Shocked at H's outburst

[Alwaysalone]

Name changed..

Yesterday, as we're driving away for our annual weekend away (our only holiday every year), with DC (aged 1 and 3) in the car, H and I had an argument. It was over something silly (H had strapped in DC without putting her shoes on, and I hadn't packed any spare). I blamed him for it. Then, very placid, extremely kind H (who has never shouted at me in the 7 years we've been married), told me to 'shut the fuck up' or he'd 'punch my face in'. To say I was shocked would be an understatement.. After crying the remaining journey (me, and the kids), he drive us back home and unpacked his bag only, then went up to bed. When I attempted to discuss what he said in the car, he ignored me. When I enquired how we move on from this, he said 'we don't'. When I enquired what he meant, he said 'go figure'..

I slept in the spare room last night. I just don't know what to think. I don't know why he's being like this. He told me once a few years ago that I moan at him too much (which I accept, I have 2 young girls who are a real handful), but however much I nag, how does that justify what he said to me? In front of our children too... My heart is literally broken.. It's like there is no moderation in his behaviour. He's either silent, or he over exaggerates at the smallest thing. He has NEVER threatened violence before. Once, 3 years ago when we had another row (again, over something small), he told me he'd had enough and wanted a divorce. He then apologised to me (rare), and said he didn't mean it. Can someone help me make sense of this? Was it my fault? What should I do? I'm just devastated.

He has a good job, excellent provider, great dad and generally, very good Husband. I just don't know if I can forget what he said to me. He called me melodramatic last night too.. Am I being melodramatic? I know it's ridiculous to think about it, but my mum is seriously ill with a heart condition, and I don't want to add to her problems (she is usually who I turn to in times of problems)..

Please help.

Sassy, how you use the OP's own words against her, but cherry-picking them. She accuses herself of being a nag and says that her mother mentioned that she was a bit like that with her husband, but you fail to give her credit for recognising this and trying not to be like that.

He, on the other hand, never complained until he finally exploded, is that a mature way of acting? He should have said something much earlier on and it is certainly not OP's fault not to have read his mind about the things he was unhappy about.

None of us are perfect but a marriage requires mature people who can say when they don't like something in a civilised way.

The aggression, stonewalling and failure to accept his own mistakes show that not only was he severely damaged by his upbringing but he also is incapable of accepting that and doing anything about it.

I thought the same as the minority right at the beginning of the thread but knew it was pointless saying anything due to some weird posts that crop up about apologists and other junk This clearly is a man who has had enough.

In that update he has communicated exactly how he's feeling and all the OP heard was she may get threatened again. So he does communicate just nobody's listening to him.

He has stepped over the line though and it's pretty clear this marriage is over.

all the OP heard was she may get threatened again

I'd say that's a pretty clear message he's giving and the most important for the OP.

Bit early to be writing! IMO you dont need to be hasty with your next actions as you arent in iminent danger so take some time to think.

stonewalling is abusive and soul
destroying. Lack of communication can or will destroy your marriage.

Did he make any valid points last night? E.g. How badly did you speak to him about the shoes? Did you call him stupid or an idiot?
Why can't he go to football?
Other things that spring to mind are, do you have friends with young children? You seem isolated.
And the thing about accusing you of fancying your BIL... sounds jealous and controlling.
There is so much going on here; hope you can resolve it in a way that leads to a happy life, with or without him.

Wildbill I don't quite get how it's all the OP's fault? For the sake of argument let's say she was horribly controlling (which I don't see at all) does her OH bear no responsibility for not addressing this before he got to the stage of swearing at her and threatening violence in front of their DC?

She has repeatedly said that she is prepared to look and amend her own behaviour, all he does is have an aggressive tantrum and the blame the OP, taking no responsibility at all!

It's quite clear this marriage is over.

I can't help but think of how I eventually snapped before leaving my ex husband after years of his controlling behaviour, put downs, verbal abuse etc.

The OP has said she realises her behaviour has sometimes been out of order. Why kick her when she's down? Whatever she has done, or not done, in the past there is no excuse for her husband to swear at her and threaten her with violence in front of small children. I'm staggered that anyone thinks that's acceptable, frankly.

