HOBBIT'S BAR - still finding it hard to move on...part 5.

[WellWhoKnew]

If you are struggling to come to terms with the ending of your marriage, no matter how that came about, nor how long it's been, this is the place where you come to say SHIT THIS IS HARD, when you hit those times of despair.

It is the place where it is never rude to interrupt if you're having a bad day and need to vent. No matter what.

It is a place where no one will tell you to 'move on', 'get over it', or 'at least you've got...'

It is the place where the only thing anyone will tell you to do is keep on keeping on.

Amongst the shit, there are always giggles. But the only rule is: It is ALWAYS okay to say SHIT THIS IS HARD and interrupt the giggles. No apology necessary.

The bar, owned by Hobbit, but run by committee, is open to all as we wind our way through divorce, come to terms with our individual circumstances, or just cope with adjusting to a new life.

My name is WellWhoKnew. I am divorced. He left me just over 11 months ago. I am trying to rebuild my life by leaving the deadwood behind. I'm learning to laugh again. One day, I will 'move on', 'get over it' and be thankful that I've got what I've got. Until then, if I want to bloody moan about shit, I won't be apologising.

Because I did way too much of that during my marriage. The shit left. I'm learning to giggle again. KOKO.

Part 4

Part 3

part 2

Part 1

Our theme tune:

What is it with the eating out of the cooking dish? Me too - couldn't stomach anything except tomato soup and maybe a slice of toast for weeks - yes, right out of the microwave pot. Still haven't really got it back - when I do want food I crave bland stuff like chips and have gone off sweet stuff completely!!

Hope you don't mind me popping in.

Any words of advice on packing up his stuff? H moved out nearly a month ago after admitting an affair, he's taken very little and is living in temporary accommodation with little storage. He says he doesn't know when he's moving on, but I assume he'll eventually move in with her. If not he'll have to move somewhere eventually.

I've started packing his things in boxes, but I'm struggling a bit, do I pack everything, including stuff I know he won't want (there's 18 years of his crap here) and leave it to him to sort it out? I want all his personal stuff out of the house, although there will be a pile of boxes around for a while. I don't want him going through things or him turning up at short notice for his stuff. I want to do this thoroughly and in one go, if she wants him she can have is crap as well. Looking for the positives, at least I'll have lots of wardrobe and drawer space and i can reorganise the house. I had planned a general declutter and spring clean at the same time but have decided to box his stuff up first a room at a time and then I'll go around again once I've made space.

I should say I intended to maintain the moral high ground and to show good behaviour in front of my daughter, so I will be packing things up properly. I've got boxes, bubble wrap etc.

I've already had "I suppose I will have to take my things at some point, if that's what you want", what a load of crap, I'm reacting to a situation he caused the best I can, none of this is what I wanted.

It took me quite a while to regain my appetite. Although I'm one of those who don't eat when upset. Plus I would rather starve than cook. But 5.5 months on, my appetite is back to normal. Couldn't say when it returned, forgotten now.

I still skip the odd meal, but that's what I was like before anyway

Just thinking, in February my weight was still low. I think it's almost back to normal now. Haven't tried on certain clothes that were too big a while ago though but I'm hopeful now

Hi. Tabby here a fairly regular visitor to the bar. Cat lover but very happy to coo over the cute pics of Jess. Not much of a drinker in RL, can't see the point when I'm on my own but very happy having a virtual drink with you all in this bar and trying my best to offer a bit of support and advice if I can. That's the great thing about this bar, there is often someone whose been there, done that, got the t shirt especially since these twunts all seem to be bloody clones of each other.

So I'm a bit further along the divorce road than some of you with only my FH left to go. I'm starting to look forward to what will undoubtably be some huge changes after the divorce, possibly house hunting, very likely moving. He has been as awkward and nasty as possible in the divorce even SHL says he's only ever experienced one as bad in his whole career.

Married 20 years. Three years ago he had an affair with a much younger woman and he turned into a monster. Turns out he was a monster before but I didn't recognise it for all those years because I thought abuse was only physical, because it didnt happen very often and because there were good times in between so I thought I had to put up with being emotionally, verbally and sexually abused. Then he had an affair and I got strong. I stopped being a doormat. I started divorce proceedings. I left him and took my DS with me.

