You are not responsible for the rape or sexual assault you endured

[differentnameforthis]

In light of many threads about Ched Evans' & his victim & in light of those who believe she could have prevented it by being sober (!), I thought it was important to raise this issue.

It doesn't matter if you were drunk
It doesn't matter if you were alone
It doesn't matter if you got into a taxi/car/train/bus with him
It doesn't matter if you went to a room with him
It doesn't matter if you knew him
It doesn't matter if you didn't know him
It doesn't matter if you started to have sex with him & said no
It doesn't matter if you had sex with him an hour/a day/a week before
It doesn't matter if you had sex with his friend
It doesn't matter what you were wearing

YOU ARE IN NO WAY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE RAPE/SEXUAL ASSAULT YOU ENDURED.

We believe you

It would be ignorant to pretend that only men rape people.

Eh, no Aduaz, it would be legally correct to say only men rape people. Like it or not, under the law only men can rape people, seeing as rape involves a penis. Women can and do sexually assault men, however, you have to be a total idiot to think that the two problems are equal in scale.

Aduaz are you trying to imply that women commit serious sexual assaults as frequently as men?

If you are a man you are far more likely to be raped / seriously sexually assaulted by another man. Men make up 98% of sex offenders IIRC (not got link sorry).

When people try to divert from the atrocious and widespread baheviour of male sex offenders by saying oh but women do it to, I do wonder what their motive is.

I mean look at all the recent high profile cases. Rochdale, jimmy saville, the church, childrens homes. The perpetrators were all men. Can we not pretend that this isn't true please, all that does is remove focus from the problem here.

Which is often the intent. Talk about the victims behaviour. Talk about how women do it to. Do anything except put the spotlight on the male criminals who are doing it.

but aduaz that is purely the fault of the rapist. Not the victim.

So we have to change ourselves in order for rapists not be be able to rape?

No. I just can't get that.

Aduaz if you told your mum you had been raped and her response was maybe you shouldn't have been out alone drunk, then yes, that would be victim blaming and I don't for one nanosecond believe you would experience it as anything but that.

As for the problem of all those predatory women forcing men into unwanted sex - well, we're currently working on the one in four women being raped by a man issue. Once we've got that one sorted, we can move on.

Whenever someone tells me about something awful and traumatic that has happened to them, I always like to be ready with some handy advice for how I imagine they could have avoided it.

Luckily I don't often find myself in the situation where people come to me with their problems...

Well quite, everything.

If your child knows that, in the event they tell you they have been attacked, you will respond that they shouldn't have been x, y or z (because there's always going to be something they got "wrong" isn't there), then they are not going to tell you.

It's awful isn't it.
If it was a situation that most people recognise as rape, then the victim must have done something wrong.
If it's a situation that most people don't recognise as rape, then the victim is making it up or at least there has been a terrible misunderstanding.

Not all the time, with everyone, obviously, but enough to make it really difficult for victims to have their voices and experiences heard and taken seriously, and for society in general to point the finger of blame where it should be pointed.

"If it's a situation that most people don't recognise as rape, then the victim is making it up or at least there has been a terrible misunderstanding."

Maybe this should say "lots" of people rather than most as hopefully we are moving forward albeit slowly.

Looking at someone who is in pain and deciding to point out their "mistake" takes a special kind of arseholery IMO.

But I don't think thatms what mostly happens, cailin.

It's more that everyone offers support, but out of earshot the huddles of blame start.

"Well, I wouldn't say it to her, obviously, but you know..."

Thank you OP for this thread. Although it has totally depressed me.

I think one of the big problems here is the view that rapists rape because they are 'overwhelmed' by attraction for a woman who has 'led them on' and are therefore unable to control themselves. This is a shockingly poor view of men. I won't be raising my son to believe any of this crap. Nor will I be raising my daughter to believe that she consents to sex by doing anything other than saying yes. (And continuing to say yes throughout).

Raping is not normal male behaviour. It is not 'to be expected' in any scenario. No victim is to blame.

if you told your mum you had been raped and her response was maybe you shouldn't have been out alone drunk, then yes, that would be victim blaming
it would.
but if your mum said 'to be sure that you're safe, don't get drunk (and never go back to a drink you've left unattended) and don't be out alone, remember you can phone me anytime and i'll come and get you', that would be exercising caution.

but if your mum said 'to be sure that you're safe, don't get drunk (and never go back to a drink you've left unattended) and don't be out alone, remember you can phone me anytime and i'll come and get you', that would be exercising caution

You're wasting your breath Humble - the people who posts on these type of threads JUST DO NOT GET THIS. I really think the only way they would be satisfied is if all men were castrated at birth.

I really think the only way they would be satisfied is if all men were castrated at birth.

You think we can only stop men from raping by castrating them?

Oh, right, I get it.

It's the tiger thing again - you actually do think that men are like wild animals who can't control themselves or be trusted not to attack.

Well in that case, I understand why you don't think women should ever be out in public alone.

I do hope you'll make sure to tell your daughters that they're even more at risk at home if there is a man there.

Castrating men doesn't stop them raping. If they don't have a penis, they'll use something else. Women who rape women also use implements.

It was a figure of speech Everything

You will NEVER make EVERY man 'control' himself. Never. It is an impossible dream. In the meantime, keep safe out there.

I've been raped and I am teaching my daughter how best to keep herself safe.

It can't be 100% effective but it's worth educating her.

It's not victim blaming, as I certainly DON'T blame myself, but in the same way as I won't leave my house unlocked and rely on everyone in society to be good, I won't simply agree that we don't owe it to our daughters and sons to teach them to limit their risks.

All women know about the "don't get drunk" advice - they aren't idiots
So, if they all know the 'don't get drunk' advice, and they're not idiots, why are so many women drunk in public? Is that because they are intelligent, rational beings with strong sense of personal worth and confident expectations that their rights will be respected?

I was raped by my husband (more than once). I was drunk, naked, and lying in bed next to him. He raped me. Is this some sort of failure to protect myself? Did I, by my actions lead him on so he couldn't help it? I think not. He raped me because he is a rapist, not because I failed to protect myself.
This kind of rape is common, rarely reported and horrible, especially as the victim is told from all sides that it was her fault, by people spouting the same opinions about 'responsibility' and 'protecting ourselves' that some people here think is fine.

Jesus wept. I don't think all men need to be castrated because I have a bit more confidence in men than rape apologists on this thread. I believe men can and should refrain from raping women, it's not me arguing that they can't control their animal urges at the sight of a woman who has had a few.

But Humble, if your mum said that ("to be sure that you're safe....I'll come and get you"), that is a much wider proposition. A caution against crime in general, at least that's how I interpret that (and my parents did say this sort of stuff to me). It was not, however, because they thought I would be sexually assaulted or subject to any sexual crime necessarily. That is a wider point than we are talking about here. There certainly is nothing wrong in that.

Glabella

There is an enormous disconnect in some of the posts here which I find depressing. I don't know if it's because these people are hard of thinking or if they genuinely are rape apologists. I like to think it's the former in the majority of cases.

Can I ask a serious question (but which is nevertheless set in a ridiculous context, but bear with me): Imagine that women, en masse, decided tomorrow that they would all stop wearing clothes when going about their ordinary everyday business. So all women in all public places would be naked.

Do ChimesAndCarols and HumblePieMonster and Aduaz think that there would be more rapes and sexual assaults committed against women as a result?

Now imagine the situation is completely reversed. So men, en masse, go everywhere naked whilst women are fully clothed. Do the same posters think that there would be more sexual assaults on men as a result?

If your answer isn't the same to both questions, please ask yourself why it isn't.