Because, Waffle, "valid opposing view" is abuser apologetics.

No it's not! Why is it if posters don't always agree that this gets banded about!?

To me it sounds like it's you both need counselling. You both sounds incredibly unhappy. And this is just a symptom of him not being able to handle it anymore. Fwiw, my mum is a very nagging type and she also puts a lot of effort to plan everything. My dad is laid back and I'm the same. Couldn't see the problem with just missing some shoes. My dad is lovely and take a lot of my mums insult but once in a while he would have an outburst when he couldn't take it anymore. He would then go and sulk like taking the dog for a long walk. It is very unhealthy. We grew up thinking an argument was going to happen any time. And scared of it. I can't remember a family holiday without one of these arguments.

I found it mad you have full time help but only one weekend away. If it's best for your family then do it. But is it when he's so over work and you are not coping at home. I agree with the poster about have you thought about going back to work? I found full time is best for me because I know I'm not the most patient nurturing type, but maybe a part time would even give you some breathing space. And him too so he can take some leave?

I think if you want to save this, you both need to work on changing your situation.

Sunna People have said that it isn't acceptable even those with different views.

I too think this sounds like a man who has tried and tried and snapped. I think he is guilty of failing to communicate about his feelings and give OP a chance ('m sure there are reasons for that)

Regardless of the whys and wherefore this OP is devastated and desperately upset and support rather than a kicking would be helpful.

What he said is unforgivable and you need to agree your separation. It sounds like this would be the kindess thing for everyone

I don't think it's helpful in this situation to use call victim/abuser. They both sound like they have abusive qualities and they both sound like they have good qualities, and they both sound completely miserable and fed up. And both sounds like they could do with a proper break. I'm not surprised you are saying you feel like your husband is a stranger, you probably feel like a stranger to him too. That's not because he's always secretly been an 'abuser' it's because he can't cope anymore and it sounds like neither can you.

I feel really sorry for the kids. They had to listen to their mum get angry with dad (potentially more than once) then dad get angry and threaten violence to mum, mum cancels holiday, dad stonewalls for 3 days etc.

It's not helpful to say he's abusing her or she's abusing him. They BOTH need to apologise to each other and the kids.

You definitely need to separate at the moment because he is threatening violence, although it might not have to be forever depending on how husband deals with his issues. Always you have already admitted you have some stuff you need to work through and that's great I really do wish you well hopefully when the dust settles your husband will take responsibility for the serious issues he has to work through too.

Well said temporary.

And wildbill female, what could Op possibly have said about the shoes that was worse than. "STFU Or I'm going to punch your face in?"!!!

He's made it quite clear he has reached his breaking point. He should never have said what he did as no excuse but not surprised he snapped.

Constant put downs are wearing and for three years must feel like an eternity. Then not allowed to do hobbies yet you get to not work and have a full time helper to go to the park with but yet see nothing wrong. You say you argued a lot over being a SAHM but later amend that and to blame him for the second child is ridiculous. You both had sex, you were both responsible for the birth control.

It doesn't excuse his outburst but all this solely blaming him is wrong. It's not excusing his behaviour but seeing it from both sides.

It's clear he has had enough and wants out and you want out after his outburst so you now need to look at ways to work together over the split for the sake of the children.

Some people here are forgetting that while the OP may have nagged (and for this we don't know for sure, as it is often called nagging to ask someone repeatedly to do something they should - like pay attention to a child's food intolerance, FGS), he often snaps saying very hurtful things to her.

suddenly he'll just come out with the most insanely hurtful comment.

There is no need to hurt someone just for the sake of hurting. We can debate a point, say we are fed up, accuse others, but it doesn't sound good to me that he wants to hurt her. As he is now threatening with physical hurt. Twice already.

Regarding the nagging, this is what the OP wrote:
he keeps giving lactose intolerant dd2 cheese and onion crisps when he knows she's intolerant
he'll take a poorly dd out with a bad cold in just at shirt and shorts

I'd "nag" too about this. Most mums here probably would too. And dads. Would I deserve to be threatened with a punch?

