 16:49

It's a very unpopular notion on mn but men do actually have emotional and sexual needs.

Wow, ground breaking stuff here!

Er, most people have emotional and sexual needs, don't they? Most people in a relationship want their relationship to be a good one. What can you do?

You can buy presents for your work colleagues and take them up the arse in hotels for several years or you can try and commit to your marriage and your family.

Hmmm. I wonder which method will work the best?

I think he has treated you appallingly OP. Four years of this texting, shagging, lying, stone-walling, deceit, 'good moaning'? I couldn't be bothered with someone who did that. How has he explained it to your DS btw.

htf2 · 30/05/2015 16:56

I don't think kitten should be attacked for her viewpoint and I think the OP is taking a very reasonable and mature approach. Nobody should be criticised for trying to save a relationship and the OP doesn't sound at all like a doormat to me, but someone willing to try who however intends to demand respect from her relationship.

Original poster
ExitStrategyHelp · 30/05/2015 16:57

He's not said anything to the kids, not a word.

I will speak to them tomorrow if he has not done it by the time I come back.

OP posts:
Original poster
ExitStrategyHelp · 30/05/2015 16:58

OP doesn't sound at all like a doormat to me

Thank you, htf, clearly I have been more of a doormat than I chose to admit to myself.

OP posts:
BitOfFun · 30/05/2015 17:12

You can buy presents for your work colleagues and take them up the arse in hotels for several years or you can try and commit to your marriage and your family.

^ This is spot on.

twistletonsmythe · 30/05/2015 17:14

I cannot believe anyone justifying an affair due to a mother being busy, well mothering his children. I mean how pathetic does a man have to be that he isn't getting attention as his children need their mum, so he goes and has a 4 year relationship with another woman - yet it is 'by default' - oh so that's alright then is it?

Dear OP - you deserve so much more than this excuse of a man. You sound an awesome woman, far too good for him and his philandering, pathetic excuse of a lifestyle.

And I don't care if you were a doormat (am sure you weren't) - it is no excuse for him being unfaithful. None whatsoever.

BitOutOfPractice · 30/05/2015 17:37

Op I absolutely agree you sound nothing like a doormat.

I'm not attacking kitten for her viewpoint. I'm calling her out on kicking the op when she's down by telling her that this is somehow her fault when only her husband made the decision to screw someone else for four years

Maybe the marriage can be saved. I don't kno. I would never attack the op for going down that road. It's her life. But I will call someone who says that it was her fault and these things happen "by default" when a wife doesn't do her wifely duties well enough. Tosh.

catmaze · 30/05/2015 18:00

A very wise poster on here said "It is the partner who puts the least effort into the marriage who is most likely to cheat, not the one doing all the work". She was correct as usual.

BitOutOfPractice · 30/05/2015 18:10

I also think that a man who is capable of leading this kind of double life would do it no matter what the circumstances at home. His response when confronted shows that he believes he's fully entitled to have whatever he wants and everyone else has to deal with that.

Op could've been a stepped wife, super mum and performing sexual athletics every night and still he would have gone ahead and taken what he wanted elsewhere. I would bet my mortgage that he's a high flying type and he's used to always having his own way and getting what he wants.

As for the ow. Beneath contempt

BitOutOfPractice · 30/05/2015 18:10

Stepped = stepford

HootyMcTooty · 30/05/2015 18:13

I don't think you sound like a doormat at all. You both dropped the ball in the relationship, but whereas you tried to talk and improve things, he chose to dip his wick in someone else, that's no way to fix a marriage.

Lots of people lose themselves in work and children, at the expense of their relationship. I've been there myself and it's only down to difficult home truths and effort that we fixed our relationship, but neither of us cheated.

You have some difficult decisions to make over the coming weeks/months, it's wise to step away, consider and don't act out of shock and anger, the decisions you make affect your whole family so must be carefully thought through. Fwiw, I think you're doing all the right things, especially going away for the night. I don't think your DH is even close to understanding just how much he's fucked up. I hope you make him realise.

Grumpyoldbiddy · 30/05/2015 19:34

Sounds like your house is a hard place to be right now OP. Hope you're ok and don't forget that you have the mumsnet massive here for you. Wine

Patchworkpatty · 30/05/2015 20:03

if I have sounded like I was kicking you while you were down ok.I apologize whole heartedly. That is not what I meant to express, nor do I find the way he had behaved acceptable in any way, but it is none the less the way it is. It boils down to the basics. do you want him in your world ?.is your life better with him in it ? do you feel more comfortable when he is away ? answer those questions honestly for your self, not for your children, and you will know whether to try to fix it or kick him out. nobody's marriage has ever worked ' for the children' this , for once is all about what YOU want.

Patchworkpatty · 30/05/2015 20:06

I'm sorry, my previous post doesn't seem to have landed...which makes this one seem nonsensical. to cut long story short. ..I was mostly agreeing with kitten

bjrce · 30/05/2015 20:34

You say he's still not talking to you, not making eye contact.

Please be very careful here OP. I remember this was a tactic my F used on my M for years, she was so confused and frustrated, as to why he could ignore her, when it was him having the affair, but it was his way of controlling her, and then when he would speak to her she was always so relieved, as if she deserved to be punished somehow.

Your issue here going forward could be: Well now she knows about the affair, I am going to continue on with my life, come home, not engage with you and be a father to the DC. Business as usual and continue his relationship with OW.
Please do not go down this road, if he isn't willing to talk to you, I am afraid there really is no hope.
Personally I think you are still in shock and the full extent of his actions hasn't quite hit you yet.

What is it you want him ti say to the DC?

AnyFucker · 30/05/2015 20:36

has anything changed for this guy yet ? Confused

Offred · 30/05/2015 21:19

The 'mn script' doesn't say anything about men not having needs, desires or feelings... Hmm

Often it is pointed out, when an attention seeking man who has recently had an affair tries to blame his wife for being distracted by the dc, that everyone has feelings, needs and desires and during the time DC are young many people of both genders don't get their needs met. It's nothing to do with having needs, it's to do with how you deal with not having them met. Being in possession of a penis shouldn't make it ok for you to be a twat.

I think both partners understand each other's feelings in this case. It's how those feelings were dealt with that's the issue...

'Affair by default' pshh... You have a low opinion of men - think they are all emotionally undeveloped, stuck in the toddler stage, and sexually fixed in the hormonal adolescent stage. No, men do not get special rules or special understanding, they play by the same rules as women. As they should.

Offred · 30/05/2015 21:21

Op - the sum of all the parts of your story does not look hopeful to me and I stick by my advice so far. I think he sees everyone other than him (particularly women) as providers of his needs, not people.

JeanSeberg · 30/05/2015 21:26

I think both sexes can drift into affairs/ONS situations - some people are more vulnerable due to their morals, beliefs, personality and lifestyle/jobs.

Offred · 30/05/2015 21:26

And if you made him leave he may very well go straight to OW and turn her into the put upon wife, but that would be a good thing.

The man you describe does not sound like a prize, he sounds like my father (affair aside, my father never had one). It was awful being his child (still is crap) and he has made my mother's life a misery. He's 61 this year (my dad) how long does he get away with not functioning as a healthy adult because of his upbringing?

Well, really as long as other people keep facilitating it. My mother has and she has so much cognitive dissonance which even fucks with my head I can't imagine what it does to her. All I can say is that every BF I have ever had has thought she was utterly utterly crazy and he (my dad) was a twat.

JeanSeberg · 30/05/2015 21:27

No idea what the phrase 'affair by default' means though.