The past three years have been very very hard. It's so hard to break free from the ties of abuse. Year one was a huge emotional battle of head over heart. Year two still a battle but easier. Year three and I am now emotionally detached and finding it a lot easier.

EFG it is not your responsibility, nor indeed should you even be expected to know, what stuff he wants and what he wants to bin. If it's his, it gets boxed and passed on. I think that's fair.

So sorry you are going through this. And anyone is welcome to pop in here, anytime. Feel free to stay, pop in occasionally, whatever suits

That's what I though Izzie but it's good to get some reassurance, anyone i mention it to in rl just says chuck it in bin bags and tell him to fetch it. I don't think they realise how much stuff you accumulate and also I want to remain on reasonable terms if possible for my daughters sake.

There's also stuff that I don't want that he might, that isn't technically his personal possessions, if that makes any sense. Box it or ask him ?? I'm trying to keep communication to a minimum but could ask when he comes ovet.

Second question, I think I would box the "queries". And tell him that he can either keep the stuff or bin them. To keep communication to a minimum I would be tempted to just box, sy nothing about the "queries", but put a note in the box. That way, he won't be at your home any longer than necessary. And yes, RL friends are correct, bin bags would be all that would be expected. So you're being very reasonable.

A note in the box is a good idea.

I know it sounds ridiculous but I don't want to give anyone an opportunity to criticise, the clothes he's taken were washed and ironed (not by me) and his things will be carefully boxed and labelled. It's just the way I want to do it. Just boxing everything will make it quicker though and then I can get onto the reorganising and spring cleaning.

Hi...I'm WhyMe...

My stbxh left me and my two DD's (now 12 and 5) in August 2014. He swore there was nobody else but low and behold I discover the OW in September. He has then tried to destroy me.

We had been together 23 years and married for 14. I can admit now that he was EA. I have completed the Freedom programme twice and he fits every type described.

He cancelled my utility bills (took credits), took all our savings (including some of the childrens), took the car with the help of the Police, accused me of domestic violence (he said that I had hit him on numerous occasions in front of the children - actually he is the perpetrator not me), stalked me, harassed me, threatened to take the children (on numerous occasions), took me to court and the list goes on.

He also informed me that he had been using prostitutes and meeting women from plenty of fish.com between shifts.

I also have a rare lung condition and I have been off sick since last May. Then my poor mum passed away in December. I miss her dreadfully but I feel guilty that I haven't been able to mourn her properly because of his vile behaviour.

He took me to court in March and he turned up 45 mins late, CAFCASS said he was belligerent and the Judge wasn't impressed. He is using the children as a weapon to hurt me. We're back in court in June.

He's also stopped my child maintenance.

Despite getting a court order he continually tries to get out of the conditions. He just cannot comply.

He has also said that he is getting married directly our divorce comes through to the OW who is 9 years younger than me.

She has also threatened me with harassment. (I haven't done anything to her...it was her number ringing my landline etc).

I now refer to them as the 'slag and weasel'.

Some days I cope and others days I just get by using my finger tips to hold on.

I wake up sometimes and don't believe it's happened...the pain is so intense. Why did I stay with a man that had no respect for me? How could he treat me like this? What have I ever done to deserve this?

I've been pushed onto benefits through no fault of my own. I've been humiliated and crushed by the person who was supposed to love me.

My whole life with him appears to have been a shame and as a result I don't really know who I am anymore.

On the plus side...I have made some wonderful friends on mumsnet who have been supportive despite also dealing their own issues. I also now have a circle of RL friends who I would never have meet if it wasn't for him. I try to accept ever invitation now.

EPG no it's not ridiculous. I can see where you're coming from. Good luck with the clearing. It's nice reclaiming the space. I still have the wardrobes empty on the top rack. The next step is to get some shelves put in. It's actually nice seeing so much general storage opening up. Even in the food cupboards and fridge.

Hi EFG sorry for your situation. I think you are doing the right thing in boxing up all his stuff. Absolutely you should include everything that his his including all the crap . Anything you are not sure of or that is (both of) yours that he might want I should just put to one side for him to go through. soft furnishings etc in bin bags. You are doing this because you think it is right and for the sake of your DD.