What I get from the OP is that she is ready to acknowledge whatever part she played in the break up of her marriage but he is not! and has never been.
This suggests to me that here is one abuser here and it's not the OP.

In any case, he is not saying that he wants out. He's saying he wants to be in control. And that control means telling her he is going to hurt her if she doesn't comply.

At best he's very screwed up in his sense of duty or whatever in keeping a dead marriage alive. At worse he is capable of full on domestic violence eventually.
I don't see much hope in here. And I still believe that the best way is to separate and work on the relationship while separated if that is what both of you want.
I am giving him the benefit of the doubt here, or I'd have advised you to report his threats to the police.

I'm shocked that so many posters seem to think there is any excuse for threatening to punch someone in the face, and then telling them you can't guarantee you won't do it again. I genuinely wonder if it was your DDs facing such threats, if you would be justifying their DPs' actions.

I'd feel I had failed as a DM if my DS felt it was fine to threaten his DP like this.

The irony is that if this is an EA/DV situation then the OP's DP doesn't actually want to split up. He wants to maintain control. However I'm starting to think that even if the OP comes back with an update that follows the general EA/DV pattern there will still be posters falling over themselves to make it fit with their argument of 'misunderstood man at the end of his tether'.

I am genuinely surprised and saddened at just how much work still has to be done to educate people about EA and DV especially when we are all posting on a site that has great resources on both subjects.

oops - xposted with Lweji about the control issue.

I agree with Catseyes

There are so,e really depressing posts on this thread. I can't believe so many people are so quick to excuse this person's behaviour.

Good luck OP. You and your girls will be much better off not being exposed to this horrible excuse for a man.

No bookaboosue the problem here is that we don't know the full picture. What I can only see from a few posts is a deeply troubled marriage. Because of my own upbringing, I would be thinking the EA could be also from the wife to the husband, as I witnessed from my childhood. I just feel both sides need counselling to work through the issues as they are both miserable. Obviously we don't know if husband in this case is willing to work on it. Contacting someone like relate could be a good start.

This isn't an 'outburst'. This is a threat of potentially fatal violence, coupled with an ongoing promise that further threats of violence are always on the cards.

I am genuinely stunned that so many people are excusing the threat of violence so extreme it could kill someone on the basis that the husband was nagged. If he felt got at, he has had many opportunities to say he felt that way, that they as a couple were in danger of the marriage failing, that he wanted to separate because of the way he felt. He could have told the OP that he was feeling angry and needed to stop the conversation. Threatening to punch your wife in the face is not the only course of action to husbands who feel nagged.

Subsequent events have proved anyway that this was not the behaviour of a man at the end of his tether who snapped and is now filled with remorse. This is a man who has told his wife that he fully intends to menace her by holding the same threat over her indefinitely and that she will be at fault for any violence which comes her way. And that is abuse .

You have every right to grieve for what has been, and what should have been so it's no wonder you're in tears. Initially I thought this sounded like a "blip" for want of a better word, a one off, something (vile) said in the heat of the moment and regretted but it's obvious now that is not the case.

What is appalling to me is the fact that this has obviously been festering in him for a while, I can't believe he can suddenly feel like this, but he's been too cowardly to say anything to you.

I'm sure it doesn't seem like it, but at at least now you know where you stand and although the route you have to take is long and painful, it will take you to a better place, where you are right now is not where you should be.

I don't think one person has excused his behaviour, what he said was wrong but there are plenty who can't seem to see his viewpoint of the relationship.

Just because some people can see both sides doesn't mean they don't know anything about EA/DV Why only protect the DD's, do we not protect the DS's from EA too?

He needs to work on his anger and communication issues but the OP has a lot to work on too.

A woman told to stop her hobby, work twelve hour days even though they wanted to be at home more with the children, criticised for not doing things her partners way (given his comments about three years it's obviously not the crisp or yoghurt comment he's referring to) and paying for a member of staff to make a child's lunch and for company at the park would be told in no uncertain terms what her husband should be called and to LTB. If she snapped, how many would side with the DH. Not many I suspect.