When we were selling our house and he moved into rental before me I put all his stuff in one of the the garages for him to sort/pack. This freed up space to be able to sort the house out. I offered him some of my stuff which he took. He asked if I wanted stuff like his Karcher pressure washer and when I said yes he took it! He has since told me that any stuff he offered me and then took he has since binned. So he's a Twunt but I took the moral high ground

Why hello my lovely. Let's get one thing straight. He has only humiliated one person. That is himself.

You have been through the most horrendous ordeal. Your situation reminds me of that of MrsC, that relentless pressure from the ex and the vile OW.

KOKO, one day you will be free of him, head, heart, physically. Xx

Ooh I'm resident thread dietician - feeling honoured WWK thumbs nose at Izzie who has lots of claims to fame like naming Sid etc

Absolutely agree to eating/drinking whatever our bodies tell us to. I was chubby through the first half of my life and had weight issues. I had bodymetrics done at the gym yesterday and apparently I am athlete standard in BMI with no body fat (that's because any I do have is on my stomach!). Bit odd considering I spend large parts of the week being a couch potato

Oh dear bobs how spiteful and small minded is he! And is proud of the fact......

bobs you can certainly be dietician. I can't fit it in with my other duties on here, too numerous to mention bodymetrics, gym, what's she on about?

Did you study Romeo and Juliet? Didn't someone in there talk about thumbing their noses, or is it just you being posh and all that how many fingers am I holding up?

Bobs Unnecessary nastiness like that is exactly what I'm trying to avoid, by boxing up his stuff myself I'm deciding what he's taking not him. I've decided that as a general rule he's not taking anything I'll have to replace, as that's just unnecessary and i can't see her wanting to use anything from our home so it'll just get binned/replaced anyway. So it's just his personal stuff and the odd thing he might want, some tools etc. that i won't use but that are technically household things rather than personal things, no point me keeping things I'll eventually bin or give away either.

EFG I'm no expert here, but from what I understand, they are not entitled to remove "marital property" at this stage anyway. Although, as you say, it's a hypothetical question in your case. Certainly at this stage.

One thing, I assume if he's taking any papers,,you've photocopied everything? Ducks in a row and all that

bobs as dietician, would you like to extend your duties to bar food? Nothing too healthy of course. I could murder a nice steak baguette with onions......

EFG welcome. Do pop in anytime. It's a really good question because having the 'reminders' around actually is not pleasant at all. And you're asking about an issue we all have to deal with at some point.

I packed anything I didn't want. I didn't consider whether he wanted it or not.

I'm not saying this is the best way of dealing with it, but like you I didn't want his stuff being here as an excuse for him turning up unannounced (a real risk and would likely have got the police involved - and at the time I was dealing with the police on other issues, nice as they were, I was finding all the legal stuff overwhelming), and secondly, I was sick of it littering my home as it was all bagged up in the spare room so anyone who stayed had to sleep in effectively a dumpster. All other storage places were stacked to the rafters so the spare room, his stuff had to occupy.

The only reason I could do this legally is because his name is not on this home. I'm the sole tenant. So this might not work for you...

First I wrote, all nice and polite, and requested he make arrangements to recover them. I didn't give a deadline (big mistake!).

He sent a list of ridiculous actions for me to take.

I ignored them all. They were not necessary. So left it for a while.

Then, sadly, I had to take him to court so was advised to not deal with it by my solicitor. The court outcome was incredibly unfavourable. For him. He got the hump. Big style.

It was very unfortunate that after the hearing, the solicitor advised that I get rid of his stuff now because he was going to escalate (!).

And we couldn't be sure how badly, so I needed to take the initiative.

For completely non divorce issues, I was also having to deal with the police as I'd been a victim of an incidental crime and the pre-trial hearings were gearing up for that. So I got their advice incidentally...and that's how I learnt about women's aid (another story).

So I wrote (with solicitor's input) and gave him two weeks' notice to make arrangements to recover. I also (critically) asked him to list anything that he thought he might want above and beyond his clothes/gear. He listed a few high value items**, and I packed them without argument.

Unfortunately, the solicitor also sent him the bill for her services (court ordered for him to pay) on the same day. This genuinely was unfortunate and not something planned. Can't speak for solicitor - I merely paid her to speak for me!

I believe I got seven nasty emails about that. With even more stupid instructions. It was upsetting at the time - but something I actually do laugh about now. And I really regret not doing some of the things he told me not to do (like piss all over his clothes!)...but I was trying to be dignified at the time. And to be fair, his sister was going to be receiving them, and she's lovely and didn't need to be handling my piss!

So I sent him two quotes for 'man with van' and said 'pay one of them or I'll dump in a charity shop'.

He paid. I got several more nasty emails.

He got his belongings back all in one piece. Piss free.

I got several more nasty emails. And accused of theft. And wanton destruction. And other acts of spite.

At the time, I was trying to be reasonable. It was really bloody hard work, I can tell you.

So what should have been something really straightforward was a horrendous ordeal.

So the moral of my story is, no matter how 'decent' and 'reasonable' you try to be - if Melodramatic Man wants to make a song and dance about it, then you can be sure he will. Otherwise, he'll just collect his stuff on request.

**In the middle of the final hearing he started making allegations that I had denied him access to chattels - I already had it in writing what he'd asked for. The judge was happy that chattels had been dealt with appropriately. I kept all the chattels that he left behind. They were worth a lot more than I 'gave away'. I believe I have some nasty emails about that.

It sucks when you've got a clever lawyer who knows the system.

So, my advice is

a) politely request at first.

b) follow up with a reminder and a deadline. Make sure you ask if there's anything else he'd like.

c) then send a firm reminder and give a final deadline.

d) ignore all the shite.

e) hire a man with van/dump in charity shop. After all, that's his choice.

f) show judge (if necessary) how you dealt with it reasonably.

g) go home to your litter free house.

Izzie In terms of papers I was just going to put things like the V5 for his car, car insurance certificate, paper driving licence and that kind if thing in an envelope, there won't be much. He's got pay slips in a drawer, I might copy a recent one.

TBH most of the higher value re-saleable individual items in the house are what I'd consider to be his personal things, boys toys and gadgets, which I wouldn't stop him from taking but I might make a list in case I need it later. I suspect when we get into talking about a financial settlement his request to keep things friendly might go out of the window.

Today's real triumph was keeping cold turkey when I knew twunt was in town. I was horribly conflicted about how I felt. I know if I asked he'd have come to see me or gone out for coffee with me.

I had plenty of cast iron reasons to go see him and I knew where he was and that I'd be welcomed.

But I ignored my treacherous, foolish heart. I spent a couple of hours digging my vegetable garden, spent too much time on MN and got on with my life. Every time the phone rang I wondered if it was him, but I didn't feel horribly disappointed when it wasn't him.

He called on his way home and I kept it business like.

So my head triumphed over my heart. Why, considering how awful he's been, I should still be fighting the urge to see him, I don't know. In fact twice this week I've avoided seeing him, once when he'd been strongly encouraging me. However, I didn't contact him or see him. I listened to my rational mind.

A veritable triumph. God I'm tough! I can do this.

Thanks Izzie. I think MrsC is an inspiration. I'll keep crossing the days off until he's been exorcised.

I've also realised that I've been on and off anti depressants for years and he always said it was me...now I know it was his treatment of me. I also had a skin condition that the doctors were baffled by. It's gone!

Our bodies have to deal with all the stress they put us under and it has to come out somewhere.

With respect to the weird eating...I appear to be eating standing up a lot more. Just can't seem to sit down. I find myself standing in the kitchen looking out of the window eating the leftovers.

I took my girls to see 'sing a long a Frozen' this week and that night when I was putting my little one to bed she said to me..."Daddy just let us go". I bit my lip and promised that mummy would always be here. I then fell apart when I came downstairs. Some days I talk and talk to people but don't seem to get anything across and then my little girl can say it in a few words.

Going back to the packing thing, I noticed my ex took exactly what he wanted clothes wise and gadget wise, and gradually increased the amount of stuff he took. It was like he was deciding what he needed, and then was going to leave me with the rest. Anyway, one day I just bagged up the rest of his clothes and made him take the lot next time he called round. He really had the hump about it!

I've not bothered doing any more packing of his stuff. I have other things more pressing at the moment. Also I have nowhere to put it, so it just creates problems at the moment. I'm moving a lot of my own stuff around anyway. I suppose eventually a nice little area will evolve which will be the "take"pile. In fact, if I get those shelves done in the wardrobes, I would have the perfect place. Ooh a lightbulb moment!